Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: MillCreek on June 08, 2014, 03:22:19 PM
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Many years ago, I received a Black and Decker 14.4 Firestorm cordless tool kit, and it was good for light handyman work around the house. It uses 14.4 ni-cad batteries. The last battery out of four has died off, and I am pondering if it is time to move up to newer tech, such as a lithium rechargeable set.
Does anyone have any insights as to a good brand these days? This is going to be used for weekend DIY and I have come to see these tools and batteries as disposable after a few years, so I am thinking that I don't need a DeWalt or Makita contractor set. I would be looking for a drill, impact driver, circular saw and reciprocating saw.
I see that Kobalt, Porter-Cable, Ryobi, Rigid and Skil seem to be popular in the $ 300 or so price point that I am looking at.
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Lithium might be overkill for light weekend duty. At work our 20V DeWalt lithium impact guns would run about 6 hours before needing a battery swap while slinging together a greenhouse. Circular saws, on the other hand, only last about 40 minutes if you're cutting a lot.
NiMH kinda sits in the gap between NiCd and Lithium Ion.
If you were feeling adventurous you could rebuild the NiCd packs with NiMH cells. It's probably just a series of 12 AA buttonless batteries in there and NiCd chargers work just like NiMH.
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I was chatting with another guy at the bicycle club ride today, and he swears by the 18 volt lithium Ryobi system. He says that in addition to power tools, Ryobi has a line of lawncare tools that use the same battery pack. I have a 40 volt Ryobi lithium weedwhacker and edger that works really well for me, but the battery pack is so large and heavy that I bet they don't make power hand tools for that size of pack.
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I have a 15 year old Milwaukee 18 volt kit that has held up to abuse. Went through some batteries. You can get a cheap now and you can upgrade them to lithium . The battery connection matches
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Lithium might be overkill for light weekend duty.
No way. Battery lifespan is much longer in Li-ion batteries than Ni-Cd or Ni-MH in storage. I wouldn't even consider Nickel anymore.
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My neighbor convinced me to try lithium power tools. He was right, lithium rocks. I likely won't buy nicad or nimh again.
My go to cordless drill is a dewalt 20v model, it's been great!
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Unless you find a killer deal on used/discount table or are adding to a collection that take the same batteries go lithium. It's worth the extra couple of bucks in terms of use and future proofs it a little bit longer as it becomes more the go to standard.
Of the brands listed I'd go Porter Cable or Ryobi.
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Rigid all the way.
Last week they rebuilt my cordless drill, in its entirety. I'm pretty sure the only original parts I got back were the plastic housing pieces. New motor, switch, aperture, chuck, the works.
Cost of the work? Nada. For the second time. ( 8 year old drill)
Love the thing, and it shares batteries with a cordless impact, reciprocating and circular saws, big flashlight and radio.
Hell, first time I sent my drill in, they cleaned it, declared it fixed, and sent me a new battery, as that was what they determined the problem to be. all covered under warranty, in under a week.
You might say I'm a fan.
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Double tap
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I bought my daughter a 12V Milwaukee lithium drill/driver and 1/4" impact set for Christmas. It's small and light, but not too light. I was really impressed with how well the little impact works driving screws into hard wood w/o stripping out the phillips slots.
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Landlady's SO brought down his 3 peice set of 2 power drills and a power screw driver. They were Dewalt with lithium batteries that interchanged between all three tools. These were just the mini ones, for small projects and around the house.
I belive the same batteries will run a flashlight and some other tools.
We used them to build the porch deck and install four windows and a door.
If the little lithium battieries go as long as these suckers did, I imagine the big ones will really do some work.
Anyway, I was highly impressed with the Dewalts. We have a Black and Decker corded drill that has been pretty bullet proof as well, but the Black and Decker mini set (one battiry for multiple tools) that Eric has doesn't seem quite as hardy as the Dewalt set.
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I've been pleased with mu Ryobi 18+1 set. Recently made the transition to lithium. I have the sawsall, drill, hammer drill, jigsaw, leave blower, 1/4 impact, weedwacker, and hand vac. Don't bother with the hand vac and the jigsaw. The rest have been great. The 1/4 impact is my goto tool instead of a drill. Just get a good selection of bits.
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You are not buying a drill- you are buying batteries... check the replacement costs. I have a line of dead impact drivers and drills on my shelf-more specifically, dead Ni cad battery packs,-. . DeWalt, and Hitachi, mostly. Some I had rebuilt, they lasted a year or two. the tools are fine- I am just tired of buying batteries. So-
I just bought some lithium powered drills, drivers, etc- the advantage of Li ion batteries is they stay charged much longer when they are not being used. This is huge if the tool tends to sit for some time between uses.
I wish there was some way to convert the old ni cad packs to li ion- !
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Lithium might be overkill for light weekend duty. At work our 20V DeWalt lithium impact guns would run about 6 hours before needing a battery swap while slinging together a greenhouse. Circular saws, on the other hand, only last about 40 minutes if you're cutting a lot.
NiMH kinda sits in the gap between NiCd and Lithium Ion.
If you were feeling adventurous you could rebuild the NiCd packs with NiMH cells. It's probably just a series of 12 AA buttonless batteries in there and NiCd chargers work just like NiMH.
I have one of Home Despot's Ryobi 18V kits, the one that came in the big plastic table-saw cube stand on wheels. Table saw mounted to the top, circ saw (7.5"? Not a big one, by any means), reciprocating saw, drill, and flashlight inside, and it came with (IIRC) 1 NiMH battery and a charger. I ended up getting a LiIon charger and 2 batteries later. The LiIons last perhaps 10 minutes of near-continuous use in the reciprocating saw; rather longer in the circular or table saws and longer still in the drill.
Not the greatest set in the world. Having said that, I've owned it for most of 10 years now and it all still works.
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My 18 volt Dewalt kit is about a decade old and is still going strong (except for the original batteries).
It has the sawzall, small circ saw, light and hammer drill. I also own the small shop vac.
As has been pointed out, battery technology has progressed and lithium is the way to go.
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Lithium is definitely the way to go. I have an 18v Skil set that includes a drill/driver, palm sander, jigsaw, and a flashlight (long since tossed as it was a POS). The set came with a nicad, which worked well enough the first couple years, but then wouldn't hold a charge, meaning the tool wasn't available unless I planned ahead and charged the battery. It would work fine for most tasks when fully charged though. When I finally got frustrated with the battery, I bought a lithium upgrade rather than replacing the set because it had tools I wanted. Most other sets have circular saws, saber saws, etc, that I don't need in a cordless kit.
The new lithium battery is much lighter, charges faster, and holds a charge. It even has an indicator light to show me the current charge level. I need to pick up another battery or two so I don't have to swap batteries between the three devices.
Chris
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Screw it; I want gasoline powered tools until some mfr has the guts to make battery packs that can be refilled with bulk-purchased 18650s using no more specialized tooling than a #2 Phillips.
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I've been trying to decided between a cordless drill/saw combo or just buy a little gas generator .... =|
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I've been trying to decided between a cordless drill/saw combo or just buy a little gas generator .... =|
If you need the saw, get the generator.
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Screw it; I want gasoline powered tools until some mfr has the guts to make battery packs that can be refilled with bulk-purchased 18650s using no more specialized tooling than a #2 Phillips.
Here ya go (http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200331578_200331578)
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I've had this drill for 9 years and never a problem.
http://www.hitachipowertools.com/index/main-navigation/tools.aspx?d=2,21&p=512
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When I finally got frustrated with the battery, I bought a lithium upgrade rather than replacing the set because it had tools I wanted. Most other sets have circular saws, saber saws, etc, that I don't need in a cordless kit.
Chris
Please to be explaining. You just did a straight swap to Lithium and everything worked fine? Is it a newer set? I've been wanting to move my DeWalt 18V stuff to Lithium but am heavily invested in the NiCad set and didn't want to buy an entire new set while these tools still rock. I'd be totally down for just buying Lithium batts.
On the saws - I use the circular saw almost as much as I use the drill. Mostly up on the farm where it's nice not to have to drag a 100' of cable around or else a generator. I hate the flashlights that come with the kits. It seems that's just a way for the manufacturers to get an extra fifty bucks out of people for something worth five dollars IMO.
I also have an 18V Ryobi set a buddy got me for Christmas years ago. I've mostly just used the drill, but quality is very good. I mostly use my DeWalt stuff because I have more batteries for it, but keep the Ryobi kit because I would feel bad selling an Xmas present and the buddy would probably take it kinda hard if he visisted and the tools were gone.
I bought my dad a 14V Rigid drill probably going on 18 years ago now. Unbelievably, it's still on the original two batteries (I don't think it makes it more than 20min per charge anymore, but still). He actually uses it more than the DeWalt drill I keep up there because of the lighter weight. I'm super impressed with how well it's held out.
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I sprang for the Hitachi cordless Lithium Ion drill/flashlight kit from Lowes last year. Think I got it on sale for $99 or something. http://www.lowes.com/pd_300255-67702-DS18DSAL_0__?productId=1243875&Ntt=hitachi+drill&pl=1¤tURL=%3FNtt%3Dhitachi%2Bdrill&facetInfo=
Friend of mine has one. We used it to do some work on his house and I was very impressed with its power. The torque was enough to sprain my wrist once when I wasn't paying attention.
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If you need the saw, get the generator.
Yeah - the Stihl is okay on lumber but a little rough on plywood :lol:
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Yeah - the Stihl is okay on lumber but a little rough on plywood :lol:
Get a smaller kerf :rofl:
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Please to be explaining. You just did a straight swap to Lithium and everything worked fine? Is it a newer set? I've been wanting to move my DeWalt 18V stuff to Lithium but am heavily invested in the NiCad set and didn't want to buy an entire new set while these tools still rock. I'd be totally down for just buying Lithium batts.
Yup. I did have to buy a new charger (works for NiCad and Lithium batteries), but on the tool side, the batteries are interchangeable. I got the tools on sale 6-7 years ago and paid about $50 for the set. Lithium was an optional upgrade at the time, but I used the NiCad until it wore out.
Chris
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Yup. I did have to buy a new charger (works for NiCad and Lithium batteries), but on the tool side, the batteries are interchangeable. I got the tools on sale 6-7 years ago and paid about $50 for the set. Lithium was an optional upgrade at the time, but I used the NiCad until it wore out.
Chris
Awesome- thanks! I'm off to Amazon to get one right off the bat. Then I can start swapping as the NiCads wear out. Sweet.
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My 30-yo Makita 9.6V cordless drill still works great. I did have to replace the original battery 5 or 6 years ago. I also have a more modern variable-speed Makita 9.6V that uses a different style NiCad battery but the same charger. If I ever need to buy batteries again, I hope to change-over to NiMH.
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Based on the input here, chatting with other knowledgeable people, reading reviews and making lunch-time runs to Lowe's and Home Depot, I ended up with this: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Ryobi-ONE-18-Volt-Lithium-Ion-ULTIMATE-Combo-Kit-6-Tool-P884/203466936 at $ 325 out the door.
For the price point I was looking for, this kit gave me the largest number of acceptable-quality tools, two of the latest-generation batteries, an intelligent charger, and at a savings compared to buying the tools piecemeal. A bonus was the large number of other power and lawn tools that take the same battery pack. The Rigid did not have the tools I was looking for and the Ryobi seemed better quality than the Kobalt and Porter-Cable sets. I lusted after the DeWalt large combo set, but could not justify my needs as needing a $ 600 tool kit.
I have much better hopes for the lithium battery packs as opposed to the NiCad packs that go bad just sitting there, even with periodic charging.
PS: The HD associate told me that Ryobi is a sister company of Rigid and makes the cordless power tools under that name as well. I was surprised that Rigid had so little in the way of combo kits, then.
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FYI, two things that kills lithium batteries are heat and running them completely dead:
Above body temp is too warm, let it cool down and use a different pack.
Drain them below a certain threshold and they will never be the same again.
Long term storage is best with about half to 2/3 charge on them. They also don't need to be fully charged every time, they have no memory.
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries (http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries)
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Man, I cannot believe that I made to my mid 50's before I discovered impact drivers and what they can do. Amazing.
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Man, I cannot believe that I made to my mid 50's before I discovered impact drivers and what they can do.
Do you really need that many bolts snapped off?
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Do you really need that many bolts snapped off?
Millcreek is referring to the (I presume) 1/4" drive battery-power impact driver, not a monster air tool.
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^^^ Exactly. It works so much better than a driver/drill.
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1/4 inch impacts rule. Get the mega bit set and you will be looking for a project just so you can use the impact.
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1/4 inch impacts rule. Get the mega bit set and you will be looking for a project just so you can use the impact.
Oh, so I'm not supposed to use the 110V impact and a stack of adapters to tighten scope mounts?