Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Ben on December 12, 2023, 11:32:09 AM
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Ten minutes of wayback machine:
https://youtu.be/bSALd6keJNo
We've covered some of these here before, but a few got me thinking.
1) I still remember our phone number (and address) from when I was a kid, as well as my best friend's number from when I was ten. I have to think about my own damn number when someone asks these days, and I have no idea what my sister's number is. Somehow I do remember my parents' last phone number, but I think they got that one just before the little Motorola tank cell phones came out.
2) Discussed here before, but bears repeating as it's an absolutely useful, if not essential skill that many of us have lost. Finding your way without Google nav. I still recall laying out maps for a trip, finding the best and alternate routes, and writing down exits, turns, etc. to have handy for the trip. Even going somewhere new in town, I would check the city map and then just remember where to go, where to turn, etc. After the first trip, I would just remember how to get to the place.
Now there are places that I go on a regular basis, and even if I've been there ten times, I still end up firing up the nav to remind me of the right exits and upcoming turns. I used to be an excellent navigator. Now I suck. I suppose being good again would be like riding a bicycle - keep the nav off and just use maps again. This is definitely not a boomer skill though - it's something everyone should be competent at as a fallback. I don't even keep local maps in my vehicle anymore though, which I should rectify. I keep downloaded maps on my phone for getting to my fishing spots and stuff, but a big paper map can be more useful than scrolling around for a big picture view.
3) The typewriter segment is more than a typewriter. The point about "doing it right the first time or else starting all over again" is valid. I was overjoyed when word processors came out, but there is something to be said for, instead of quickly but constantly correcting errors, getting your brain to focus on details and doing it right (or write) the first time. I know the difference between "there" and "their", but I constantly, in informal writing, ignore proofreading and often write them wrong. I'm pretty sure I did that much less when I was boomer writing by hand or via typewriter. Home computers didn't come out in force until after I was out of High School, so I still remember handwriting or typing long ass reports in school.
4) Using the card cabinet or "looking stuff up alphabetically" kind of threw me. I'm wondering - do young people, much like not knowing how to write cursive or how to use a rotary phone, not "think alphabetically"? I'm wondering if this is one of those "the internet and technology are rewiring brains" things.
5) Do all cars now come with power windows? I thought base stuff, like stripped work pickups, still come with manual windows.
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My boss has a newish jeep. It is manual everything including the windows and door locks. He said he was a bit upset it still came with a key-fob start.
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I have normally been able to find my way to a place I have been before. I didn't always memorize street names, more of a visual memory. I guess if you are not paying attention to all the details it doesn't stick in the memory quite the same.
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I guess if you are not paying attention to all the details it doesn't stick in the memory quite the same.
I think that's a big part of it. With the nav, I'm generally inattentive until it says "in one mile...". When I go places without nav, for me, landmarks are a big deal. I'll remember some buildings or features along the way that tell me where I am and what's coming up next. With nav, I think I ignore landmarks.
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Cars? I still miss those vents in the front windows.
About two years ago I got two extra keys for my car, went to the dealer parts dept, showed my reg, gave them my key, asked for two more, about $8.00 apiece. Heh.
Had a fender bender, insurance adjuster needed my key, gave it to him, and then he realized he didn't have to turn the car on to read the mechanical odometer. Heh.
Yes, I still remember my childhood phone number, FLushing 3-nnnn, no area code back then. Wierd because I'm getting pretty forgetful of other everyday things. I do get lost sometimes because they seem to keep changing street names, turn directions, exit names, etc., from the ones I've been used to for years.
Oh, and I still have my draft card. Well, they said to keep it... Just looked at it on the 'puter. Jeez, 158 lb. Holy crap.
Terry... scrolls up to check his screen name... oh, yeah, 230RN
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Driving a manual is still a valuable skill and is still a connection to the car.
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I miss the Thomas map books.
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Driving a manual is still a valuable skill and is still a connection to the car.
My Jeep is a 6 speed manual. I don't remember a time when I didn't have at least 1 manual in the stable. I made both my kids learn how to drive a stick before I would let them get their drivers license. I also required them to be able to change a tire.
Had a kind of sad interaction with my brother on our trip to Iowa. I handed him my phone which had google maps navigation running and asked him to check something for me. He didn't know how to use it and managed to fat finger it and shut it off. Seemed proud to tell me that he didn't use his Samsung smart phone for things like that or email or internet or fecesbook as if that made him some how superior to those of us that do. Mostly I suspect he wasn't tech savvy enough to figure it out.
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Skills are wealth, we should accumulate as many as possible.
Form and finish concrete, frame walls and rafters, butcher an animal, start a fire in the rain, back up a trailer (try it with 2 hay wagons!), drive a manual transmission, jump start a dead battery, change a flat tire, replace a bad circuit breaker, weld anything metal, sweat copper pipe,
Read an anolog clock, read cursive writing, etc
Etc
Etc
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How about using a compass?
Heck I've met people who have no idea what north, south, east, or west even are
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Skills are wealth, we should accumulate as many as possible.
Form and finish concrete, frame walls and rafters, butcher an animal, start a fire in the rain, back up a trailer (try it with 2 hay wagons!), drive a manual transmission, jump start a dead battery, change a flat tire, replace a bad circuit breaker, weld anything metal, sweat copper pipe,
Read an anolog clock, read cursive writing, etc
Etc
Etc
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.”
― Robert A. Heinlein
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Driving a manual is still a valuable skill and is still a connection to the car.
Saw a bumper sticker: "REAL cars have THREE pedals ! :
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How about using a compass?
Heck I've met people who have no idea what north, south, east, or west even are
Don't usually need a compass around here. Mountains = West. The problem I have is with nitty-gritty things that I mentioned.
But you're right about knowing the directions. When I refer to my "east (or west) bedroom" some people, even other building residents, get confused. It's pretty rare that I'm someplace I don't know where north is.
I remember some German visitors in downtown Denver all confused about directions because a large part of downtown Denver's streets are rotated about 45 degrees to follow the river instead of N-E-S-W streets I helped them out with my broken German (which was a lot better in those days) and they were very grateful when I got their map oriented with the geography.
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Don't usually need a compass around here. Mountains = West. The problem I have is with nitty-gritty things that I mentioned.
But you're right about knowing the directions. When I refer to my "east (or west) bedroom" some people, even other building residents, get confused. It's pretty rare that I'm someplace I don't know where north is.
I remember some German visitors in downtown Denver all confused about directions because a large part of downtown Denver's streets are rotated about 45 degrees to follow the river instead of N-E-S-W streets I helped them out with my broken German (which was a lot better in those days) and they were very grateful when I got their map oriented with the geography.
I have a lovely compass I always wanted and now never use. Tritium vials and all. I should be better at land nav but my mental maps are very precise yet skewed. I always did the mountain equals west thing but in the mid Atlantic piedmont it's actually southwest to northeast. Then I moved into Appalachia proper where it's mountains mountains everywhere. I still contend that if you get lost in the eastern US Darwin wanted you dead anyway. The people are downhill and downstream. As for Google maps I love street view for the last two miles. I look before I go, the several thousand miles in between are on me to have a general sense of geography.
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Driving a manual is still a valuable skill and is still a connection to the car.
Not exactly a "manual" but the 2011 Elantra I own can side-step the gear shift and allow you to manual shift the automatic tranny. It helps when your stuck and can keep the tranny locked into 1st or 2nd until your free - without spinning the tires.
I miss my 1982 Toyota 4WD p/u. =(
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My 2012 Subaru Forester had an auto stick. I think I used it twice.
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Saw a bumper sticker: "REAL cars have THREE pedals ! :
My great uncle's pickup (early '50s Chevy something), had (IIRC) 4. One was something to do with the magneto, related to starting.
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My 67 Mustang had 4
The 4th was the windshield washer
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My great uncle's pickup (early '50s Chevy something), had (IIRC) 4. One was something to do with the magneto, related to starting.
Original equipment on those had a floor button to the right of the gas pedal for the mechanical linkage for the starter.
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Three on the tree.
Brad
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Three on the tree.
Brad
That's how I learned to drive. My dad started me in parking lots and country roads when I was around 13. Ford F100, three on the tree, manual everything. Those old manual steering wheels were good workouts. :laugh:
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I originally learned to drive with a standard when I was a teenager. These days I wouldn't mind going back to it just for the hell of it. I don't want to get into a new truck right now, but it is tempting.
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1) I still remember our phone number (and address) from when I was a kid, as well as my best friend's number from when I was ten.
2) Finding your way without Google nav.
3) I know the difference between "there" and "their"
4) Using the card cabinet or "looking stuff up alphabetically" kind of threw me. I'm wondering - do young people, much like not knowing how to write cursive or how to use a rotary phone, not "think alphabetically"? I'm wondering if this is one of those "the internet and technology are rewiring brains" things.
5) Do all cars now come with power windows? I thought base stuff, like stripped work pickups, still come with manual windows.
1) Same. The old rural interchange is gone now and parents are on an area interchange which went in when the system converted to fiber. For some cosmically redundant reason, I also remember the phone number from when I worked at Radio Shack. That was 35 years ago.
2) Ah, the days of gas station giveaway maps. Dad still has a bunch of them in his desk drawer, some dating back to Route 66 days. If they weren't in such awful shape they would probably be serious collectables. Up until I moved after getting married, I had a giant stack of DeLorme Atlas and Gazetteers I would spend hours poring over. Still spend that time, but it's on Google Maps.
3) Sure, but what about the difference between "he" and she"?
4) A fair number of twenty somethings are unable to do simple math without a calculator, sort without Excel, or know the relationship of cardinal directions. I see it every day.
5) At some point, it becomes more cost effective on a net basis for all vehicles in a model line to get the same mechanism even though a particular option might be significantly cheaper on a per unit basis. If only five percent of your vehicles sell with the cheaper outfitting, the cost of R&D, tooling, and production of the cheaper option outweigh the extra unit cost of universally applying the more expensive option. It also enhances overall production efficiency, streamlines logistics, and simplifies repair parts supply.
Brad
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One nice thing about Google maps is that I was able to use on my laptop to plot our yearly trip from home to southwest Florida using old state, federal and county roads to avoid the interstate mess. I then wrote each daily route down on notes to put in the car for reference. I got to really enjoy our up to 3 to 4 day drive, depending how many miles i wanted to do each day..
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My great uncle's pickup (early '50s Chevy something), had (IIRC) 4. One was something to do with the magneto, related to starting.
I had a car with a foot switch starter, might have been my "college car," a 1950 Plymouth. The swtch only activated the starter solenoid coil to throw the starter into gear with the engine and then closed the heavy-duty contact from battery to starter motor. Like a big-assed relay.
Can't remember for sure which car it was. I started with road cars* with three on the column, where reverse and first gear were in opposite positions so you could "rock" the car back and forth to break free of mud or snow or whatever.
Terry, 230RN
* I actually started with a '29 Ford pickup which we stored out on Long Island and I could drive it around the property. I remember it had a spark advance/retard and another lever for something (idle?) on the steering column but I don't remember the shifting gear positions. That one was crank-started and had a gravity fuel feed. I don't think they were called "pickups" then, something like "station" trucks or whatev.
Talk about your pre pre pre boomer useless skills!
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I remember it had a spark advance/retard and another lever for something (idle?) on the steering column
Hand throttle.
Brad
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The last car I had with a switch on the floorboards was my 1977 Ford Maverick. The high beam switch was operated with the left foot.
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How about some of the early 80s Fords where you sounded the horn by pushing in the turn signal stalk
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I miss the Thomas map books.
oh man, those were great, I think I am going to start looking for them online ... I never use my phone-every time I do I end up screaming at it.
If I am going to go someplace I never been, I will look for maps. Modern maps are terrible.
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* I actually started with a '29 Ford pickup which we stored out on Long Island and I could drive it around the property. I remember it had a spark advance/retard and another lever for something (idle?) on the steering column but I don't remember the shifting gear positions. That one was crank-started and had a gravity fuel feed. I don't think they were called "pickups" then, something like "station" trucks or whatev.
Talk about your pre pre pre boomer useless skills!
Are you sure about the year? That sounds more like a model T which ended early 1927. (I had a late model T April 1927) Maybe a truck or Depot Hack. The Model A first year edition was 1928 and didn't have a spark adv or mounted crank start (had a socket and cover for one) but had a hand throttle linked to the foot throttle. The shifting on the T was actually the left side foot pedal, down for low and up/off for high UNLESS the handbreak was halfway back which let it into neutral when the pedal was released. My memory is challenged but middle pedal might have been reverse and right brakes.
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Are you sure about the year? That sounds more like a model T which ended early 1927. (I had a late model T April 1927) Maybe a truck or Depot Hack. The Model A first year edition was 1928 and didn't have a spark adv or mounted crank start (had a socket and cover for one) but had a hand throttle linked to the foot throttle. The shifting on the T was actually the left side foot pedal, down for low and up/off for high UNLESS the handbreak was halfway back which let it into neutral when the pedal was released. My memory is challenged but middle pedal might have been reverse and right brakes.
Maybe that'sa how come I can't remeber how the shifting worked.
I can't guarantee any of the details, this was in about ~1950 and I was 10 or 11 years old. The "1929" is stuck in my head. My father used the truck in his plumbing business and it kind of hung around out on "The Island" for decades until my mother insisted it was an eyesore. I have a sidewise picture of the front end of it in about ~1942. The picture is of my sister holding me as a baby and the truck just partially shows up, not much detail. I do remember that somehow I started a small brush fire with it on the LI (Long Island) property, but we quickly put it out. It definitely had a crank on it, my father showed me how to "set" the handle before kicking it over, but it sure was hard for this little twerp to start it, and Pop got worried I would break an arm, so he did it.
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Jump starting a vehicle is a sure one. Did this several times lately. The younger set doesn't really know how this works. Like once I get it started don't turn your car back off immediately. Like don't turn it off at all until you are safely home.
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One comment I heard yesterday on another show talked about home ownership. Once you own a home, you realize pretty fast that anytime you have to bring someone in to do something, it costs significant money. So anything you can do yourself is money in your pocket. Whether it is a sheetrock patch, installing a dishwasher, etc..
I guess the same thing can be said for car ownership.
Perhaps part of the problem is too many people see these things as a black box they can't touch without a professional. Professionals have their place, but there are a lot of small repairs that come up that don't take a lot of skill to do, but would end up costing a lot calling someone in.
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oh man, those were great, I think I am going to start looking for them online ... I never use my phone-every time I do I end up screaming at it.
If I am going to go someplace I never been, I will look for maps. Modern maps are terrible.
The Thomas Guide company now only publishes a map book for LA and Orange County. As an alternative, I now carry in the truck the DeLorme Atlas and Gazetteer for Washington. It is better than nothing, but if anyone knows of another paper alternative, please let me know.
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One comment I heard yesterday on another show talked about home ownership. Once you own a home, you realize pretty fast that anytime you have to bring someone in to do something, it costs significant money. So anything you can do yourself is money in your pocket. Whether it is a sheetrock patch, installing a dishwasher, etc..
I guess the same thing can be said for car ownership.
Perhaps part of the problem is too many people see these things as a black box they can't touch without a professional. Professionals have their place, but there are a lot of small repairs that come up that don't take a lot of skill to do, but would end up costing a lot calling someone in.
Totally agree!
Call an electrician to change a light fixture or an outlet. $$$
Or a plumber to change a toilet valve.
I have a brother in law that pays an HVAC guy to change his air filters.
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How about doing math in your head or even on paper anymore?
Yeah I know, paper? What's that?
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I have a brother in law that pays an HVAC guy to change his air filters.
There's just something majorly wrong with that IMHO and I don't care how much money he may have.
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There are very few things that I won't tackle in a home.
HVAC since I have a heat pump is one of them.
Replacing a dishwasher or water heater? Done that multiple times.
Replacing a roof? Done that.
Replacing windows? Done that.
Installing various types of flooring? Done that.
Electrical? Depending on what needs to be done, I'll do that, as well.
That said, I'm more willing to pay for stuff now that I'm older. I paid for a new roof a few years ago. I paid for new siding. I paid for new windows. Those are things that I have the skill to do, but I no longer have the time, and worse, now that I'm older, I no longer have the stamina.
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I've not found anything short of a few very specialized issues that I can't do myself better and cheaper. In the past I was loath to pay for services, either for financial reasons or the pride of doing it myself. Now we're at a place where we can afford to enjoy a few fruits of our labors, so we do. There are still a few things I refuse to hire out, but more and more we're hiring it done simply because I don't want to mess with it.
Brad
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Yeah, I grew up in a shop, fixing things from age 6 to present. I typically loathe working on road vehicles but when you see what dealers are charging for simple work that's why I'm doing brake jobs in an unheated garage.
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I don't have a lot of time to work on the house, and my body's starting to rebel against doing a lot of things, so I end up hiring folks to do some of the work around here.
Which pisses me off for a couple reasons:
1) I don't like spending my hard earned money for someone to do something I could have done
2) I typically end up doing some of the work myself. Seems like none of the companies I can find around here (with one exception*) just can't or won't do quality work. They normally show up while I'm at work, by the time I get to inspect their work they've been paid and won't return my calls. So, I end up finishing the job.
*The company that installed the new HVAC unit was/is fantastic. There was only one problem after they installed the new, larger (5 ton vs the old 4 ton) - the higher pressure of the new system blew the crossover line off one end. They came out the day we had the problem, diagnosed and repaired it at no charge.
As far as using a map, I taught map reading/navigation in high school (Cadet Corps). Learned driving in a '60 F100 w/3 on the tree, dirt roads going to the dump, later working on a ranch. Still trying to learn Google maps - too much to do while driving. I'd rather print out the route and look for exits/landmarks.
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Totally agree!
Call an electrician to change a light fixture or an outlet. $$$
Or a plumber to change a toilet valve.
I have a brother in law that pays an HVAC guy to change his air filters.
My maternal grandfather remarried after grandma died.
He married a psychologist.
She would hire an electrician to change burned out light bulbs.
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I have normally been able to find my way to a place I have been before. I didn't always memorize street names, more of a visual memory. I guess if you are not paying attention to all the details it doesn't stick in the memory quite the same.
That can be a problem.
True story.
I was visiting family in Chicago, and driving to a cousin's with my mother in the front seat and her sister - my aunt, of course - in back. Auntie was giving me directions. At one point, she said "Turn left by that red building."
I don't see a red building.
Auntie leans over the seat and points "Right there, that red building!"
I still don't see a red building. Auntie slaps the back of my head. This goes through a couple of cycles, Auntie gets louder, the slaps get harder.
Finally, I said "Auntie, I'm sorry, I don't see a red building, you just keep pointing to a green building over there."
A moment of silence . . . "WELL, IT USED TO BE RED! (SLAP!)" :rofl:
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I miss the Thomas map books.
Ye gods and little fishies, I don't.
I don't at all miss squinting at the map to find the 1/4 inch section of tiny road off the 1/2 inch section of not quite so tiny street at oh-dark-thirty while my partner is driving like a bat out of hell and most of the illumination is coming as reflection from the strobes off the buildings we're driving past. The map lights in our rigs were garbage, either way too bright and affected our ability to see outside, or so dim as to be useless.
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Before we moved away from my grandparents, my Grandfather used to take me out on the back roads near town and sit me on his lap behind the steering wheel. I was between 5 & 9 y.o. and couldn't reach the pedals, he just let me steer. These roads were two lanes and narrow (circa 1960) but he taught me how to drive that way,
The car was a dark green with both the front and rear windshields (IIRC) having vertical splits with chrome strips covering the seams and I'm guessing at least 10 years old (circa 1950).
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Original equipment on those had a floor button to the right of the gas pedal for the mechanical linkage for the starter.
Very well could be that. I could very well be misremembering. That great uncle died in the mid-'60s. Dad had the truck for a while, then got something more modern and sold the older truck to a neighbor kid. He kept using it. Last seen, I dunno, '90s some time.
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Here in Metro Washington, DC, the big one was the ADC map book.
It was good. Good scale, good idex, was relatively easy to read, but it just could never come even remotely close to keeping up with the building that was going on around here.
I used to have one for DC, then I had one for Northern Virginia when I moved here. No clue when I got rid of the last one.
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Ye gods and little fishies, I don't.
I don't at all miss squinting at the map to find the 1/4 inch section of tiny road off the 1/2 inch section of not quite so tiny street at oh-dark-thirty while my partner is driving like a bat out of hell and most of the illumination is coming as reflection from the strobes off the buildings we're driving past. The map lights in our rigs were garbage, either way too bright and affected our ability to see outside, or so dim as to be useless.
I feel your pain. Because of my relative youth when I started the EMT and then paramedic thing, the insurance company did not want me driving the rig unless absolutely necessary. So I got to be the navigator and primary patient care. I always wondered why the insurance company did not have a problem with that.