Author Topic: Anti-bully program trains better bullies  (Read 10928 times)

AZRedhawk44

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Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« on: October 09, 2013, 04:48:36 PM »
http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2013/10/08/are-anti-bullying-programs-having-an-opposite-effect/

Duh, ya think?

Bullies now learn how to bully on social media whereas they only thought to do it when the prey was directly in front of them before.

Bullies learn mistakes that get other bullies caught, and what NOT to do when bullying so that there are no consequences.

South Park's "Butt Out" episode also comes to mind:  Adults trying to tell kids that something is forbidden AND not cool usually results in an increase of that behavior.
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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2013, 05:01:19 PM »
*snort*

The risk (punishment) needs to outweigh the reward (bullying), and the prevention is making sure the kids know you will follow through on the punishment.

Of course, that's an entirly too simple concept to use when raising kids.
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SADShooter

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2013, 05:06:31 PM »
*snort*

The risk (punishment) needs to outweigh the reward (bullying), and the prevention is making sure the kids know you will follow through on the punishment.

Of course, that's an entirly too simple concept to use when raising kids.


Beyond being the wrong approach in a no-fault, everybody's-a-victim, consequence-free society.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2013, 05:39:09 PM »
kids grade school has a new program to get adult men to sign up for 1 day a year to hang out at the school its called watchdogs. i'll let you know how it works out.
http://www.fathers.com/watchdogs
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Scout26

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2013, 05:43:17 PM »
From my experience, the one and only thing that ended Bullying was a good sock in puss.

Here's another technique:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isfn4OxCPQs
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2013, 06:11:44 PM »
From my experience, the one and only thing that ended Bullying was a good sock in puss.

Here's another technique:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isfn4OxCPQs

Young ones are still subject to voice control. Was on a field trip and two of my lil heathens were headed for bush parole I was 60 yards away when I bellowed " don't even think about it!" In my best voice. My two froze and reversed course and when I turned around so had the other 225 kids. The mommies remarked on how the kids responded very differently to a mans voice as opposed to a women's . It was eye opening to me


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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roo_ster

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Re: Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2013, 06:30:35 PM »
The roo_ster family anti bullying program include being nice to the other kids, but if any of them attempt to hurt roo_ster kiddos to hit back as hard as possible and hurt the instigator, eve if they do not "win" the encounter. 

Parents of a couple bullying kids back in kgn and 1st were horrified when we told them our kiddos folowed through on our instructions and were getting an ice cream cone after the parent teacher meeting.

Whatever, the bullying stopped and by 3rd grade, the two bullys have been marginalized and hang out only with each other.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2013, 06:35:55 PM »
The roo_ster family anti bullying program include being nice to the other kids, but if any of them attempt to hurt roo_ster kiddos to hit back as hard as possible and hurt the instigator, eve if they do not "win" the encounter. 

Parents of a couple bullying kids back in kgn and 1st were horrified when we told them our kiddos folowed through on our instructions and were getting an ice cream cone after the parent teacher meeting.

Whatever, the bullying stopped and by 3rd grade, the two bullys have been marginalized and hang out only with each other.
when my oldest was 3 she walked up to the bully at daycare and punched him right in the belly button . No warning. Right in front of the teacher. Then said "daddy told me too. He stopped bullying my kid and the others too.


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

Boomhauer

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2013, 06:44:27 PM »
Quote
The roo_ster family anti bullying program include being nice to the other kids, but if any of them attempt to hurt roo_ster kiddos to hit back as hard as possible and hurt the instigator, eve if they do not "win" the encounter. 

One of the things I learned quickly in school was that you loose absolutely nothing by fighting back and gain a lot, simply because you are going to be suspended anyway for daring to be a victim even if you do not resist at all. Fight back at least you gain the satisfaction of evening the score...



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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2013, 07:39:51 PM »
Well, apparently the kids (all of the rat bastards. It sucks being the lowest of the socially low in middle school) I went to school with didn't get this memo.

After being tortured all year, I ended up wailing on one of the instigaters with drumsticks.
Just made it worse. =|
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2013, 11:04:59 PM »

After being tortured all year, I ended up wailing on one of the instigaters with drumsticks.


You can't wail on anything with drumsticks, except drums.  Not enough mass.

Get yerself a hammer next time. ;)
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seeker_two

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2013, 11:15:44 PM »
In my youth, I discovered that every bully had an "OFF" switch...usually found in the nose of the bully. With enough pressure applied, it turned the bully right off....

...I intend to teach my daughter that same lesson....

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brimic

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2013, 08:17:10 AM »
Quote
Quote


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The roo_ster family anti bullying program include being nice to the other kids, but if any of them attempt to hurt roo_ster kiddos to hit back as hard as possible and hurt the instigator, eve if they do not "win" the encounter. 

Parents of a couple bullying kids back in kgn and 1st were horrified when we told them our kiddos folowed through on our instructions and were getting an ice cream cone after the parent teacher meeting.

Whatever, the bullying stopped and by 3rd grade, the two bullys have been marginalized and hang out only with each other.

We ran the same program with my son with the same results.

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HankB

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2013, 09:42:54 AM »
I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the new definition of bullying - when I was a kid, being a bully meant intitiating physical violence - verbal stuff was irrelevant and unimportant. ("Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me.")

The best response to physical force is more physical force.

That so much is being made about words suggests that, as a country, we're making sure we raise a generation of wimps. Evidence is that schools will punish the target of physical bullying who fights back as much - if not more - than the bully himself.
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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2013, 09:51:16 AM »
Quote
Evidence is that schools will punish the target of physical bullying who fights back as much - if not more - than the bully himself.

They have actually long since graduated to if a bully attacks you and you do not fight back you are punished as if you fought back. Yes, I am serious. Happened to me, even (first time I was attacked, the bully knocked me on the ground from behind. I got up and one of his buddies knocked me down again before I could fight back). They suspended me for three days too.




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brimic

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2013, 09:52:39 AM »
Quote
Evidence is that schools will punish the target of physical bullying who fights back as much - if not more - than the bully himself.

Sometimes....
I've found that teachers patrolling the playgrounds have the attitude like "I didn't see nutttin"- whether its the bully doing the bullying or the bully getting his nose bloodied.
"now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb" -Dark Helmet

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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2013, 10:22:31 AM »
I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the new definition of bullying - when I was a kid, being a bully meant intitiating physical violence - verbal stuff was irrelevant and unimportant. ("Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me.")

The best response to physical force is more physical force.

That so much is being made about words suggests that, as a country, we're making sure we raise a generation of wimps. Evidence is that schools will punish the target of physical bullying who fights back as much - if not more - than the bully himself.

I remember one fight I got into in middle school in 1991 or 92, some kid decided he wanted to beat on me so he got a big circle of people to hem me in and he started throwing punches.  I blocked every one of them (2 years of karate at this point) and controlled the fight pretty well, not throwing a single attack back at him.  I figured it would be less than a minute until a teacher came along and broke up the fight.

Sure enough it gets broken up, and I'm all high on life because I didn't get hit once and I did "the right thing" by not fighting.  We're marched down to the principal's office and that fat bastard gives us both the same punishment.

I made sure to tell him that the next time I get drawn into a fight, he's going to need an ambulance for the other kid and I expect both of us to get the same punishment after all is said and done.  The look on his face was priceless. >:D

My kids are going to get trained to hit hard and keep hitting hard until they can leave the attacker on the ground.
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brimic

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2013, 10:33:22 AM »
Quote
My kids are going to get trained to hit hard and keep hitting hard until they can leave the attacker on the ground.

What's even more effective is grappling/judo reap/sweep/throw followed up with a submission leg/arm/head lock.
Leaves less marks/evidence and is much more humiliating to bully. Pick one or two and practice, practice, practice.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2013, 11:20:15 AM »
and teach it to a cute lil girl? i pity some folks in school with my youngest. she spars with me and has started hitting hard.   and she knows all the good places to hit  her karate instructor shakes his head and look at me sometimes
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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HankB

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2013, 11:23:55 AM »
. . . Sure enough it gets broken up, and I'm all high on life because I didn't get hit once and I did "the right thing" by not fighting.  We're marched down to the principal's office and that fat bastard gives us both the same punishment . . .
I would have politely asked . . . if his policy was to punish both people in a fight, what was HIS punishment going to be if I flattened HIS nose?

In 4th grade, a kid was punching me in the classroom while the psycho nun looked on . . . when I saw she wasn't going to do anything, I punched out the other kid - hard. Nun gets all upset and has the chutzpah to tell me that I should have turned the other cheek, and assigns me to write "I will not fight in class" 1000 times. Nothing for the other kid. When I asked her why the instigator gets a free pass - she DOUBLED my punishment.  :mad:

I refused to do it. She threatened to send me to the principal's office, and I said fine - then SHE could explain why it was OK for the other kid to use me as a punching bag in HER classroom.

She blustered and yelled a bit - but I never did that punishment.
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Sergeant Bob

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2013, 03:38:14 PM »
I would have politely asked . . . if his policy was to punish both people in a fight, what was HIS punishment going to be if I flattened HIS nose?

In 4th grade, a kid was punching me in the classroom while the psycho nun looked on . . . when I saw she wasn't going to do anything, I punched out the other kid - hard. Nun gets all upset and has the chutzpah to tell me that I should have turned the other cheek, and assigns me to write "I will not fight in class" 1000 times. Nothing for the other kid. When I asked her why the instigator gets a free pass - she DOUBLED my punishment.  :mad:

I refused to do it. She threatened to send me to the principal's office, and I said fine - then SHE could explain why it was OK for the other kid to use me as a punching bag in HER classroom.

She blustered and yelled a bit - but I never did that punishment.

I'm glad there were no penguins at my school! Although, in 6th grade (in 1969!) I got in a fight (pretty much one sided) with a guy who tried to punch me in the jewels, I got him in a headlock (with him bent over and his behind facing away from me) and picked him up by his head and neck, raising his feet off the ground, then dropped him in a heap in the dirt.
We both got the board of education.

I did overdo it a bit I guess, even though he started it. He never messed with me again.
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lee n. field

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2013, 03:43:25 PM »
Sometimes....
I've found that teachers patrolling the playgrounds have the attitude like "I didn't see nutttin"- whether its the bully doing the bullying or the bully getting his nose bloodied.


one way or another, that sort of stuff turned me into whatever it is that I am now.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2013, 03:54:04 PM »
I'm glad there were no penguins at my school! Although, in 6th grade (in 1969!) I got in a fight (pretty much one sided) with a guy who tried to punch me in the jewels, I got him in a headlock (with him bent over and his behind facing away from me) and picked him up by his head and neck, raising his feet off the ground, then dropped him in a heap in the dirt.
We both got the board of education.

I did overdo it a bit I guess, even though he started it. He never messed with me again.

if he started it and was still breathing  could walk without crutches had both eyes still you did not over do it

says the kid who wrestled 94 pounds in high school
i didn't get bullied much  usually just once in each new school.  dad was airforce lots of new schools  i would not always "win" when i responded but my response was such that it discouraged folks.  unfortunately it also sometimes scared the nicer kids too.
it was an attitude that served me well later in life
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2013, 04:10:08 PM »
I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the new definition of bullying - when I was a kid, being a bully meant intitiating physical violence - verbal stuff was irrelevant and unimportant. ("Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me.")

The best response to physical force is more physical force.

That so much is being made about words suggests that, as a country, we're making sure we raise a generation of wimps. Evidence is that schools will punish the target of physical bullying who fights back as much - if not more - than the bully himself.

You can use it as another example of the feminizing of society.

Fistfights may have been commen with the boys, but never the girls.
Verbally bullying is a specality amoung tween girls, and they are very, very very good at it.

Both boys and girls, when I was growing up the thing to do was to verbally push the bullied till the cryed or physically snapped.
That way they could attempt to flip the punishment for the altercation on the bullied (a no go in the new days of no tolerance rules)

This is why I only got in school suspension and the father of the boy I beat actually apologiesed to my parents. :|

Trust me, the verbal crap is bad enough to warrent real action on the part of the adults. Of course, the likelyhood of those adults taking the right action is slim to nil these days.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Anti-bully program trains better bullies
« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2013, 04:12:25 PM »
i had knuckle dusters and a switchblade
i never used the dusters but no one believed i wouldn't
i used caligulas motto
if they are gonna hate you add a lil fear.

it works   has side effects
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I