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Author Topic: M4/M16 hatred in the news  (Read 1143 times)

Ron

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M4/M16 hatred in the news
« on: February 21, 2014, 10:31:01 PM »
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/feb/19/troop-left-to-fend-for-themselves-after-army-was-w/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/feb/20/cover-up-army-historian-says-report-on-deadly-afgh/

blah blah blah

So many issues in both articles that I won't bother elaborating. The weapon is not optimal but this is a bunch of retreaded stuff.

Someone at Washington Times must have some skin in the game regarding a new rifle.
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Regolith

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2014, 10:41:38 PM »
Quote from: Ron on February 21, 2014, 10:31:01 PM
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/feb/19/troop-left-to-fend-for-themselves-after-army-was-w/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/feb/20/cover-up-army-historian-says-report-on-deadly-afgh/

blah blah blah

So many issues in both articles that I won't bother elaborating. The weapon is not optimal but this is a bunch of retreaded stuff.

Someone at Washington Times must have some skin in the game regarding a new rifle.

One of the local stations ran a story about that yesterday. Not entirely sure why the media decided to pick up on it all of a sudden, given just how long this has been debated.  ???
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dogmush

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2014, 11:01:28 PM »
I'm not sure why people think "most powerful and reliable" is the deciding characteristic the DOD uses for a rifle.  I've tried explaining things like cost, logistics, ammo weight and combined arms to folks who make these arguments and they get all glassy eyed.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2014, 11:29:38 PM »
They should ditch the crummy M16s, and get some of those military-grade, assault-style, Bushmaster AR-15 assault rifles that are readily available from gun shows without background checks. Now those things have some real firepower!
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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2014, 11:39:57 PM »
Bushmaster smushmaster...... They need to go back to the Garand!  

General Patton SAID it was the greatest battle implement ever made -- SO IT IS!
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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2014, 11:52:07 PM »
Truth be told, I wish they would pick something new for the combat arms guys just so I could get a hand me down M4 and stop schleping an M16A2 around.  Given my current ratio of walk around with it slung time to rounds fired, I don't give a dang about the round.   =D
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Boomhauer

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2014, 11:54:26 PM »
Quote
I wish they would pick something new for the combat arms guys

Then the bitching about the new weapon could happen while everybody pines for the old one. Such is Infantry Law.

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dogmush

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2014, 11:57:48 PM »
Quote from: Boomhauer on February 21, 2014, 11:54:26 PM
Then the bitching about the new weapon could happen while everybody pines for the old one. Such is Infantry Law.



Oh definitely, but I would have something shorter and lighter.  That's what's important.
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Fitz

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Re: Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2014, 02:21:05 PM »
Quote from: Boomhauer on February 21, 2014, 11:54:26 PM
Then the bitching about the new weapon could happen while everybody pines for the old one. Such is Infantry Law.


So much this
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Scout26

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2014, 03:42:03 PM »
The problem is that the Army is not happy with an either or solution.  Jamming that square peg into a round hole is the "Army Way".

I fail to see why each unit couldn't have been issued both M16 and M4 uppers and simply swap them out based on where they would be deployed or *gasp* have them bring both along so that should the situation merit they could create their own "optimal" mix of M4's/M16's in their unit.

But then that would mean empowering someone below the grade of O-10 to make a decision, and we can't allow that.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2014, 04:23:49 PM by scout26 »
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Angel Eyes

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2014, 04:05:46 PM »
From the first link:

Quote
Retired Army Maj. Gen. Robert Scales, an artillery officer who earned the Silver Star in Vietnam, is a prominent M4 critic.

He said its 5.56-caliber bullet is too small and the gas-piston firing system is prone to stoppage. He said better weapons — the German Heckler-Koch G36 and Russian AK-74 (a version of the venerable AK-47) — use superior firing systems.


The M4 carbine has a gas piston?
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Fitz

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Re: Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2014, 04:11:40 PM »
Quote from: Angel Eyes on February 22, 2014, 04:05:46 PM
From the first link:

The M4 carbine has a gas piston?


No.
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Fitz

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Perd Hapley

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2014, 04:31:40 PM »
Quote from: Angel Eyes on February 22, 2014, 04:05:46 PM
From the first link:

The M4 carbine has a gas piston?



But an inferior "firing system."

A journalist tries to follow a conversation about firearms, and gets confused. Film at 11.

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Angel Eyes

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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2014, 04:32:21 PM »
Quote from: Fitz on February 22, 2014, 04:11:40 PM

No.

Didn't think so.

Not sure if that error is the fault of General Scales or the author.
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Fitz

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Re:
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2014, 04:42:46 PM »
Neither would surprise me
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Re: M4/M16 hatred in the news
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2014, 09:51:18 AM »
"Someone at Washington Times must have some skin in the game regarding a new rifle."

It's called a slow news cycle, so they pulled something out of their "Hold on to this until we need something with impact on a slow news day" bag.
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