ROTC Taints University Campuses - Colman McCarthy, Washington Pos

[xavier fremboe]

So let's see.

In short, Gender/Queer/etc. studies apply the tools of history, literature, and some other humanitarian disciplines to the topic of gender, or queers, or whatever, as it was discussed in the cultures of the past.

I am sure it is polluted by leftism - like all academia - but to think that we shouldn't study the topic is downright preposterous.

Hardly.  Everything should bear scrutiny.  However, the study of things should not be the validating quality of the thing.  In other words, and not trying to Godwin myself, there is a place for Nazi studies, but not a place for a major in Nazi studies.  That would fit into a history major with a psychology minor.

[RevDisk]

So let's see.

In short, Gender/Queer/etc. studies apply the tools of history, literature, and some other humanitarian disciplines to the topic of gender, or queers, or whatever, as it was discussed in the cultures of the past.

I am sure it is polluted by leftism - like all academia - but to think that we shouldn't study the topic is downright preposterous.

This is America.  Folks can study anything they please.

That said, this is America.  We have a right to mock the downright preposterous, and we do (and should).  Folks are entitled to study basket-weaving studies to their heart's content.  I can and will mock them for it, unless they're just trying to get a piece of paper and concede that as their sole point. 

With respect, I'll do the same not only for GLBT studies, but also gender studies, a lot of sociology, and other non-science or non-productive degrees.  Not because the degrees are worthless, but because the folks holding said degrees have no idea how to often use said "knowledge" for anything productive.  Yes, "learning for learning's sake" is valid.  Mind you, this is coming from a guy with kydex molding and sewing equipment in his dining area, fermenting wine in his laundry room, and stacks of books everywhere. 

Here's a good idea if a degree is basketweaving or not.  Is there any serious market for said degree whatsoever outside of being a professor of said degree or writer for a journal about said degree?  Yes?  It's not a basketweaving degree.  No?  It's a basketweaving degree.

[MicroBalrog]

This might come as a complete shock, but I was not defending these degrees on the premise of them being economical. I was defending them on the premise of them being an extension of legitimate fields of knowledge in the humanities.

[RevDisk]

This might come as a complete shock, but I was not defending these degrees on the premise of them being economical. I was defending them on the premise of them being an extension of legitimate fields of knowledge in the humanities.

I'd say "legitimate fields of knowledge" is a bit of a stretch.  If a field of knowledge is entirely subjective (such as being primarily opinions), it's hard to call it a field of knowledge. 

I would grant them as being an extension of humanities.  "Legitimate", "field" or "knowledge" is a bit much.  Philosophy, law, history, literature, et al are legitimate fields of knowledge in the humanities.  Basketweaving studies is sorta, kinda, but not really a humanities degree. 

[MicroBalrog]

Again: all that these fields claim to do is apply the tools of more general fields of knowledge to a specific subject.

[KD5NRH]

This is America.  Folks can study anything they please.

That said, this is America.  We have a right to mock the downright preposterous, and we do (and should).

Exactly.  Like most post-pubescent males, I spent a great deal of time at one point of my life in the in-depth study of my genitals.  That doesn't mean there should be taxpayer-supported degrees available in KD5NRH's-genital-studies.  (Though it is pretty much the only way some of my tutors and group-study partners could ever hope to graduate with honors.)

Again: all that these fields claim to do is apply the tools of more general fields of knowledge to a specific subject.

Well, I applied a lot of biology, sociology, psychology, the occasional bit of chemistry, etc. in my genital studies.  If that somehow legitimizes it as a degree path, please direct me as to how to pursue its inclusion in a university curriculum so that I can CLEP my way to a PhD and start teaching the course.

(Note; online and distance learning courses may be available, but all labs must be attended in person.  Female applicants, please send photos for determination of lab fees and/or availability of special tuition assistance.  Male applicants, please just assume you can't afford it.)

[xavier fremboe]

Here's a good idea if a degree is basketweaving or not.  Is there any serious market for said degree whatsoever outside of being a professor of said degree or writer for a journal about said degree?  Yes?  It's not a basketweaving degree.  No?  It's a basketweaving degree.

For the win.  I once knew a very bright young poli-sic grad.  When he found out that he couldn't find work in intelligence,or anything else he thought was worthy, his fall back plan was to go back and get his doctorate and then teach.  At that point, his cv would have jumped from game stop retail sales to college professor. 

Hell, I myself realized that my English degree qualified me to either teach English or discuss dead white guys whilst frying mcnuggets during my junior year.

And now I own a machine shop.

[MicroBalrog]

My English degree qualified me to be a published writer and translator.

Like many things in life, education is what you put into it.

[Scout26]

I do take objection to the "basket weaving" shibboleth.  Basket weaving actually is a productive economic activity whereas these <grievance group>-studies are more along the lines of Navel Gazing. 

[KD5NRH]

I do take objection to the "basket weaving" shibboleth.  Basket weaving actually is a productive economic activity whereas these <grievance group>-studies are more along the lines of Navel Gazing.

Navel gazing is actually a low-level course in the genital studies curriculum.  (It gives you something to do when you can't find a study group, and self-study just isn't helping.)

[MillCreek]

I do take objection to the "basket weaving" shibboleth.  Basket weaving actually is a productive economic activity whereas these <grievance group>-studies are more along the lines of Navel Gazing. 

Based on what my wife pays for her Longaberger baskets, someone, somewhere, has figured out how to make money from basket weaving.

[MicroBalrog]

I do take objection to the "basket weaving" shibboleth.  Basket weaving actually is a productive economic activity whereas these <grievance group>-studies are more along the lines of Navel Gazing. 

I'm waiting for an explanation for why there shouldn't be an []-studies department at universities.

[HankB]

I do take objection to the "basket weaving" shibboleth.  Basket weaving actually is a productive economic activity whereas these <grievance group>-studies are more along the lines of Navel Gazing.  

The PROPER term for the course is "Production and Design of Cultural Anthropological Artifacts."   

This might come as a complete shock, but I was not defending these degrees on the premise of them being economical. I was defending them on the premise of them being an extension of legitimate fields of knowledge in the humanities.

When I was in college, we didn't have quite this level of nonsense . . . but younger colleagues have informed me what they consist of . . . here a a few examples:

Womyn's studies: Estrogen good. Testosterone bad. Men are oppressors. Civilization is the result of womyn's efforts. You will NOT disagree with the professor, or take issue with anything taught!!! (Again, note the spelling of womyn.)

Ethnic studies: White "ice people" are oppressors. Africa is the cradle of civilization. Cleopatra - said to be the most beautiful woman in history - was black. (You will NOT cite her Macedonian Greek ancestry, lest the professor level charges of racism against you!!!)

These are not repeat not extensions of any legitimate field of knowledge, they are organized propaganda programs by professional grievance group "victims." (Google Ward Churchill, who was an ethnic studies department head in Colorado for a time before his plagiarism, lies about his background, and other extremist nonsense caught up with him. A department head!)

[Scout26]

When I worked at certain air freight company, someone in HR noticed that all we hired were male former military officers.  That simply wouldn't do, so they brought in some fresh out of college females, to get Chicago Independent Local 705 (We Don't Work and You Can't Make Us) Teamsters to do their jobs. 

We had one who was a "Womyn's Studies" major.  There was a daily pool amongst the drivers as to what time she would leave the morning sort on the dock in tears.  And it was the WOMEN drivers who did damnedest to make her cry.    Her record time was 7 minutes.   The morning sort usually lasted an hour or less.

She lasted 3 weeks.

Considering that the average turnover for male former military officers was 6 months, HR was "shocked, I tell you", to see that the fresh out of college females lasted at just under a month.     

[Jamisjockey]

I'm waiting for an explanation for why there shouldn't be an []-studies department at universities.

IMHO, from meeting numerous graduates of <blank> studies groups.
Most <blank> Studies groups are nothing more than propaganda fests for grievance groups, with little actual antropological impact. 

To add insult to injury, government is knuckle deep in providing various grants and subsidies to students and schools.  Just a gut feeling, but I bet China isn't producing tons of Ethnic or Women's studies majors on the government dime.  We will continue to fall as a nation when we subsidize such nonsense.  You need a government grant? Fine.  As long as its in a productive field (science, medicine, engineering, business, etc). 

[Perd Hapley]

We had one who was a "Womyn's Studies" major.  There was a daily pool amongst the drivers as to what time she would leave the morning sort on the dock in tears.  And it was the WOMEN drivers who did damnedest to make her cry.    Her record time was 7 minutes.   The morning sort usually lasted an hour or less.

She lasted 3 weeks.

Considering that the average turnover for male former military officers was 6 months, HR was "shocked, I tell you", to see that the fresh out of college females lasted at just under a month.     

Sounds amusing. More details, please.

[MicroBalrog]

IMHO, from meeting numerous graduates of <blank> studies groups.
Most <blank> Studies groups are nothing more than propaganda fests for grievance groups, with little actual antropological impact. 

To add insult to injury, government is knuckle deep in providing various grants and subsidies to students and schools.  Just a gut feeling, but I bet China isn't producing tons of Ethnic or Women's studies majors on the government dime.  We will continue to fall as a nation when we subsidize such nonsense.  You need a government grant? Fine.  As long as its in a productive field (science, medicine, engineering, business, etc). 

It's interesting that you feel that America fails as a nation.

[Doggy Daddy]

It's interesting that you feel that America fails as a nation.

The word used is "fall".  One can reverse a fall, a fail is an end.

DD

[MicroBalrog]

Sorry, I misread that.

I do not believe America is falling as a nation. Improvements are obvious in many meaningful metrics.

[HankB]

. . . Just a gut feeling, but I bet China isn't producing tons of Ethnic or Women's studies majors on the government dime . . .

I suspect you're right. And I don't think it would be too far off topic to mention that the high schools in, say, Shanghai, aren't spending $60,000,000 of their "education" budget on a football stadium, either . . .  see:  (http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1074494)

(Mentioned Shanghai specifically because they seem to be doing rather well as high schools:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Programme_for_International_Student_Assessment )

[MechAg94]

If only the peace movement were as populated by people of such resolve and daring.

The real peace movement is populated by quite a large number of people with resolve and daring.  It is called the United States Armed Forces.  They do more to preserve and maintain peace here and abroad than any of those "peace" movements.

[Scout26]

The real peace movement is populated by quite a large number of people with resolve and daring.  It is called the United States Armed Forces.  They do more to preserve and maintain peace here and abroad than any of those "peace" movements.

Q


F


T

[MillCreek]

When I worked at certain air freight company, someone in HR noticed that all we hired were male former military officers.  That simply wouldn't do, so they brought in some fresh out of college females, to get Chicago Independent Local 705 (We Don't Work and You Can't Make Us) Teamsters to do their jobs. 

We had one who was a "Womyn's Studies" major.  There was a daily pool amongst the drivers as to what time she would leave the morning sort on the dock in tears.  And it was the WOMEN drivers who did damnedest to make her cry.    Her record time was 7 minutes.   The morning sort usually lasted an hour or less.

She lasted 3 weeks.

Considering that the average turnover for male former military officers was 6 months, HR was "shocked, I tell you", to see that the fresh out of college females lasted at just under a month.     

So did you do the honorable thing and treat these individuals the same way that you would want your wife, sister, daughter or mother treated in the workplace? Did you speak up upon any mistreatment of the employee?

[roo_ster]

So did you do the honorable thing and treat these individuals the same way that you would want your wife, sister, daughter or mother treated in the workplace? Did you speak up upon any mistreatment of the employee?

Nice questions ^^^ not pertinent to the problem, which is a whole lot bigger than one women's studies oxygen thief.

0. Not all positions of employment are in nice, corporate environments with well-mannered folks who have earned substantive degrees, are drug screened, and undergo extensive background checks like they do at my work.  Weeds out a lot of the aggressively nasty types.

1. Sounds like scout was a low/mid-level super.  IOW, not eligible to be in the union and effect change within.

2. Being low/mid-level mgt, there is little one can do to effect change in union relations & employees from without.

3. I am sure scout would have warned any females he cared for to avoid such positions like the plague.

4. The union sounds like some of the aggressively antagonistic unions my dad dealt with.  Likely he dealt with that same union (or another sub-org) when we lived just outside Chicago, as my dad's field was logistics.  Low/mid level supers making noise about the union will accomplish exactly zero.  STFU and deal with it would have been the reply.

5. There were some log jobs dealing with such troublesome unions that my dad would have quit the company before working those locations.  Worse than what scout described.  Eventually, my dad's employer solved all the antagonistic union problems by getting out of the log business and outsourcing it to a non-union log company.

[MillCreek]

^^^^ Being a senior manager at a company with 55,000 employees, I have to deal with this sort of stuff on occasion. And I have signed the termination papers for people who cannot get with the program from the hostile work environment perspective.  Perhaps it is a West Coast phenomenon (my company is up and down the West Coast), but the unions I deal with are not particularly supportive of their members who practice racial, sexual or other discrimination upon a protected class.  But healthcare may be a very different environment; I have not spent enough time in other occupational environments to be able to comment knowledgeably on them.