Wall Street Protest- Police Conduct Condemned by MSNBC

[Ned Hamford]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zgr3DiqWYCI&feature=player_embedded

Two clips are shown.  In one, folks are pushing at a mobile police barrier [never seen one of those before] and then a police officer is  'brutally assaulting' a man with a professional grade camera. He is knocked down and hits a car; video too short and unfocused to get a clear picture of what is going on.  I'd conjecture he should have been behind the barrier and failed to respond to police directives; what with looking through the camera.  If a brutal assault was intended, it was very poorly executed.  The second video clip has folks behind another barrier, seemingly just standing around, and a police officer [White Shirt] walks up and pepper sprays the group.  While I'd think that highly inadvisable with a crowd, especially as officers are holding up the mobile barriers.  Thinking random wanton cruelty a less than probable cause, methinks some officer had complained about the crowd pushing against the barrier [like they were in the first video] and the higher ranking fellow came over to get things back in hand before running off to put out another fire.  The short clip making it possible that, the crowd ebbing and flowing with protest ferocity, the clip was just taken during an ebb. 

Anyone seen some longer clips that actually provide context?

And is anyone else annoyed at what people shout?  I miss 'Don't taze me bro.'  Immediate failure to comply with a police directive [especially whilst in a crowd] triggers 'compulsed compliance techniques' that escalate far faster than those experiencing them fathom. 

I've been to events with 'professional protesters' before and frankly despise them.  Minimal interaction is enough to sort them out too.  They aren't there for any other purpose than the news video clip; the more out of context the better.  They even have classes for them.  They are the reason you don't see follow up videos of the people 'brutally assaulted.' Context; as often provided in those internal affairs investigations, destroys them. 

From what I saw the pepper spray didn't seem necessary, but from a lot of the reactions you would think the police were going about curb stomping folks. 

[Jamisjockey]

Pepper spray and dirty hippies is always necessary.

[AZRedhawk44]

I'll admit to a suspicion that the vid clips may be taken out of context.


That being said...

The pepper spray is almost inconceivably inexcusable.  There's 4-5 women in an orange hand-barricade corral and all of a sudden they get maced.  It obviously wasn't officer safety that prompted it... otherwise the blueshirts wouldn't have waited for a whiteshirt to start it.

[CNYCacher]

When you get to the part where the "innocent" woman is dragged through the barrier, rewind back to the part where the cameraman is taken down.  You'll see her take a swing at the cops over the barrier.  The two clips obviously happen sequentially, but they show them separated by about 2 minutes.

[Regolith]

I'm horribly conflicted.

On the one hand, as AZRed states, without further context the pepper spray incident does seem wildly over the top.

On the other hand...Dirty hippies and mace are always a good combination.

[Ned Hamford]

The pepper spray is almost inconceivably inexcusable.  There's 4-5 women in an orange hand-barricade corral and all of a sudden they get maced.  It obviously wasn't officer safety that prompted it... otherwise the blueshirts wouldn't have waited for a whiteshirt to start it.

I can imagine its being ROE that only white shirts got to pepper spray.  Imagine if knowing this the dear innocents, whenever seeing a white shirt heading their way would spread word.  White shirt walks off, restart the kicking and screaming.  

Just speculating  

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

not enough pepper spray used  that is inexcusable

[Sindawe]

You're gonna love this one Ned.  In the clip, cops are moving people along on the sidewalk and the people ARE moving along peacefully.  Who should wonder into frame needlessly  spewing pepper spray?  Why, its Deputy Inspector Anthony Bologna.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=VQNtI60fw90

[Ned Hamford]

I'm gonna call for context again.  We don't see who he was spraying and its an absurdly short clip again.  I still think of the two possibilities [white shirts are to be called for pepper spray or Officer Bologna (that is his real name, really) is a psycho, or an agent provacuer].

If the scene is actually some folks shouting 'we come in peace' while chucking bottles, I'm gonna go with CASD's call for more pepper spray.  And a tactical cam on officer Bologna's head so we can eat popcorn and watch hippies writhe as they learn actions have consequences. 

[KD5NRH]

And of course, the news anchor makes a big deal of the "we aren't doing anything" claim.  Because, you know, nobody ever says that when the cops catch them doing something.

[HankB]

After seeing some riots (at a distance!) and finding that what was reported didn't match what I saw, I'm skeptical of "pro-protest" reporting.

But I've seen extended film clips of cops cut loose with pepper spray for no apparent reason . . . knowing this happens, and with things like pepper spray, even bear spray, so readily available, I'm suprised that protestors haven't sprayed back when sprayed upon.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

ironically in the old days clear the area was "encouraged" with batons.  now move too leisurely you get a snootful of snot instead of stitches.  either way there is whining and crying.  got to a protest/riot?as a participant or a "journalist"?  be prepared for some consequences.....

[Ned Hamford]

 

'Clear the area!'  and 'Disperse Immediately!' Also applies to folks carrying cameras. 

 

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

they can stay  just need to know what it costs

[AJ Dual]

After seeing some riots (at a distance!) and finding that what was reported didn't match what I saw, I'm skeptical of "pro-protest" reporting.

But I've seen extended film clips of cops cut loose with pepper spray for no apparent reason . . . knowing this happens, and with things like pepper spray, even bear spray, so readily available, I'm suprised that protestors haven't sprayed back when sprayed upon.

I've had this thought too. However, the instant someone sprays back... "Fist of an angry god" would not even begin to describe the LEO reaction. 

I try so hard to be a "good little-L libertarian", and remember that what happens to them today might be me tomorrow, "slippery slope" and all that... but I find myself having zero sympathy. Because 99.999% of all "protesters" are inevitably always agitating for various kinds of socialist/collectivist/Marxist economic and political theories, that are at best unworkable, and carried to their logical (and historical) extremes, downright deadly to the tune of tens of millions.

Honestly, considering most police officers fealty to their public-sector unions, the protesters own kind are the one's beating on them... 

[kgbsquirrel]

After seeing some riots (at a distance!) and finding that what was reported didn't match what I saw, I'm skeptical of "pro-protest" reporting.

But I've seen extended film clips of cops cut loose with pepper spray for no apparent reason . . . knowing this happens, and with things like pepper spray, even bear spray, so readily available, I'm suprised that protestors haven't sprayed back when sprayed upon.

I recall watching the anarchist riots in Eugene, OR some years back. A few industrious individuals came prepared with gas masks, oven mitts and lacrosse sticks. They pulled a "return-to-sender" with most of the tear gas canisters fired at them.

[Ned Hamford]

[CNYCacher]

I recall watching the anarchist riots in Eugene, OR some years back. A few industrious individuals came prepared with gas masks, oven mitts and lacrosse sticks. They pulled a "return-to-sender" with most of the tear gas canisters fired at them.

I don't care what they were protesting, what they were hoping for.  They could be protesting their inability to legally eat babies and I would still have to give them credit for ingenuity on the lacrosse sticks.

[Bigjake]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

If you don't want to be gassed, clubbed, or otherwise violated,  don't be an ahole to men with guns and the power of the .gov behind them. 


If things ARE that bad,  and peaceful, law abiding protesters are getting curbstomped,  the appropriate response involves rifles,  not playing into the hands of riot cops.

[TechMan]

Yum....hot peppered hippie....but does anybody have something to cover the patchouli?

[kgbsquirrel]

Yum....hot peppered hippie....but does anybody have something to cover the patchouli?

Just pour on the capsaicin till it becomes palatable.... that's what we did with the shipboard cooking. 

[roo_ster]

Here's a report from one of the guys at powerline, not known for hippy-loving leftism:
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2011/10/peppered-in-nyc.php

[French G.]

I've had this thought too. However, the instant someone sprays back... "Fist of an angry god" would not even begin to describe the LEO reaction. 

I try so hard to be a "good little-L libertarian", and remember that what happens to them today might be me tomorrow, "slippery slope" and all that... but I find myself having zero sympathy. Because 99.999% of all "protesters" are inevitably always agitating for various kinds of socialist/collectivist/Marxist economic and political theories, that are at best unworkable, and carried to their logical (and historical) extremes, downright deadly to the tune of tens of millions.

Honestly, considering most police officers fealty to their public-sector unions, the protesters own kind are the one's beating on them... 

A Claire Wolfe moment!

There's the rub. Right now it is quite wrong to violate their right to assembly/exist and shoot them. By the time they gain power for their little red selves it will be okay to shoot them but too late, we'll be on the wrong end of that gig. Sucks to stand idly by while someone advocates for your destruction. Dirty little commies.

[doczinn]

Because 99.999% of all "protesters" are inevitably always agitating for various kinds of socialist/collectivist/Marxist economic and political theories, that are at best unworkable, and carried to their logical (and historical) extremes, downright deadly to the tune of tens of millions.

True - but isn't that part of the problem?

[RoadKingLarry]

Arabs had the "Arab Spring". Are we having a "Hippie Autumn"?