now even Amish gunnies are in trouble in Ill Illinois

[gunsmith]

http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/Amish-Gun-Owners-Face-Tough-Choice-illinois-photo-requirement-FOID-second-amendment-religious-freedom-117898199.html

New law requires them to photograph their rifles even though the Amish are hardly noted for their criminal activities,  Amish are not supposed to use cameras and they hunt for sustenance.  Criminal politicians don't mind starving families in order to pursue their evil agendas.

[lee n. field]

http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/Amish-Gun-Owners-Face-Tough-Choice-illinois-photo-requirement-FOID-second-amendment-religious-freedom-117898199.html

New law requires them to photograph their rifles even though the Amish are hardly noted for their criminal activities,  Amish are not supposed to use cameras and they hunt for sustenance.  Criminal politicians don't mind starving families in order to pursue their evil agendas.

I don't think you read that right.

[Scout26]

Just to clarify, the FOID Card (Firearm Owner Identification Card) has a photo of the person, not of any firearms.   If you are an Illinois resident, you have to have a FOID card to possess firearms or ammunition, in Illinois.

In theory, there is no record of what firearms you own.  However the ISP has refused to destroy its Brady Check records. So if you bought something through a FFL or at a Gunshow (yes, Illinois "Closed" the Gun Show loophole, which is why gun crime is non-existent in Chicago  ), "they" have a record of it.   Anyway where was I.  Oh yeah, FOID Cards and the Amish.

Illinois has a fairly large Amish population both in Central and Southern Illinois (I go and buy several pies from Amish lady each year at deer camp, they are sinful .)   Previously the Illinois State Police would issue the Amish a FOID without their picture on it.  However, the new ISP director has decided to curtail that practice. 

My guess is that the ISP will back-off the photo requirement, but it will be done very, very quietly, if you read between the last lines:

Illinois state police officials and some state representatives held a meeting last week to discuss the concerns and any possible alternatives. There’s been no word of if, or when the new photo requirement for the Amish will be enforced.

Nobody wants to see the Amish riot in Capitol building. 

[sanglant]

it might be effective. just think street pie vendors at IGOLD. i might just drive up for that.

[Scout26]

Amish family outside of Buncombe, IL.  I swear that they save up all the sin in the world and she bakes them into the pies. 

Think "The Charlie Sheen" of pies.

X100,000^100,000

[Regolith]

What kind of firearms do the Amish have, anyway?  I'm guessing muzzloaders, but flintlocks? Wheel locks? Percussion cap?

[Scout26]

Nope, quite a few "modern" shotguns (SxS mostly) and "modern" rifles.  By "modern" I mean that they fire shotgun shells and centerfire cartridges, however most are hand-me-hand-me-hand-me-hand-me-downs and probably worth fairly tidy sums.   

[vaskidmark]

Although the Amish do not, to my knowlege, go in for filing lawsuits, this is probably a case that the ACLU will take up on their behalf based on the 1A violation being proposed.  The gooberment has a long history of accommodating the Amish, who also have a history of accommodating the gooberment when absolutely necessary (think those "slow moving vehicle" triangles on the back of the buggy).

I had someone suggest that the past flaps over Muslim women insisting that their DL pictures be taken with the face covered is the same as this issue, to which I replied NOT SO!  AFAIK all Amish, even the ones that drive automobiles, do not allow photographs of humans, while the Muslim community is still divided on the face veil thing.  Further, driving is a privilege while SCOTUS has asserted that the keeping and bearing of arms is an individual right.  Between that and SCOTUS' past rulings on 1A/Amish I'm confident that the ISP director will quietly slink away, possibly even to find a new job if he does not back off before the publicity gets too intense.

stay safe.

[geronimotwo]

hopefully we get a full update when the state backs down!

[Harold Tuttle]

The local amish own modern deer hunting firearms

[gunsmith]

I don't think you read that right.

I guess its a new regulation the cops came up with not a new law, it still stinks.

[HankB]

Just to clarify, the FOID Card (Firearm Owner Identification Card) has a photo of the person, not of any firearms.   . . .  Previously the Illinois State Police would issue the Amish a FOID without their picture on it.  However, the new ISP director has decided to curtail that practice.

As odious as the Illinois FOID requirement is, carving out an exception - ANY exception - is even more odious. My preferred solution would be to do away with the FOID requirement entirely, but as long as it's in place, in this very narrow and limited instance, I agree with the ISP director - NO special treatment for Amish.

Or (hopefully) anyone else.

[Lee]

Equal Opportunity Idiocy.  Why don't all current FOID holders just claim to be Amish and ask for new blank cards...or just cut the pictures out? Then, get a local reporter to go with you to the local Walmart buy ammo, to demonstrate how Walmart and Illinois hate religious people.

[French G.]

Give them pre-98 antiques, no FOID required. After all, they don't like all that modern English stuff. That or pull a Mormon and migrate. Sell all their Illinois land to developers, become rich, go west and buy an entire state.

[Jamie B]

There are Amish around here in OH. I'm calling BS on their belief system.

They cannot own a car, but it is OK for their English friends to give them a ride? Please.

That is like smoking pot, not actually buying it, and saying that you do not have a problem.

I do not buy anything Amish, period.

[BlueStarLizzard]

There are Amish around here in OH. I'm calling BS on their belief system.

They cannot own a car, but it is OK for their English friends to give them a ride? Please.

That is like smoking pot, not actually buying it, and saying that you do not have a problem.

I do not buy anything Amish, period.

Well, I guess I have a problem  

They don't deny the modern world exists, they just don't allow it into their everyday lives. Besides, its nice to give people a ride, why do you have an issue with someone accepting a nice gesture?

Besides, how do you call BS on a beleif system? Seriously?

[vaskidmark]

While I agree that the concept of a permission slip to merely own a firearm is odious, especially given you need to go through a background check just to buy one (OK, there are still some places that have not closed all the loopholes), I note that the exemption for the Amish being photographed has been longstanding and that there is no indication that they are somehow abusing the exemption.  Further, the courts have upheld their claim to protected status in other areas regarding privileges.  And apparently notwithstanding the recent pronouncements of both SCOTUS and TOTUS that keeping and bearing, at least in the home, is a fundamental individual right, the FOID concept continues in a few states.

Now if you can show me an individual Amish who plays fast and loose with "the rules" then I'll call out that person and accuse them of heresy/apostasy.  But just as we decry punishing everyone for the actions of a limited number of individuals, I decry punishing all Amish for the behavior of a few backsliders who apparently are not New Order (the ones that will own/drive automobiles but paint the chrome flat black, use telephones in the house but not the barn, and all sorts of other wierdnesses).

And, afaik, even the Old Order Amish will allow rides in ambulances, modern medicine, and many other things that were not around in the 1700's.

stay safe.

[BlueStarLizzard]

From what I understand, skid, they actually do a pretty good job of policing their own for such things. Actually, they're pretty harsh.

I would say, if you saw someone behaving badly and felt the ned to call them out for it, then go talk to the elders.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

had amish as neighbors.  they make great neighbors. and are shrewd in business.

[Jamie B]

Besides, its nice to give people a ride, why do you have an issue with someone accepting a nice gesture?

You missed my point.

According to their beliefs, they cannot own electricity, cars, or anything that runs on gasoline.

They can and do use these items that are owned by the english.

Not being able to own something, but still using it when it is technically owned by others is hypocritical.

The fact that they avoid paying any income taxes since they are not reporting the cash is also garbage.

Waitresses are getting hit by the IRS for an additional 15% of their salary for tips, even if they actually receive less.

The Amish are having their cake and eating it at the same time.

I have also had several friends who have done business with the amish, and had trouble getting their money.

[BlueStarLizzard]

So i'm a hypocrite when I borrow a tool from my neighbor? Or is it just big stuff?


Poor folk borrow or are given use of stuff they can't buy all the time. Are they hypocrites?

your arguements are weak, and offensive in presentation.

[gunsmith]

I guess its a new regulation the cops came up with not a new law, it still stinks.

oooohhhhh photograph themselves-not the rifle!! 
gawd, no matter how clever I think I am I skru up pretty bad some times

[Perd Hapley]

Give them pre-98 antiques, no FOID required. After all, they don't like all that modern English stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJ3lbvtlTbo

[Jamie B]

your arguements are weak, and offensive in presentation.

Wow, that is too bad.

[mtnbkr]

Since we can't play nicely together, this one is closed.

Chris