Reaver Questions

[Scout26]

Let's start with a population of roughly 30,000 Reavers (.1% of Miranda's population of 30,000,000)

1.  How come the Reavers were all on ships in orbit/near Miranda ?  How come none remained on the surface (other then to make easier for the crew of Serenity to find the beacon without having to fight their way to it) ?

2.  And where did they get all those ships?  I mean there could not have been that many on Miranda.  Especially since there seems to be consistent Reaver on Reaver violence as shown in the movie when one Reaver Spaceship rips apart another Reaver Spaceship.

3.  Given that the tape/video was at least 12 years old, how did the Reavers sustain themselves?  I mean they have to eat right?  And sustaining that level of rage requires a great deal of energy, more then I suspect could be acquired from the occasional raiding parties to rape people to death, eat their flesh and then sew their skins into clothes, if we're lucky and they do it in that order. 

4.  How do they communicate and cooperate?  They just seem to be in a constant, violent rage ?  Or operate complex equipment like a spaceship, or even repair that equipment to keep it even at minimally operative levels?

5.  How come the G23 Pax had no effect on the crew of Serenity when they landed on Miranda?

6.  So how did that one guy in Bushwhacked become a Reaver?  It's not just watching the horrible things that Reavers do that make you become one, is it?

7.  Are all the Reavers destroyed in the end of Serenity?  Given that it appears that the entire Reaver fleet follows Serenity and there is a huge battle with the waiting Alliance fleet, with apparently only a few getting through to land on the small moon and be killed off by the crew of Serenity while Mal broadwaves the message.  Since there is no threat of them after that, and while they repair their ship and Mal has to endure the whingeing of a failed .gov operative then console a greiving widow, listen to a whore before talking to a teenage girl about love.     

[Jim147]

That's how Joss wrote it.

Sometimes I makeup hours of BS for an answer, but I'm tiered tonight.

jim

[CNYCacher]

6.  So how did that one guy in Bushwhacked become a Reaver?  It's not just watching the horrible things that Reavers do that make you become one, is it?

A man witnesses something like that and the only way to deal with it, I suspect, is to become it.

[Perd Hapley]

I thought that the Pax had to be added to the system, and if the Alliance stopped adding it, it would no longer be in the atmo. That the Serenity crew was not affected would support that idea.

The Reavers were not on Miranda, because there was no one on that planet to rape to death, eat their flesh and then sew their skins into clothes, if we're lucky and they do it in that order.

[Regolith]

A man witnesses something like that and the only way to deal with it, I suspect, is to become it.

So, perhaps the Pax was simply the catalyst for a self-sustaining reaction.  Once the initial mob was created, outside members could be "recruited" into that mob without the necessity of contact with the Pax by having their humanity/conscience/whatever destroyed by contact with the mob.

[BridgeRunner]

A man witnesses something like that and the only way to deal with it, I suspect, is to become it.

All evidence to the contrary, of course.

[Perd Hapley]

Or operate complex equipment like a spaceship, or even repair that equipment to keep it even at minimally operative levels?

The Trans-U was running without core containment, so maybe they can't repair equipment to keep it even at minimally operative levels.

[BridgeRunner]

The trouble is that people don't generally become depraved upon witnessing depravity, particularly depravity perpetrated against them and the people they're with.  The twentieth century's glorious history of genocide offers a whole lot of proof of that.

But then I'm always a little personally miffed at the notion that cutting oneself is presented as an act of extreme depravity. I'm not depraved.  A little crazy maybe, but not reduced to sub-human by unwavering rage.

Usually, though, rage is stupid.  It seems like maybe the reavers aren't?  The raids may be planned to be minimally intrusive so as to avoid open conflict with the republic.  Perhaps even negotiated.  Yep, Shepherd Book was probably the guy who negotiated the Reavers' monthly limit.  Would explain the seemingly high rage--if you're filled with aggression but confined to a boundary area with no outlet for your aggression, eating Soylent Green that stopped kicking, screaming, and tasting halfway decent a while back, then you'd seriously amp up the rage when allowed out for an afternoon of raping, murdering, feasting fun.

[Perd Hapley]

But then I'm always a little personally miffed at the notion that cutting oneself is presented as an act of extreme depravity. I'm not depraved.  A little crazy maybe, but not reduced to sub-human by unwavering rage.

But the Reavers weren't just troubled self-cutters who were a little crazy. Until you start eating your rape victims and wearing their skin, I don't think you should be personally miffed at the fact that Reavers also wore forks in their faces.  

I think Mal's theory on Reavers may have been suggested by the phenomenon of childhood abuse leading to behavioral problems in later life. Of course, there are problems with that comparison. The Reaver wannabe in "Bushwhacked" was not a child, and the abuse was an attack from outside, not domestic violence.  


On a more practical note, does anyone know if McCall's patterns will work, when using human skin as a medium?

[KD5NRH]

3.  Given that the tape/video was at least 12 years old, how did the Reavers sustain themselves?  I mean they have to eat right?  And sustaining that level of rage requires a great deal of energy, more then I suspect could be acquired from the occasional raiding parties to rape people to death, eat their flesh and then sew their skins into clothes, if we're lucky and they do it in that order.

Remember that those colony ships carried provisions for large numbers of people intended to get them through the the flight, basic colony setup time and probably at least a full year after in case of a bad harvest.  Reavers may prefer live meat, but it doesn't mean they can't live on ration bars.

[CNYCacher]

Ok now I need to go explain myself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfZBiTyL1co&feature=related#t=8m30s

[RoadKingLarry]

On a more practical note, does anyone know if McCall's patterns will work, when using human skin as a medium?

Some will some won't. Better to find a pattern designed for light weight leather.

[Fly320s]

Some will some won't. Better to find a pattern designed for light weight leather.

And allow for shrinkage. Unless you're using a foreskin.

[seeker_two]

Let's start with a population of roughly 30,000 Reavers (.1% of Miranda's population of 30,000,000)

1.  How come the Reavers were all on ships in orbit/near Miranda ?  How come none remained on the surface (other then to make easier for the crew of Serenity to find the beacon without having to fight their way to it) ? What was left on Miranda that the Reavers would be interested in? They make their living from piracy & scavenging....and Miranda was pretty much scavenged out.....

2.  And where did they get all those ships?  I mean there could not have been that many on Miranda.  Especially since there seems to be consistent Reaver on Reaver violence as shown in the movie when one Reaver Spaceship rips apart another Reaver Spaceship. Piracy and scavenging....same way pirates on Earth get their ships.....

3.  Given that the tape/video was at least 12 years old, how did the Reavers sustain themselves?  I mean they have to eat right?  And sustaining that level of rage requires a great deal of energy, more then I suspect could be acquired from the occasional raiding parties to rape people to death, eat their flesh and then sew their skins into clothes, if we're lucky and they do it in that order.  Who said their raiding was occasional?....with all the space traffic in the area, hitting even 1% of it (in addition to the planetary raids) would be enough to sustain them....

4.  How do they communicate and cooperate?  They just seem to be in a constant, violent rage ?  Or operate complex equipment like a spaceship, or even repair that equipment to keep it even at minimally operative levels? Insane doesn't mean stupid.....think of them more as hyper-aggressive super-Klingons.....

5.  How come the G23 Pax had no effect on the crew of Serenity when they landed on Miranda? Kinda like syphillis....even when the initial infection is wiped out, the physical damage is still present......

6.  So how did that one guy in Bushwhacked become a Reaver?  It's not just watching the horrible things that Reavers do that make you become one, is it? I'd bet he probably wasn't that psychologically stable to begin with.....add a severe case of Stockholm Syndrome to the mix....then BAM!!!

7.  Are all the Reavers destroyed in the end of Serenity?  Given that it appears that the entire Reaver fleet follows Serenity and there is a huge battle with the waiting Alliance fleet, with apparently only a few getting through to land on the small moon and be killed off by the crew of Serenity while Mal broadwaves the message.  Since there is no threat of them after that, and while they repair their ship and Mal has to endure the whingeing of a failed .gov operative then console a greiving widow, listen to a whore before talking to a teenage girl about love.   I wouldn't bet the farm on it.....there could still be stragglers about....and they might have a stockpile of G23 Pax that they might dump onto some unsuspecting world.....   

[makattak]

Perhaps, rather than a drug, the G23 Pax was a retrovirus designed to change the chemical/genetic makeup of the host.

Thus it was only added once to the air and had since died off on Miranda.

The victim in Bushwacked was infected with the retrovirus from the Reavers. We don't see many others becoming Reavers because they kill most of the people whom they infect (and only.1% of those infected would turn to Reavers.)

This of course raises questions as to whether the crew of the Serenity is now doomed, having been infected by the Reavers during the massive battle.

[seeker_two]

This of course raises questions as to whether the crew of the Serenity is now doomed, having been infected by the Reavers during the massive battle.

You mean there's a danger that River Tam could become a hyper-violent killing machine?.....

http://xkcd.com/311/

[CNYCacher]

Perhaps, rather than a drug, the G23 Pax was a retrovirus designed to change the chemical/genetic makeup of the host.

Thus it was only added once to the air and had since died off on Miranda.

The victim in Bushwacked was infected with the retrovirus from the Reavers. We don't see many others becoming Reavers because they kill most of the people whom they infect (and only.1% of those infected would turn to Reavers.)

This of course raises questions as to whether the crew of the Serenity is now doomed, having been infected by the Reavers during the massive battle.

I like this theory.

Perhaps the Reavers know instinctively who is among the 0.1% of the population which is susceptible to the virus.  Those they spare from killing to join the ranks once the virus takes hold.  The crew of Serenity is probably not doomed because chances are they are all among the 99.9% who are immune to the virus.

[roo_ster]

You mean there's a danger that River Tam could become a hyper-violent killing machine?.....

http://xkcd.com/311/

Now, that's just crazy talk.

[KD5NRH]

You mean there's a danger that River Tam could become a hyper-violent killing machine?.....

http://xkcd.com/311/

My vote is for River Tam challenging Lara Croft for control of the clothing-dissolving Jello planet.  Of course, the Middleman can't just let that happen, but he's busy with something unspecified elsewhere, so Wendy Watson has to get right in the middle of the fight.

(I'm still working on how to get Stana Katic and Denise Richards into the Jello.)

[makattak]

I like this theory.

Perhaps the Reavers know instinctively who is among the 0.1% of the population which is susceptible to the virus.  Those they spare from killing to join the ranks once the virus takes hold.  The crew of Serenity is probably not doomed because chances are they are all among the 99.9% who are immune to the virus.

Not doomed to become Reavers, but doomed to become lethargic and die, as the 99.9% of the population of Miranda.

As for River Tam, I'm sure her brain structure has been sufficiently altered that the G23 Pax will not have either of the two effects on her.

Hey, maybe that's why she became more sane.

[Tallpine]

I though the G23 was something they put into the drinking water   

How come the Gunsmoke TV series lasted longer than frontier Dodge City ? 

[makattak]

I though the G23 was something they put into the drinking water   

How come the Gunsmoke TV series lasted longer than frontier Dodge City ? 

It was in the air.

It didn't. Add up the hours of Gunsmoke vs. the hours Dodge City survived.

[henschman]

I guess the best explanation for how Reavers sustain themselves is by raiding settlements and spacecraft for supplies.  Yeah, ships probably carry several years' worth of rations.

As for where they got their spaceships, I don't think the movie ever shows the Reaver fleet ever being more than several hundred ships.  That many could be found on a planet of 30,000,000, and then you have to think of all the ships that they ambush and capture in the course of their raping and pillaging.   

[Tallpine]

Some of it is made up, and some of it is not quantifiable.

[wmenorr67]

Since it happens in the future there could be things that come into play that we would never even think of yet.