why doesn't the Conservative Party put forth a candidate?

[Perd Hapley]

How are conservatives whining? 

[mek42]

My conservative coworker laments the downfall of America almost everyday.  He especially likes to bemoan that McCain is not a Conservative.  Doesn't have too much to say in response to me asking the question I asked as the OP here.

To hear Conservatives in the media - maybe "whining" isn't the absolutely correct word, but it seems like if the Conservatives with the loudest voices actually did something other than bemoan the current state of affairs there might be less for them to moan about.

[yesitsloaded]

I think you are referring to Bill Buckley Mek. I am going to have to agree with fistful as there are conservatives that think that being conservative means forcefully protecting old standards and the status quo, and there are the conservatives that believe in being good stewards and not playing the tax and spend game that is ruining the country. Throw in the extreme libertarians that understand good government policy but can't figure out that just because you can be free to do something doesn't mean you should do it (especially in public while wearing wookie suits) and there is no wonder why the "conservative" movement is so split up. I would consider myself a conservative Republican if it wasn't an oxymoron right now considering how the party is acting. All have done in eight years is  proved that we can outspend democrats and expand the government needlessly just as much. Just look at my home state of Mississippi where we just elected a democrat congressman because he seems to be pro 2ndA, moral, and not fiscally reckless.

[Perd Hapley]

Back to topic, if conservatives aren't ready and/or willing to do what it takes to get behind someone

I think you misunderstood what I was saying.  When I said we weren't ready to unite, I didn't mean we didn't want to do anything.  I meant that we haven't decided which way to go, and we're split on the correct policies, or sometimes just on the correct priorities.  That's why McCain won.  Some thought that Huckabee's platform was best.  Some liked Thompson.  Some Romney, some Hunter.  Now a lot of that had to do with personality and elect-ability, but still, there are disagreements about which planks are more important.  National defense, border security, social issues, spending, earmarks, deficit, the economy, and so on.  I think conservatives are divided over which are most important.  Add to that, we're split over the Iraq war, the Patriot Act, a bunch of things I can't remember now, because it's too late. 

As for the "whiners," you'll always have a segment that is more complaint than accomplishment.  As for the conservative pundits, they are doing their job, which is to opine.  Rush Limbaugh is probably encouraging activism now, more than he ever has.  He has long said that it isn't his job to tell his listeners what to do, or to call this or that politician, or to write letters.  Operation Chaos is, as far as I know, his biggest foray into activism so far. 

[MicroBalrog]

Bah, I write a long, detailed post, and it gets entirely ignored.

[mek42]

I think you are referring to Bill Buckley Mek. I am going to have to agree with fistful as there are conservatives that think that being conservative means forcefully protecting old standards and the status quo, and there are the conservatives that believe in being good stewards and not playing the tax and spend game that is ruining the country. Throw in the extreme libertarians that understand good government policy but can't figure out that just because you can be free to do something doesn't mean you should do it (especially in public while wearing wookie suits) and there is no wonder why the "conservative" movement is so split up. I would consider myself a conservative Republican if it wasn't an oxymoron right now considering how the party is acting. All have done in eight years is  proved that we can outspend democrats and expand the government needlessly just as much. Just look at my home state of Mississippi where we just elected a democrat congressman because he seems to be pro 2ndA, moral, and not fiscally reckless.

Yes, Bill Buckley, thank you!

Lately I've kind of joked around that I could win an election with no party affiliation using a platform of, "I will neither lie nor pander."  Maybe that isn't quite the joke I thought it was.

[erictank]

I think you are referring to Bill Buckley Mek. I am going to have to agree with fistful as there are conservatives that think that being conservative means forcefully protecting old standards and the status quo, and there are the conservatives that believe in being good stewards and not playing the tax and spend game that is ruining the country. Throw in the extreme libertarians that understand good government policy but can't figure out that just because you can be free to do something doesn't mean you should do it (especially in public while wearing wookie suits) and there is no wonder why the "conservative" movement is so split up. I would consider myself a conservative Republican if it wasn't an oxymoron right now considering how the party is acting. All have done in eight years is  proved that we can outspend democrats and expand the government needlessly just as much. Just look at my home state of Mississippi where we just elected a democrat congressman because he seems to be pro 2ndA, moral, and not fiscally reckless.

Yes, Bill Buckley, thank you!

Lately I've kind of joked around that I could win an election with no party affiliation using a platform of, "I will neither lie nor pander."  Maybe that isn't quite the joke I thought it was.

Almost no one would believe you.

Those who did would take it as a sign that you are utterly unsuitable for public office.

[gunsmith]

btw, what conservative party are we discussing?
I'm googling it right now but my pc is slow.
I know we have a constitution party. Is there some American conservative party now too?
Instead of having 3 or 4 or 20 parties , lets concentrate on building a real conservative movement.

[xavier fremboe]

Bah, I write a long, detailed post, and it gets entirely ignored.

Youth and nationality don't and shouldn't nullify an opinion.  Your views are well thought out.  I might not agree with all of them, but hey, I don't have to agree with someone to enjoy reading their stuff.  Keep it up.

[Perd Hapley]

btw, what conservative party are we discussing?
I'm googling it right now but my pc is slow.
I know we have a constitution party. Is there some American conservative party now too? 

I assumed he was referring to conservatives, generally. 

[Tallpine]

A "conservative party" is hard liquor without the drugs

[gunsmith]

I for one am getting really sick of the personal attacks against people you (plural - not just MW) disagree with

Me too, what happened to the "polite" part of armed?
The first FLDS thread had a bunch of ad hominen (however you spell it)

If John M doesn't pick a good conservative candidate VP I am not voting for him and will be voting third party for the first time since Perot (that went great didn't it?)

A "conservative party" is hard liquor without the drugs

Hmmm, WRT drug legalization?
Even though I support total legalization of every drug I tend to vote for more Christian right wing types that traditionally support the opposite, because they're better on the abortion question.

[Glock Glockler]

Even though I support total legalization of every drug I tend to vote for more Christian right wing types that traditionally support the opposite, because they're better on the abortion question.

That's it, keep losing other ground fighting a battle you've already lost

[Perd Hapley]

There is every reason to believe that the pro-abortion side is losing ground.  There is also every reason to keep fighting that "lost battle."  That is, the millions who might be aborted murdered in decades to come. 

[Manedwolf]

There is every reason to believe that the pro-abortion side is losing ground.  There is also every reason to keep fighting that "lost battle."  That is, the millions who might be aborted murdered in decades to come. 

I'm still in favor of Norplant or something comparable as a prerequisite to get welfare, but the ACLU destroyed any suggestions of doing just that. It'd also severely cut down on the number of convenience "oops, I was drunk again" abortions, I believe, as well as the number of drug-addicted babies.

They said it was "racist". No, it's against the people of any race who pop out ten kids they can't feed and don't even know who the daddy is, because they have absolutely no self control and no deterrence because they can rest assured Big Government will give them money, ostensibly for the kids, that they then spend on further personal gratification.

And then their girls have zero guidance, so they become mothers at 14 that have ten welfare kids, or boys that are more likely to get into trouble and become part of gangs.

The ACLU has shot down even OFFERING Norplant and other things free to welfare recipients or low-income people, they Godwin'ed the argument.

[Perd Hapley]

That's interesting.  Anti-abortion groups are saying the same thing about abortion, that it kills mainly black children.  Some point out the high percentage of Planned Parenthood centers in Black neighborhoods.  Haven't looked up the numbers for myself, but it wouldn't be surprising. 

[gunsmith]

it kills mainly black children.

lets go to the video tape!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZ0bJxP2jdI

That's it, keep losing other ground fighting a battle you've already lost

The drug legalization gang is the one that is losing ground, as medical science improves, it is crystal clear that partial birth abortion is murder.
Many children can live happy lives after being born at 8 months, perhaps less (not sure).
Bans on partial birth abortion are gaining ground, meanwhile people like Bill Clinton (pro choice death) sent in the goon squads when CA legalized medical MJ.

http://www.drugpolicy.org/library%5Cpeace2.cfm

Ironically, it was the federal government's retreat from a medical-marijuana experiment that made California's initiative campaign inevitable. In 1991, President Bush killed a 15-year-old program under which Uncle Sam had grown marijuana in Mississippi for a handful of patients. Only those willing to jump through myriad legal and medical hoops had gotten pot: There were but 10 on the roster when AIDS sufferers began submitting a flood of applications. Rather than meet the need and dilute the message of the drug war, Bush shut down the program. Gay activists asked Clinton to revive it and were rebuffed. To be denied relief from AIDS symptoms felt to many gays like the same old hateful bull****t.

The Clinton drug war is bigger, by any measure - dollars, arrests, length of sentences than those of Bush and Reagan. The post-Cold War Pentagon has found a new purpose in the drug war, flying missions over the Gulf of Mexico and patrolling the U.S.-Mexico border. And, in some cases, it is marching straight over the face of the U.S. Constitution.

BTW, I used to be pretty good friends with
Dennis Peron, the founder of the med MJ movement.
He is a pretty good guy, mixed up with some not so good ones though.

[Glock Glockler]

I know of hordes of females that in general aren't that interested in politics yet vote Democrat because of abortion, I also know many others who would like to vote Republican but their main issue is abortion so their vote goes to the Democrats.

It's a political loser, since Roe v. Wade abortion has become heavily funded by govt, the pro-life movement has actually lost ground on that issue, bravo!  Why is it that people say doing the same thing over again and expectiing different results in insanity?  Pro-life people would actually be more successful if they dropped the 'make abortion illegal' stance to 'no govt. funding for abortion', and the Democrats would lose quite a bit of support, maybe we could actually recover lost ground and make govt. smaller.

[MicroBalrog]

it is crystal clear that partial birth abortion is murder.

Yes. PBA is murder. It must be banned. We can all agree on that. The problem however that I have with the anti-abortion people is just the same I have with the anti-gun people.

A LOT of the anti-abortion people want to ban  ALL abortion. That bugs me a whole lot.

I also find the medical marijuana movement to be beyond misguided.

[Tallpine]

Quote
A "conservative party" is hard liquor without the drugs

Hmmm, WRT drug legalization?
Even though I support total legalization of every drug I tend to vote for more Christian right wing types that traditionally support the opposite, because they're better on the abortion question.

Umm .... humor alert 

Here I crack a joke and you guys have drug up the abortion issue.

[Perd Hapley]

A LOT of the anti-abortion people want to ban  ALL abortion. That bugs me a whole lot. 

What abortions would you have remain legal? 


Hey, Tallpine, I got the joke.  But you know how I am once the abortion talk begins.   

[LAK]

That's interesting.  Anti-abortion groups are saying the same thing about abortion, that it kills mainly black children.  Some point out the high percentage of Planned Parenthood centers in Black neighborhoods.  Haven't looked up the numbers for myself, but it wouldn't be surprising.

Culture problem; and most conservative blacks I talk to are the first to agree. Black "pop" culture - or black "no culture at all" - precipitates this.

Of all the groups, the vietnamese, chinese, east indians, pakistanis etc generally have more stable families, discpline their children, etc and thus have far less of a problem.

[MicroBalrog]

Abortions before the stage the at the foetus develops an independent brain, i.e. somewhere around the mid-2nd trimester.   Naturally my knowledge of biology is limited.

[Tallpine]

It should be up to the states.

[MicroBalrog]

It should be up to the states.

Agreed.