British exit of EU guesses

[brimic]

I wasn't talking only about America, but in any context, I disagree. If right or left mean anything, I'm comfortable saying that rightists (anywhere) are more likely to skew nationalist and/or nativist. I'm pretty certain that's true in America. Of course, it also depends on how one defines the two n-words, there.

You are correct.
I'll just leave this here: http://www.anonymousconservative.com/blog/the-theory/rk-selection-theory/

[MechAg94]

No need to start your own business and take on that risk/liability/headache. Sprinkler fitters around here make a minimum of $50/hour upon completion of a four year apprenticeship and passing the journeyman test. If they fail it then they stay as apprentices making $40/hour. Six figures a year before overtime, no need to deal with payroll and personnel management and all the other business hassles.

My Dad was in the Sprinkler fitters union.  I don't think he ever made that kind of money.  Did they bump up the rates recently?

Engineering can be a good college degree depending on what degree and grades.  However it doesn't always translate easily to your own business unless you get into some sort of specialty where you are your own contractor.  

The main thing is to pick a trade that won't go away with  improving technology or be replaced by robots/computers.  

[agricola]

Well that was an interesting 24 hours. 

The UK out of the EU, Cameron out of power (soon), the Blairite cretinry trying to get Corbyn out, almost every media outlet getting the result wrong, Nigel Farage conceding twice before claiming credit for the victory, and Harrods have stopped selling their Steak Exeter pies. 

I do however think this was not really about the EU.  Almost all of the political class over here was for Remain, and they (in England and Wales at least) got smashed - not only did Brexit win, but the top reason people of every political persuasion voted remain (according to polling conducted by Lord Ashcroft) was that people felt Brexit was too much of a risk. 

[Hawkmoon]

Plenty of countries where the folks who want state control of business are also nativist and nationalist.

Venezuela? Bolivia? Argentina?

[makattak]

not only did Brexit win, but the top reason people of every political persuasion voted remain (according to polling conducted by Lord Ashcroft) was that people felt Brexit was too much of a risk. 

That is especially interesting and suggests a significant dissatisfaction with the EU.

Imagine that, an overarching, unaccountable bureaucracy that governs against the will of the people is disliked.

[Angel Eyes]

I heard reports that Scotland voted heavily for Remain.  Can anyone confirm?

[AJ Dual]

I heard reports that Scotland voted heavily for Remain.  Can anyone confirm?

Yes, about 68-32% in favor of "Remain".

[Perd Hapley]

I heard reports that Scotland voted heavily for Remain.  Can anyone confirm?

No, those are earplugs.

Scotland, a bunch of the little islands, and I think Northern Ireland as well.

[Perd Hapley]

You are correct.
I'll just leave this here: http://www.anonymousconservative.com/blog/the-theory/rk-selection-theory/

I've seen that bandied about, but never read it before.

I don't know if they explain it in the book, but it doesn't seem to fit well with human immigrant populations in the West. Were 17th-20th century immigrants to America, and their descendants, more r than their K cousins, back in the Old Country? They had an embarrassment of resources here. If it wasn't easier to make a living here, than there, they wouldn't have come. Were the Natives more r, living in a huge, fertile continent, with a relatively low population?

I suppose others have asked that question before, so I assume there's a good answer.


Also, some rabbit trail led me to this, which seemed related. Or not. The author looks to be one of those pick-up artist stooges, but he had some interesting observations in this article.

https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2013/02/07/leftoid-egocentrism/

The old saw that liberals love humanity but hate humans while conservatives hate humanity but love humans is proven accurate over and over, each time I am in the one or the other’s company.

I'm not proud to admit it, but I lost my childhood appreciation for humans some time ago. I'm definitely more of a humanity-lover than a human-lover these days. Still don't want to force them to solve all their problems my way, though. Maybe I don't love humanity, either.

[Perd Hapley]

So as I read further about the Brexit, I keep seeing indications that rightists favor it (which usually means the Left doesn't). Should I post some of those, or is the moment gone?

[Angel Eyes]

First Brexit, now Texit?

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-usa-secession-idUSKCN0ZA3F4

Unlikely, IMO.  Secession is a far different, and messier, matter than a sovereign nation leaving a loose confederation of nations.

[RoadKingLarry]

First Brexit, now Texit?

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-usa-secession-idUSKCN0ZA3F4

Unlikely, IMO.  Secession is a far different, and messier, matter than a sovereign nation leaving a loose confederation of nations.

That whole secession thing was pretty well settled in 1865. Ain't gonna happen, even if Texas had a referendum and had a 100% vote in favor of leaving the US.

[De Selby]

So as I read further about the Brexit, I keep seeing indications that rightists favor it (which usually means the Left doesn't). Should I post some of those, or is the moment gone?

What would that prove?  You seem to have completely missed the obvious point about corporatism to continue on in a vain attempt to prove something about "the right."   Obviously people in the right (not the same thing as American conservatives) also support it.

Being hung up on identity politics is one reason why the same policies get admitted by red and blue administrations every time.  You're stuck on making the Brexit a right vs left thing when it clearly is not, at least not in the way that someone who wants to offshore your job would describe left vs right.

[Perd Hapley]

A suite of hand-wringing, what have they done?! articles.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/25/opinion/britain-leaves-on-a-cry-of-anger-and-frustration.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/24/opinion/brexit-and-europes-angry-old-men.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/25/opinion/britains-brexit-leap-in-the-dark.html

[Perd Hapley]

What would that prove?  You seem to have completely missed the obvious point about corporatism to continue on in a vain attempt to prove something about "the right."   Obviously people in the right (not the same thing as American conservatives) also support it.

Being hung up on identity politics is one reason why the same policies get admitted by red and blue administrations every time.  You're stuck on making the Brexit a right vs left thing when it clearly is not, at least not in the way that someone who wants to offshore your job would describe left vs right.

Lighten up, Francis. Somebody said lefties didn't like the Brexit. Then you insisted it was a left-right thing. Now you say it's not a left-right thing, and I have to talk about corporatism, or shut up. Whatever, man.

So are you guys staying in the Commonwealth, down there, or Aus-xiting? 

[Ben]

First Brexit, now Texit?

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-usa-secession-idUSKCN0ZA3F4

Unlikely, IMO.  Secession is a far different, and messier, matter than a sovereign nation leaving a loose confederation of nations.

Yeah, it's too bad, because I would love to see the state of Jefferson. :)

[De Selby]

Lighten up, Francis. Somebody said lefties didn't like the Brexit. Then you insisted it was a left-right thing. Now you say it's not a left-right thing, and I have to talk about corporatism, or shut up. Whatever, man.

So are you guys staying in the Commonwealth, down there, or Aus-xiting? 

I said (rightly) that leftists have been the most staunch supporters of the Brexit.

Australia is likely to exit the commonwealth at some point.  It becomes a hot topic every decade or so.

[agricola]

Lighten up, Francis. Somebody said lefties didn't like the Brexit. Then you insisted it was a left-right thing. Now you say it's not a left-right thing, and I have to talk about corporatism, or shut up. Whatever, man.

So are you guys staying in the Commonwealth, down there, or Aus-xiting? 

It isn't a left-right thing, FWIW.  Whilst most of the Parliamentary Labour Party were for remain, most of them are right wingers of one sort or another and there were more than a few left wing types who represented the old Bennite wing of the party wanting to leave (my own MP included).  Even the leader Jeremy Corbyn has a long history of euroscepticism and was a very late, and not especially enthused, backer of Remain.

[Angel Eyes]

Some reports are suggesting it's more of a generational thing, with middle-aged and older folks supporting Leave and the younger folks supporting Remain (perhaps because it's all they've known?).

[Perd Hapley]

I said (rightly) that leftists have been the most staunch supporters of the Brexit.

No! It's about corporatism! Only De Selby is allowed to discuss left-right alignment of the Brexit vote!

Oh, sorry, Mr. De Selby, I didn't realize it was you.

[HankB]

According to some stories I read, folks in the U.K. don't like faceless bureaucrats in Brussels outlawing British teapots, toasters, powerful vacuum cleaners, hair dryers, etc., all in the name of the fight against global warming.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/11061538/EU-to-ban-high-energy-hair-dryers-smartphones-and-kettles.html

http://news.sky.com/story/1322500/vacuum-ban-to-outlaw-most-powerful-cleaners

[Angel Eyes]

(NSFW language)

http://i.4cdn.org/pol/1466795133935.jpg




(ETA:)

[Hawkmoon]

Some reports are suggesting it's more of a generational thing, with middle-aged and older folks supporting Leave and the younger folks supporting Remain (perhaps because it's all they've known?).

A friend from an EU country (not GB) said just that in a telephone conversation we had this morning (morning my time). And he also made the point that the people favoring Remain had mostly never known anything else.

[Perd Hapley]

FWIW, Some NPR show was interviewing Some Brit Journo this evening. He said the split was mainly old/young, and white/other. He also said it was those more fully indoctrinated by the educational system that voted for Remain. OK, OK, that last bit included a bit of my editorializing. 

[Angel Eyes]

Scotland may try for independence again:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/24/europe/scotland-eu-referendum/index.html

Scotland will likely seek independence for a second time this decade after the historic vote for the United Kingdom to leave the European Union, Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said Friday.

Sturgeon's Scottish National Party was elected on a platform that vowed, in part, to revisit the independence issue -- last decided in a failed 2014 referendum -- should the country be "taken out of the EU against our will," Sturgeon said.