Irony Alert II - lawyers again

[vaskidmark]

http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2012/06/tamanaha.html

Tamanaha: How and Why Law Schools Take From the 99% to Give to the 1%

And from InstaPundit where I found the above:

Ironic, given the political tilt of most law faculties. Or maybe not. . . .

Glenn puts irony in his snark about irony.  A hat trick if ever there was one.

stay safe,

[Ned Hamford]

The reality is even worse.  Those scholarships require a certain GPA or better and more than 80% don't meet it the first year.  Academic hits are put out and crony profs are happy to oblige; seeing as they know gov loans are guaranteed to all and the registrar already has the paperwork filled out.   More $ back to the school gives them a better chance at a raise after all. 

[MechAg94]

Also, more students on scholarship mean fee increases don't affect as many students or their families. 

[T.O.M.]

I earned a scholarship to attend law school.  Required that I maintain a 3.5 GPA.  After the first semester, my 3.0 GPA didn't cut it.  School didn't advertise that it had a mandatory grade curve that results in 80% of students to recieve a C or lower to "fight grade inflation."  So, in a class of 10 people, 1 A, 1 B, everone else gets a C or worse.  And, as I was told by an adjunct professor/Assistant U.S. Attorney I was interning for my third year, the administration would change the grades to match their system.

Law school sucks.  Bunch of whiny liberal profs who live in their ivory tower, arrogantly abuse students using the "socratic method," and teach nothing related to the actual practice of law.  They ought to shorten the process and reinstate apprenticeships with actual practicing attorneys.

[vaskidmark]

Or you could move to Virginia and read the law for 5 years, then pass the bar exam the first time out so as to really annoy both all the law school grads and the State Bar examiners.

There are still a few attorneys willing to take on someone reading the law.  A side benefit is none of the slave-labor BS real law students have to suffer through.

stay safe.

[MillCreek]

We have this in Washington, too: the law clerk program run by the State Bar Association.

[De Selby]

The reality is even worse.  Those scholarships require a certain GPA or better and more than 80% don't meet it the first year.  Academic hits are put out and crony profs are happy to oblige; seeing as they know gov loans are guaranteed to all and the registrar already has the paperwork filled out.   More $ back to the school gives them a better chance at a raise after all. 

Academic hits???   Seriously?

I think mostly it's just difficult at lots of scools to make a decent grade.  They do that as a way of forcing people who aren't likely to pass the bar on the first try, which is something that messes with their image. 

Most of the top tier schools essentially hand out decent grades to everyone, relying on competition in admissions to get decent students.

Also, where did this meme about the political tilt of law faculties come from?  They are by and large conservative in my experience.

[vaskidmark]

Also, where did this meme about the political tilt of law faculties come from?  They are by and large conservative in my experience.

Search "law school bubble" at http://www.volokh.com .  I'm pretty sure Eugene is not the only one blogging about this, but he's one of the legal blogs I read daily.  It occupies a lot of electrons over there.

stay safe.

[T.O.M.]

Also, where did this meme about the political tilt of law faculties come from?  They are by and large conservative in my experience.

At my law school, the adjunct faculty who practiced law were by and large conservative, but the full-time staff was as liberal as can be. One teaching Professional Responsibility pushed for mandatory pro bono work by students, and then excluded volunteer work for places like prosecutor's offices and other more conservative options while pushing the ACLU as the best choice.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

At my law school, the adjunct faculty who practiced law were by and large conservative, but the full-time staff was as liberal as can be. One teaching Professional Responsibility pushed for mandatory pro bono work by students, and then excluded volunteer work for places like prosecutor's offices and other more conservative options while pushing the ACLU as the best choice.

but they get right picky about what causes  i worked for a contractor at georgetown law.  my mission was to break the union.  i went to the legal clinic there with the facts about how the company was screwing the employees and they got all excited about the story   then i told them it was there school and it was sorry dude can't help you. meanwhile they were marching about a living wage for the workers.

[De Selby]

At my law school, the adjunct faculty who practiced law were by and large conservative, but the full-time staff was as liberal as can be. One teaching Professional Responsibility pushed for mandatory pro bono work by students, and then excluded volunteer work for places like prosecutor's offices and other more conservative options while pushing the ACLU as the best choice.

They're out there of course, but for every one of those there's someone who thinks Marbury is unconstitutional and that private ownership of the courts will solve all the world's evils. 

[Ned Hamford]

They're out there of course, but for every one of those there's someone who thinks Marbury is unconstitutional and that private ownership of the courts will solve all the world's evils. 

I think if you check out the donation and org numbers you'll find a well defined professional leaning.  My own law school had a token conservative.  Despite its religious founding, faculty who willingly sought their employment there actually became chair throwing angry at the proposal to hang a cross in public [in an undecorated side hallway].  While some circumstances were rather unique in my case, I was publicly regraded explicitly for my perceived conservative leanings and the administration was fine with it.  Having been quite active in the Federalist Society I can call my own experience extreme, but extreme liberalism at law schools and college campuses in general are the norm. 

There are plenty of old time lawyers who went through before campuses went nuts and plenty of lawyers who suffered through or just kept their heads down, but in total numbers and extremity of action/involvement, there is a no real question of strong liberal and statist leanings amongst the profession.  And I'm not just saying that because I'm in the bluest of states either.  For every conservative firm, you'll find 4 liberal and two extreme liberal ones.  Tho that number may just be NY and DC... 

[RoadKingLarry]

Shakespeare had a damn fine idea about lawyers but I wonder what he would have thought about MBAs?
 

[MillCreek]

and that private ownership of the courts will solve all the world's evils. 

Well, we have certainly seen the rise of a private justice system in the arbitration now so frequently used in commercial and consumer disputes.  And I have hired retired judges to conduct private trials on my medmal cases.

What I will be interested to see is if 'computerized judges' ever take off.  Essentially an expert heuristic system that makes a ruling based on the materials submitted to it.

[Brad Johnson]

So let's see...

The law schools shifted from rewarding students because of their financial status to reawarding the students who score best on the indicators of what will make them good attorneys, and everyone is upset about that why...?  By rewarding good students with further opportunities for education you get better students. 

Throwing money at someone because of their economic status and not because of their proven ability to provide a result has another name.  Welfare.

Brad

[T.O.M.]

So let's see...

The law schools shifted from rewarding students because of their financial status to reawarding the students who score best on the indicators of what will make them good attorneys, and everyone is upset about that why...?  By rewarding good students with further opportunities for education you get better students. 

Throwing money at someone because of their economic status and not because of their proven ability to provide a result has another name.  Welfare.

Brad

I wouldn't have a problem with performance based scholarships if the playing field was level for everyone going in.  At the law school I attended, they had special academic assistance available for women and "students of color."  Study groups led by a couple of professors, study aids available at low/no cost.  As a white guy trying to work and attend school at the same time, none of that was available to me.  Add to that the administration changing the grades turned in by the professors to match their mandatory C curve, and it was a struggle to maintain a high enough GPA to keep a scholarship.