Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: brimic on January 05, 2015, 11:51:06 AM
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http://fox6now.com/2015/01/05/wearing-a-hoodie-in-oklahoma-could-soon-cost-you-500/
OKLAHOMA (CNN) — It could soon be illegal for people in Oklahoma to wear clothing that covers their faces, including hooded sweatshirts.
It’s already illegal to wear such clothing during the commission of a crime, but a Republican State Senator has introduced an amendment to ban people from hiding their identity in public in general.
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From the article, the bill at least provides exemptions for religious, medical and weather-related uses of face coverings.
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;/ Really? There's nothing more important to be done than to ban "hoodies? Atleast Geraldo Rivera will be happy ...... [popcorn] >:D >:D
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From the article, the bill at least provides exemptions for religious, medical and weather-related uses of face coverings.
In short, it could be 120F out and you can wear your hoodie and simply tell any cops you're doing it because you're cold. Or it could be one of those new moisture-wicking doo-rags that you wet as a sort of personal swamp cooler.
*sigh*, and I want FEWER useless laws on the books. Tell him he can have it when it also arranges to repeal three other useless laws.
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;/
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I bought an Erlenmeyer flask from Amazon last week. They said it was illegal to ship to Texas without a "Precursor Chemical Laboratory Apparatus NAR-120" permit. :police:
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This actually was brought up at my COC, http://okcoc.com/, yesterday. The biker community has been fighting stupid laws like this for awhile now. Same two clowns that are bringing this forward tried to get a law passed awhile ago stating that if 3 or more people were together and dressed similar it could constitute a gang. :facepalm: It didn't go anywhere and I don't see this one going anywhere either, but I will be writing my state Senator and Representatives to vote against this stupidity.
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Same two clowns that are bringing this forward tried to get a law passed awhile ago stating that if 3 or more people were together and dressed similar it could constitute a gang.
I'm in favor of it as long as there's no police exemption.
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I'm in favor of it as long as there's no police exemption.
It died because of the broad stroke that could be used to paint people as a gang, too many things to consider.
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It died because of the broad stroke that could be used to paint people as a gang, too many things to consider.
Indeed. Mormons could be considered a gang by that definition.
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Indeed. Mormons could be considered a gang by that definition.
Me, my brother, and our dad could be as well. :(
As can church-goers, many ethnic minorities(Jews, Muslims, Sikhs, etc...) with a dress requirement, etc...
Crime is dropping people, we don't need to keep ratcheting down on the stupidity.
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Indeed. Mormons could be considered a gang by that definition.
Private schools, the Texas Aggie corp of cadets (or *any* ROTC group, for that matter)... basically anyone following a dress code.
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I remember Cali trying something similar to the "gang" thing a number of years ago
Is VERY similar to the idiocy in Australia right now
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Crime is dropping people, we don't need to keep ratcheting down on the stupidity.
Spoilsport. I want to see the constables (all dressed alike) trying to arrest the sheriff's deputies (all dressed alike) while they're trying to arrest the local PD (all dressed alike) and the state troopers (all dressed alike) trying to round everybody else up, while the National Guard (all dressed alike) tries to decide who to help.
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I like how you think, and am interested in subscribing to your newsletter
[popcorn]
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Spoilsport. I want to see the constables (all dressed alike) trying to arrest the sheriff's deputies (all dressed alike) while they're trying to arrest the local PD (all dressed alike) and the state troopers (all dressed alike) trying to round everybody else up, while the National Guard (all dressed alike) tries to decide who to help.
Can they all wear swat team balaclavas while doing so?
Further, with a law that makes face coverings illegal, can we assume that the armed masked men breaking down the neighbor's front door are a criminal gang (maybe MS-13??!!), and that we should come to the neighbor's aid- with all of the lethal force necessary?
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*sigh*, and I want FEWER useless laws on the books. Tell him he can have it when it also arranges to repeal three other useless laws.
I would like to see this.
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The party of personal responsibility and small government folks!
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Hate to rain on the parade with reality
http://www.vocativ.com/usa/race/oklahoma-hoodie-ban/
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Hate to rain on the parade with reality
http://www.vocativ.com/usa/race/oklahoma-hoodie-ban/
You *love* to rain on our parades. That's what you do. ;)
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You *love* to rain on our parades. That's what you do. ;)
Article is retarded. Current law: can't wear a hoodie while committing a crime. Proposed law: can't wear a hoodie if the cops think you're trying to conceal your identity with it. Article: herp derp that's the same thing durr.
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Was there an exception for Halloween?
Heavy use of face paint can nearly have the same effect.
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I bought an Erlenmeyer flask from Amazon last week. They said it was illegal to ship to Texas without a "Precursor Chemical Laboratory Apparatus NAR-120" permit. :police:
I had those flasks when I was a kid - they came with my chemistry set.
BTW, little ziploc baggies are restricted in Chicago - they're used to package crack.
And then there are coffee cans . . .
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Not exactly lil zip loc baggies . Or at least not baggies you put anything other than crack meth or high dollar smoke in.
There was a liquor store used to sell hundreds of tiny cups of boiling hot water to the junkies every nite in dc . 50 cents for 2 ounces of boiling water
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What do they do with the boiling water? Probably not instant espresso
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Instead of cooking your dope to get maximum amount dissolved , which means the coos vp can see your lighter , you just dump the dope in suck it into the set and run it. Typically in the ally right behind the store. It more than covered their rent
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Not exactly lil zip loc baggies . Or at least not baggies you put anything other than crack meth or high dollar smoke in.
Oh, then we should ban that, then.
I love this idea of requiring three laws to be repealed, to get a new one passed. Some such language should definitely be amended to every constitution extant. We'd repeal three amendments to each of those, of course. For the Feds, it would be the 16th, 17th, and either the 19th or 14th.
Same two clowns that are bringing this forward tried to get a law passed awhile ago stating that if 3 or more people were together and dressed similar it could constitute a gang.
Of course, the politicians voting for it would all be wearing suits. =| It's certainly a strange contrast to the dress code kerfuffle in the Montana legislature. =)
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I had those flasks when I was a kid - they came with my chemistry set.
BTW, little ziploc baggies are restricted in Chicago - they're used to package crack.
And then there are coffee cans . . .
One small businessman lost everything he had and went to prison because the feds decided that they didn't like vials his company was manufacturing.
http://www.fear.org/gulag3.html
http://reason.com/archives/1995/05/01/a-vial-crime
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Interesting piece. Bears lil resemblance to what he plead guilty to and admitted in court though. Imagine that.
http://articles.philly.com/1993-12-31/news/25941221_1_vials-drug-dealers-federal-agents
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Interesting piece. Bears lil resemblance to what he plead guilty to and admitted in court though. Imagine that.
http://articles.philly.com/1993-12-31/news/25941221_1_vials-drug-dealers-federal-agents
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You realize that he lost everything he had through forfeiture and did prison time for making....vials?
*expletive deleted*ing vials.
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In the war against some drugs this is totally consistent. He was aiding and abetting drug traffickers.
What a big fat juicy plum it was also! Look how much was gained in forfeiture!
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He confessed to and plead guilty to knowing what he was doing as well as some pretty serious money laundering to cover up. Funny how his version of events changed . I am deeply concerned a russian failed that badly at laundering money. Keeping 800 k at home is a dead give away
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The wealthy manufacturer apparently didn't question why his associates wanted the vials packaged in plastic bags marked "made in Taiwan."
But he eventually learned how the vials were being used, he admitted yesterday.
In February 1991, Edelson and another associate were arrested on the New Jersey Turnpike with about 1.5 million crack vials made at Vortex.
The following May, police and federal agents seized about 9 million vials, $300,000 cash, and other drug paraphernalia from a Philadelphia businessman, Rony Moshe, the ring's biggest customer.
Belkin and Edelson told Zhadanov of the raid on Moshe, and of Edelson's arrest and conviction in New Jersey on drug paraphernalia charges and "of the
drug-related use of the vials," prosecutors say.
Nevertheless, production continued, and steps were taken to cover up the operation, primarily by laundering income to conceal its source.
- See more at: http://articles.philly.com/1993-12-31/news/25941221_1_vials-drug-dealers-federal-agents#sthash.JcYNtyyY.dpuf
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You realize that by that standard, plumbing parts are bomb making materials, spoons in your kitchen drawer, a bic lighter on your dresser, snack sized ziplocks in your pantry, and a reloading scale in your workshop are drug paraphenalia and all point towards criminal conspiracy? Hopefully you don't have any cash, jewelry, coins or other valuables in a safe or safe deposit box because those items are sure signs of money laundering and need to be 'arrested.'
You will plead guilty to money laundering and criminal conspiracy and whatever other bogus charges are dealt to youbecause the other deal the feds will give you is life in prison, and they will lie, manufacture evidence, and intimidate witnesses to ensure that they win and you have no recourse.
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You realize that at the point where you know the guys building bombs and sell them to him anyway you become guilty of selling him bomb parts. And that hiding the money just helps prove the prosecutions case
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You realize that at the point where you know the guys building bombs and sell them to him anyway you become guilty of selling him bomb parts. And that hiding the money just helps prove the prosecutions case
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So a manufacturer who makes iron pipes should go to prison because his product is being used to make pipe bombs? I see...
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I doubt greatly you see but in real life at the point where I know you are using it to make pipe bombs I become guilty. Waving my hands and saying "I'm a libertarian!" Is not an affirmative defense.
And if I got to great lengths to hide the money I get paid because I know it's wrong I just make it easy in the prosecution.
Similarly if I drive a truck when I find out that they are loading my truck with crack I lose my right to claim " I was just driving the truck . Don't put confuse that bull in the first narrative with the facts the russian admitted to when he plead guilty.
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If the vials were sold to a distributor and ended up in the hands of crack dealers, I would be more likely to side with the manufacturer. However, CS&D's side of the story sounds like he more or less became part of the drug manufacturing operation and was an accessory.
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Goes way back
http://articles.philly.com/1992-05-31/news/26013640_1_vials-crack-caps
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Zhadanov also agreed to forfeit his interest in the cash and in the Metuchen plant, a property worth more than $500,000, half of which will go to the government, prosecutors say.
The guilty plea was a way for Zhadanov to cut his losses.
His was no slap-on-the-wrist drug paraphernalia case.
Zhadanov was facing a mandatory minimum 10-year prison term, up to life.
By pleading guilty and informing on others, he expects to win a reduced sentence.
Seems like a fair deal- plead guilty to 'money laundering' give up everything you own, and get 5 less years in a federal penetentiary.
Having cash =/= money laundering, unless the feds want that money and confiscate it. Hey, its great to be king and make the rules as you go!
Or is having cash on hand illegal?
Not to mention he was from Russia, where its reasonable to assume that he doesn't trust banks much.
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If the vials were sold to a distributor and ended up in the hands of crack dealers, I would be more likely to side with the manufacturer. However, CS&D's side of the story sounds like he more or less became part of the drug manufacturing operation and was an accessory.
Yes, but show me where he manufactured drugs...
Actually, show me the crime he committed.
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I think we did. In fact the prosecution got him to admit he knew and hid the money as part of the coverup. And that's why he plead guilty. He took a shot at big easy money he got caught. If in fact he had not known he would have a case and you would have a good point. Unfortunately the reality was not that.
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I think we did. In fact the prosecution got him to admit he knew and hid the money as part of the coverup. And that's why he plead guilty. He took a shot at big easy money he got caught. If in fact he had not known he would have a case and you would have a good point. Unfortunately the reality was not that.
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Once again, having cash on hand =/= money laundering, even large amounts of it.
Plea bargaining- you know what that is right?
Admitting to a superfluous crime in order to avoid a larger penalty...
There exists a possibility that he kept his books in order, never cheated his taxes, but plead guilty of doing so because he was coerced by a federal prosecutor.
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Is it okay for the government to steal from somebody just because they're a bad guy? I don't think it's a simple answer. What actually happened to the $800,000?
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Although they did not have a search warrant, the agents looked through the apartment, ostensibly doing a "security sweep," and discovered a safe in the bedroom. Anna Zhadanov says one of the agents ordered her to open it (the government says he simply "asked" her to do so). The safe contained several shoe boxes, which the agent asked her to open. She refused and closed the safe. The agents later obtained a search warrant and seized about $800,000 in cash from the safe.
Eli Zhadanov notes that his parents come from a culture where there is nothing inherently suspicious about keeping large amounts of cash. The Zhadanovs say about $200,000 of the money belonged to relatives. The balance came from the cash payments that Vortex received from Srebrianski and from Belkin and Edelson over the course of two-and-a-half years. But the Zhadanovs say less than half of that, about $280,000, represents profit. Sam Zhadanov covered expenses for the Belkin and Edelson job with money from other customers that he deposited in Vortex's bank account.
Zhadanov says he did not deposit the cash in the bank because he was afraid it would raise questions about the source, and Belkin and Edelson did not want to be named. Instead, he planned to spend the money on new equipment that he would need to make plastic Scrabble pieces for Milton Bradley. (The Zhadanovs have the prototype for the game pieces and price quotations for the equipment.) Since he intended to reinvest the money in his business, he did not consider it unreported income. The IRS, of course, has a different view, though the agency chose not to bring criminal charges.
In addition to the money from the safe, the government seized the Zhadanovs' personal bank accounts, Vortex's bank account, the factory, the equipment, and the land on which it was located--$1.5 million to $2 million in assets. The government argued that all of this property either represented the proceeds of illegal activity or helped facilitate illegal activity. If drug dealers sold crack and used the proceeds to buy vials from retailers, who paid Belkin and Edelson, who paid Srebrianski, who then paid Vortex, this money then contaminated any bank accounts into which it was deposited. Furthermore, all of the assets associated with Vortex can be said to have facilitated the production of the vials (thereby facilitating the distribution of crack) or to have helped launder the proceeds of illegal activity.
Thus, in the government's view, everything the Zhadanovs had achieved was tainted by the order from Belkin and Edelson. Indeed, in testimony before a federal grand jury in Philadelphia, a DEA agent suggested that Vortex had been established to serve the needs of crack dealers. On November 12, 1992, DEA Special Agent Ellis Hershowitz testified: "This company [Vortex]--our indications of it, it hasn't been in operation all that long. As of the time of the interview, they were just ordering equipment in the early part of '91 through D-M-E Corporation. And it's our understanding that they were just getting started out then. Our impression is that they went into business for the purpose of manufacturing these vials because they knew they could make a lot of money doing it."
Even the IRS didn't find anything criminal about how he was handling his money.
You rah rah! Goooooo drug warriors!!!
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Even the IRS didn't find anything criminal about how he was handling his money.
You rah rah! Goooooo drug warriors!!!
By the logic they're using there, if a doper buys a lighter from WalMart, then WM should have all of its assets seized.
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By the logic they're using there, if a doper buys a lighter from WalMart, then WM should have all of its assets seized.
Yes, its the same logic that gun banners use.
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We're all guilty of something :police:
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To get back to the OP: this bill could easily be turned to the good. Just amend it so that, instead of banning the garment itself, it bans the word "hoodie." Surely we can all agree that has to go.
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Even the IRS didn't find anything criminal about how he was handling his money.
You rah rah! Goooooo drug warriors!!!
Again you overlook that he acknowledged in court under oath the source of the money and his rationale for concealing it.
I don't blame you for that it does not fit your narrative. His co conspirators also corroborated his complicity. Big easy money is tempting but can have big consequences
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Again you overlook that he acknowledged in court under oath the source of the money and his rationale for concealing it.
I don't blame you for that it does not fit your narrative. His co conspirators also corroborated his complicity. Big easy money is tempting but can have big consequences
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The only thing he did wrong was stuff the money into his mattress instead of using a bank- hardly illegal, but is definately seizure RICO bait.
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As someone who has a bit of experience with plastics and molding*, those molds aren't cheap. Most were tens of thousands of dollars to make. (Granted it sounded like in this story the guy made his own molds, but still, not cheap.) We even had a couple that had cost over $100k. And we had a mold designer in house, that was just the cost to make the mold itself.
We would lease production time from either injection or blowing molding companies and had them use our proprietary molds to make our products. When the contract was done, the molds came back (and they are HEAVY as all hell.)
So I've been looking at numbers and I don't see how many vials were in a case. Then I could figure out how much money he made (at $250 per case) selling these.
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The two times the cops caught the co conspirators the total seized was big. 7 figures. I think they sell wholesale for under2 cents each
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The two times the cops caught the co conspirators the total seized was big. 7 figures. I think they sell wholesale for under2 cents each
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9 million vials at $.02 is $180,000, but that's not what Belkin and Edelson paid for them. That what they sold them to the retail stores for.
The story stated Zhadanov was getting $250 a case, but it doesn't say how many were in a case. That's the key number, then we could out if all that $800k in his safe was all or some of money from the vials.
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40 million if he got 2 cents each 80 if he got a penny. Seems pretty easy considering how many years. Gotta add in the value of the real,estate etc that was seized. It's a classic case of how a lil lie grew. And greed leading you astray
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