Author Topic: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"  (Read 11807 times)

Monkeyleg

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"Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« on: November 18, 2011, 11:28:54 PM »
The title of this thread is also the title of a column by Milwaukee Journal Sentinel Community Columnist Sherry Schultz. In the column, she objects to the lavish amounts of money spent by the rich---in particular the amounts spent by Kim Kardashian (whoever she is) on her own wedding.

There are the usual complaints about the origins of Kardashian's wealth, all of which are variations of the "she/he/them didn't invent penicillin or cure cancer" theme, implying that only those who do something historic are deserving of anything more than Wonder Bread. I suppose Bill Clinton would fall into that special category, having made presidential history with an intern and cigar in the Oval Office, but I digress.

She then suggests that everyone "stop contributing to the delinquency of our paychecks with out celebrity support", without explaining how her or my or your paychecks are delinquent. More to the point, she doesn't explain how withholding money from the wealthy will make her life, yours or mine better.

Ms. Schultz is a realtor. If the wealthy somehow have money kept from them, they will spend less. Less will be spent on cars, impacting auto workers, who will then not be able to spend money on homes, etc, etc. She misses the circuitous route that money takes from the bank accounts of the wealthy to the mortgage closing office to the paycheck she receives.

This all seems so obvious that I simply cannot understand how those like Ms. Schultz think, and she probably says the same about you and me.

The column is here.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2011, 11:52:57 PM by Monkeyleg »

Perd Hapley

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2011, 11:33:26 PM »
She should be happy. K-Ko* got divorced, right? Divorces are good for the real estate business.

*Does anyone call her K-Ko? They should. Unless there is a better nickname out there.
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Monkeyleg

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2011, 11:56:19 PM »
Absolutely. Think of all of the money that will be spent on attorneys, legal clerks, bureaucrats, private detectives, moving companies, and, of course, realtors. Some could even find its way to her.

Why is this obvious to me, and presumably you, but not to her? How in the world can people think so differently about a subject that almost seems like a natural law?  It would be like arguing with someone who says that water flows uphill.

Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2011, 02:10:47 AM »
Quote
Does anyone call her K-Ko? They should. Unless there is a better nickname out there.
I think Kiki works better. 

I think she's saying to stop buying tabloids and caring about the lives of the rich and profligate, since this tabloid-buying ends up helping out their cause. Thus the fame of Paris and Kiki (and the wealth of Kiki). She's using standard socialist jargon to get her audience to agree.

longeyes

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2011, 11:07:20 AM »
How about Kah-Kah?

It's not just about the circulation of money.  You can have a vibrant economy and a sick culture.   Check out Neil Postman's Amusing Ourselves to Death.
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grampster

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2011, 12:25:45 PM »
Most of the people that I notice that squawk about wealthy people who indulge themselves because they can, are mostly in two groups.  1.  Those who are too lazy to work hard enough or risk enough to become wealthy themselves and resent those who do.  2.  Those who have had somewhat of a privileged upbringing and usually wind up falling into category one.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2011, 01:23:26 PM »
As a person who worked at one point translating Entertainment Channel shows:

You realize you can just ignore these people, right?

I've managed to do this for years, mostly not due to any deliberate effort but due to not really being interested.
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Sergeant Bob

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2011, 01:29:54 PM »
K-Kar. [ar15]
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
I meet lots of folks like this, claim to be anarchist but really they're just liberals with pierced genitals. - gunsmith

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Perd Hapley

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2011, 04:24:20 PM »
When she's bemoaning the amounts of money we spend on sex-tape tycoons and athletes, I'm right there with her. It's dumb. But why does she care how much K-Kar's dress cost her? And what does she mean about paying to watch TV, and "delinquent paychecks"? I think K-Kar could write a letter that makes more sense than this.
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Monkeyleg

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2011, 05:45:01 PM »
I had arguments about this with my father for years and years, usually over breakfast at a greasy spoon. He'd say, "Oprah doesn't need that much money" or "Brett Favre doesn't need that much money". (He couldn't stand Oprah or athletes, although he did have the hots for Barbara Eden when he was in his 80's).

I'd try to explain to him that these people had talents that, while perhaps not as useful as those of computer engineers like him, were nevertheless in demand, and received money commensurate with that demand. If nobody cared whether you could host your TV show, you wouldn't make money. If people were setting aside an hour every day to watch your show, you would make money. Simple as that.

He didn't buy it, and thought the government should regulate how much someone could make. I'd tell him that, if that's the case, it ultimately comes down to one person who makes the call, and asked who that person should be. Of course he said it should be him.

The above is a long way of saying that it's always going to be arbitrary and capricious to say that some person doesn't really need or deserve to make a certain amount of money.  Richard Teerlink, the now retired CEO of Harley Davidson, made hundreds of millions of dollars. Was he worth it? He certainly was to the employees when he and two other executives brought the company back from near-bankruptcy in 1984.

Where income has been regulated, it's always been the regulators who've made the real money.

MechAg94

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2011, 09:00:06 PM »
Where income has been regulated, it's always been the regulators who've made the real money.
Yep, just moving the wealth to people that are even more undeserving. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Hutch

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2011, 11:58:00 AM »
Hells bells, I had a crush on Jeannie when I was 8!
"My limited experience does not permit me to appreciate the unquestionable wisdom of your decision"

Seems like every day, I'm forced to add to the list of people who can just kiss my hairy ass.

Monkeyleg

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #12 on: November 20, 2011, 12:41:53 PM »
Quote
Hells bells, I had a crush on Jeannie when I was 8!

I had a brief crush on her when I was a kid, too.

That's a little bit different than an 80-something year-old man collecting photos and videotapes of all of the "I Dream of Jeannie" episodes and every movie she ever made (which can't be a long list). He also had nude photos of her, which I was amazed even existed. I would think the studio would have vetted her as part of the morals contract before giving her the part, to make sure she didn't have things such as those photos circulating.

I hope I'm still that horny when I'm in my 80's. ;)

Mannlicher

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #13 on: November 20, 2011, 07:17:49 PM »
I kinda like rich folks.  They are good for the economy.

longeyes

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2011, 08:50:32 PM »
Bad money drives out good, and bad millionaires drive out good millionaires.  If we really believe that we are going to stay prosperous by lionizing lobbyists, crony capitalists, and sex-tape reality stars, we are kidding ourselves.  That's not being moralistic, it's just recognizing where real wealth comes from and where it doesn't.  Short-term the damage is/has been invisible; over the long term the moral underpinnings of wealth creation matter. 
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MicroBalrog

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2011, 11:11:01 PM »
Bad money drives out good, and bad millionaires drive out good millionaires.  If we really believe that we are going to stay prosperous by lionizing lobbyists, crony capitalists, and sex-tape reality stars, we are kidding ourselves.  That's not being moralistic, it's just recognizing where real wealth comes from and where it doesn't.  Short-term the damage is/has been invisible; over the long term the moral underpinnings of wealth creation matter. 

Wealth creation = selling people things they want to buy. I want to buy sex tapes.  K.Kardashian produces them.

Lobbyists and crony capitalists point guns at other people to make them pay them money or buy their product. See if you can spot the reason why Kim Kardashian is a moral titan compared to, say, the current Secretary of Justice.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2011, 11:42:50 PM »
Lobbyists...point guns at other people to make them pay them money or buy their product.

[scratches head]


lobbyist
[ˈlɒbɪɪst]
n
(Government, Politics & Diplomacy) a person employed by a particular interest to lobby


lob·by  (lb)
n. pl. lob·bies
1. A hall, foyer, or waiting room at or near the entrance to a building, such as a hotel or theater.
2. A public room next to the assembly chamber of a legislative body.
3. A group of persons engaged in trying to influence legislators or other public officials in favor of a specific cause


How's that again?  ???
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MicroBalrog

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2011, 11:49:40 PM »
We both know what kind of lobbyist longeyes referred to - the sort of lobbyist that lobbies to alter laws to benefit some interest group or corporation. Sadly the professional lobbyists working for freedom interests are only a very tiny minority.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Monkeyleg

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2011, 11:57:31 PM »
Strings, AJDual, I and other cheesehead members of this forum acted as lobbyists for the CCW bill in three legislative sessions. We were pushing a bill that was opposed by a sizable chunk of Wisconsin's population. We did nothing wrong, though.

It's a shame that the word has acquired such an ugly connotation.

Perd Hapley

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2011, 12:11:22 AM »
Yup. As we know, "special interest" is defined as, "someone who disagrees with you."  =)
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MicroBalrog

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2011, 12:16:57 AM »
Strings, AJDual, I and other cheesehead members of this forum acted as lobbyists for the CCW bill in three legislative sessions. We were pushing a bill that was opposed by a sizable chunk of Wisconsin's population. We did nothing wrong, though.

It's a shame that the word has acquired such an ugly connotation.

And you know full well I've never said anything about "every lobbyist". The average, OTOH, has its reputation for a reason.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

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Monkeyleg

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2011, 12:25:14 AM »
The NRA has a reputation for being one of the strongest lobbies in DC. Are they deserving of being in the "average" you're referring to?

I'm not saying there aren't sleazy lobbyists representing sleazy interests. I just question how any numbers can be known or even how "sleazy" can be quantified.

KD5NRH

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #22 on: November 21, 2011, 12:30:18 AM »
That's a little bit different than an 80-something year-old man collecting photos and videotapes of all of the "I Dream of Jeannie" episodes and every movie she ever made (which can't be a long list). He also had nude photos of her, which I was amazed even existed.

Not in the first page or two of Google Image Search.  Did you happen to get any copies?

MicroBalrog

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #23 on: November 21, 2011, 12:39:25 AM »
The NRA has a reputation for being one of the strongest lobbies in DC. Are they deserving of being in the "average" you're referring to?

I'm not saying there aren't sleazy lobbyists representing sleazy interests. I just question how any numbers can be known or even how "sleazy" can be quantified.

What kind of lobbyists do you think Longeyes has been talking about? Do you think he meant a kind of insult to you or any of these individuals you praise?

I certainly didn't and I apologize if you think this is what I meant.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Monkeyleg

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Re: "Stop enabling the excesses of the rich and famous"
« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2011, 01:02:00 AM »
No, MicroBalrog, I didn't think he was insulting me or anyone here. It just seems like a broad brush.

KD5NRH, my brother and I just tossed them. I didn't think about what, if any, value they would have. I was more concerned with the piles of other stuff my brother and I still had to go through.