Interesting article on the dangers of GPS jamming

[Balog]

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20202-gps-chaos-how-a-30-box-can-jam-your-life.html?page=1

I wasn't aware how many things depend on GPS. Somewhat concerning overall.

[Nick1911]

Indeed.

And, GPS jammers are now easy to come by.

Here's on for sale: http://www.dealextreme.com/p/qh-1-high-power-gps-l1-signal-jammer-blocker-with-ac-car-charger-1565-1575-mhz-55872

Costs $27 shipped from china.

[MicroBalrog]

1. Are military systems protected against this?

2. Does this work on GLONASS navigation?

[Hawkmoon]

Typical -- Europe sees that the answer is enhanced LORAN, while the U.S. is busy deactivating all legacy LORAN stations. In fact, I think they finished phasing them out last year.

And to think -- I sold my sextant when I sold my last sailboat. I wonder if you can even buy a sextant any more.  -- or the books of tables that go with them.

[230RN]

I was also concerned with the idea that time stamp spoofers could manipulate stock market buy orders to a few seconds before a stock started to rise.  Or sell orders if they fall.

I gotta go turn my hourglass over now.

And I still have a slide rule and know how to use it.

Terry, 230RN

[RoadKingLarry]

Something about putting all your eggs in one basket comes to mind.

[KD5NRH]

And to think -- I sold my sextant when I sold my last sailboat. I wonder if you can even buy a sextant any more.  -- or the books of tables that go with them.

Under $100: http://sargentwelch.com/product.asp?pn=IG0041788&sid=mercent&mr:trackingCode=7FAD110E-8036-DF11-A0C8-002219318F67&mr:referralID=NA
Under $200: http://www.landfallnavigation.com/-nd026.html?cmp=froogle&kw=-nd026&utm_source=-nd026&utm_medium=shopping%2Bengine&utm_campaign=froogle
Under $300: http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_11151_10001_11059_-1?cid=chanintel_google&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=11059
Way over $300: http://www.amazon.com/Navigation-MS-733-Sextant-Horizon/dp/B000IMWYOK

I've thought about picking up this set: http://www.landfallnavigation.com/kcnb.html

[MechAg94]

Just how effective are GPS jammers?  Do they effectively jam the signal in an area or does it just screw with the accuracy?

[Nick1911]

Just how effective are GPS jammers?  Do they effectively jam the signal in an area or does it just screw with the accuracy?

Jam signals totally.  GPS chips can't hear anything from the sats.

[AJ Dual]

Yep. Several available on DealExtreme and similar Chinese gadget sites.

[MechAg94]

Jam signals totally.  GPS chips can't hear anything from the sats.

I guess I was thinking about how much coverage one would have. 

Why hasn't the US seen this on the battlefield more?

[roo_ster]

I guess I was thinking about how much coverage one would have. 

Why hasn't the US seen this on the battlefield more?

It is a radio signal.  Hellooooo HARM!

Also, they are not so useful for insurgents, relative to regular army opponents.

[HankB]

I guess I was thinking about how much coverage one would have.  

Why hasn't the US seen this on the battlefield more?

I remember that Saddam Hussein had some Russian-made GPS jammers he used during Desert Storm. The official line is that they were "ineffective" in disabling or mistargeting GPS-enabled smart bombs and missles. There was a brief flurry of stories about the vulnerablilty of future US smart weapons to GPS jamming technology, then - silence.

Here's a link to a 2003 story:  http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,81917,00.html

There are times I wouldn't mind a device to jam cellphones, but I'm probably on enough lists already - I'm not interested in adding my name to a group of people who bought illicit items from shady ChiCom companies . . .

It is a radio signal.  Hellooooo HARM!

Jammer: $30. HARM?

[TommyGunn]

Jammer: $30. HARM?

It's an anti-radiation missile .... that means it will seek out sources of radiation .... like a GPS jammer for instance. 

[Nick1911]

There are times I wouldn't mind a device to jam cellphones, but I'm probably on enough lists already - I'm not interested in adding my name to a group of people who bought illicit items from shady ChiCom companies .

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/36w-high-powered-cell-phone-blocker-jammer-3g-gms-cdma-dcs-phs-11510

Pay with a prepaid credit card. 

[Regolith]

It's an anti-radiation missile .... that means it will seek out sources of radiation .... like a GPS jammer for instance. 

I think he was saying it isn't very cost effective.  A HARM missile probably costs several thousand dollars $870,000, compared to $30 for a GPS jammer.

[Northwoods]

It's an anti-radiation missile .... that means it will seek out sources of radiation .... like a GPS jammer for instance.  

I think he knows what a HARM is.  He was asking the cost of one.  IIRC the cost of a similarly performing and technologically capable missile from my Raytheon days was ~$100-200k.  But that's been a while so that's more of a SWAG than anything else.

[TommyGunn]

I think he knows what a HARM is.  He was asking the cost of one.  IIRC the cost of a similarly performing and technologically capable missile from my Raytheon days was ~$100-200k.  But that's been a while so that's more of a SWAG than anything else.

I think he was saying it isn't very cost effective.  A HARM missile probably costs several thousand dollars $870,000, compared to $30 for a GPS jammer.

OK.

[roo_ster]

Any GPS jammer powerful enough to keep a JDAM or any other GPS-guided munition from turning you into itty bits is going to cost more than $30 and won;t be bought off ebay.

Think about it:

Lethal blast area of warhead = X meters
CEP of munition with GPS = Y meters (which these days is less than X)
CEP of munition w/o GPS from drop/shot to target location = Y+something meters
CEP of munition when its last update was only 100 meters above your head cause you bought the $30 chicom GPS jammer and then hacked it to increase its power by 10X is still = Y meters (or close enough so that you won't care, 'casue you'll still be dead even if the jammer "works" as advertised)

Any GPS jammer that is powerful enough to really work is gonna cost some bucks and is well worth a HARM to kill it and/or its operators.

[MicroBalrog]

I'm almost certain that military GPS systems utilize some different bandwidth/frequency from civilian GPS, and are probably better in terms of accuracy.

JDAM still has inertial guidance that CANNOT be jammed, period, and that will ride down your throat with pinpoint accuracy.

[Hawkmoon]

I've thought about picking up this set: http://www.landfallnavigation.com/kcnb.html

Good GRIEF!

I had one of those sextants. It's PLASTIC, fer Gawd's sake. I think I paid all of $15 or $20 for it. They're claiming that "kit" is worth $300 and that it's a bargain at $215? And the other guys are asking that for just the sextant?

Wanna buy a bridge?

[TechMan]

I was also concerned with the idea that time stamp spoofers could manipulate stock market buy orders to a few seconds before a stock started to rise.  Or sell orders if they fall.

I gotta go turn my hourglass over now.

And I still have a slide rule and know how to use it.

Terry, 230RN

What about your abacus?   

[PTK]

Good GRIEF!

I had one of those sextants. It's PLASTIC, fer Gawd's sake. I think I paid all of $15 or $20 for it. They're claiming that "kit" is worth $300 and that it's a bargain at $215? And the other guys are asking that for just the sextant?

Wanna buy a bridge?

I found those locally for ~$170, if I recall right. Still highway robbery, even with decent optics.

[sanglant]

you should be able to rest easy on the stock market, computers don't reset the clock at the second. at most it's once an hour. and i'll bet once a day if not start up. not that that means some fool hasn't, tweaked the system for "better" time keeping. i'd worry more about groups with a lot of cash(talking billions here) deciding to try to trash the exchanges. remember the frozen OJ gag in trading places? opps. i mean don't worry, nothing bad can ever happen in the US. Katie said so.

and speaking of shady chi-com sites, anybody order a good balloon popping laser lately?

[KD5NRH]

I had one of those sextants. It's PLASTIC, fer Gawd's sake. I think I paid all of $15 or $20 for it. They're claiming that "kit" is worth $300 and that it's a bargain at $215? And the other guys are asking that for just the sextant?

Here you go; nothing to upset your plastic allergy: http://www.landfallnavigation.com/nc1609.html?cmp=froogle&kw=nc1609&utm_source=nc1609&utm_medium=shopping%2Bengine&utm_campaign=froogle   

Plastics with the most useful properties of brass aren't hard to come by, and the weight savings is a good thing if you're going to be using it a lot.