Author Topic: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...  (Read 5031 times)

Hutch

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Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« on: October 21, 2010, 10:22:50 PM »
AFTER the break-in.  Kinda weird, took my S&W M60-10 in a $75 holster from my bedside table drawer, but left the holster on the bed.  Took an 870 out of the closet, but had to move a CX-4 Storm in an OBVIOUS soft case out of the way to do it.  Took my PS3, wifey's laptop, but left a $1500 telescope, on a tripod, in the sun room (the one they kicked the door in to).  Took a few pieces of jewelry, including a string of pearls, but left some much nicer pieces behind.  Left the safe and a butt-load of power tools alone in the garage.

Damn 'em. 
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Lennyjoe

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2010, 11:23:45 PM »
I'm guessing you didn't have a system? Or did you and it didn't stop them? We had ADT installed 3 weeks ago. Installation and equipment was free. $45 per month. Makes the wife feel better so its worth it. 

HeroHog

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2010, 11:52:11 PM »
Dang. I feel for ya. Did they trash your place too? They did when we were burglarized the 1st time. I never felt so violated and insecure... and MAD! I hope ya had serial numbers written down and photos along with a good home owners policy. Please keep us posted on how it all washes out. You are in our prayers.
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AJ Dual

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2010, 12:01:34 AM »
Bad as it was, you were probably lucky, sounds like an amateur hit, one of opportunity. Indicated by the hasty things like passing over bigger valuables to get at others that were more visible smacks of people who were more frightened/nervous over what they were doing.
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wmenorr67

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2010, 12:27:07 AM »
I'm guessing you didn't have a system? Or did you and it didn't stop them? We had ADT installed 3 weeks ago. Installation and equipment was free. $45 per month. Makes the wife feel better so its worth it. 

Do you have any memberships such as USAA, AAA or similar?  If so you can get your ADT discounted.  Not sure what the bill is but being a member of USAA has my ADT bill under $40.
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Lennyjoe

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2010, 01:15:56 AM »
Yep,USAA. Will call tomorrow to inquire.

Hutch

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2010, 12:13:17 PM »
Didn't trash the place, and as AJ said, they passed over a lot of loot, including a DSLR camera bag, telescope, obvious firearm in a soft-sided case NEXT TO THE 870 they took.  They knew I had a handgun in the bedside table drawer, and took it. During a phone call with the investigating detective, he said this was done by somone with inside knowledge, who was in the house very briefly.  Under questioning by the detective, I came up with one suspect, and shared that with them.  I'll be very interested to see what the cops turn up.

Does anyone have suggestions on makes/manufacturers of really sturdy doors and frames that will resist a kick-in?

Thanks...
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HeroHog

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2010, 07:31:48 PM »
There are lock plates that are oversize and use super long and stronger tensile strength screws than the norm. That with a double side keyed deadbolt in a solid wood or metal encased door are about the best combo there is. You can get it all at your nearest Lowe's.
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KD5NRH

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2010, 11:54:57 PM »
Call APX too.  See if you can get the two of them into a bidding war.  http://www.apxalarm.com/


Hutch

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2010, 06:54:19 PM »
I have a gun safe bolted to the concrete floor of the garage, and the Director of Operations (aka SWMBO) has decided that a wall safe in the bedroom is in order for convenience's sake, said safe to contain her bedside table revolver and jewelry while she's at work.  I think a largish "between the studs" safe located behind the door swing of the bedroom is on the immediate horizon.  Comments?
"My limited experience does not permit me to appreciate the unquestionable wisdom of your decision"

Seems like every day, I'm forced to add to the list of people who can just kiss my hairy ass.

sanglant

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2010, 07:31:24 PM »
i've been toying with the idea of a gun vault bolted to the bottom of a slat bed(wall side.) [tinfoil] bolts will fit between slats, and stick a sheet of plywood over the slats. counter sink the bolts, and it should be pretty sturdy. of course the real security in that setup comes from it being impossible to see from the room. =|

RevDisk

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2010, 01:23:23 PM »
I have a gun safe bolted to the concrete floor of the garage, and the Director of Operations (aka SWMBO) has decided that a wall safe in the bedroom is in order for convenience's sake, said safe to contain her bedside table revolver and jewelry while she's at work.  I think a largish "between the studs" safe located behind the door swing of the bedroom is on the immediate horizon.  Comments?


I do physical security stuff.   Rather than looking at just one issue (securing firearms, jewelry), I'd recommend taking a step back and assessing risk, total resources you wish to commit (does not have to be at one time, but a financial plan is a good idea), and what level of risk mitigation you wish to achieve.   Obviously, the comprehensive solution would be walls, moat, armed guards, etc.  But that's entirely disproportional to your risk, resources and level of risk mitigation likely desired. 

Your risk is somewhat high because of the likely inside threat.  Which means you should weigh "security through obscurity" as a less desired strategy (STO is not valid for information security in a lot of cases, it is routine in physical security), because it is possible that they may enter your home  in a routine setting.  In plain english, you'll need to focus on strategies that don't really matter if someone knows about them or not.  But it's not say, Beirut or "next to crackhouse" bad.  If the inside threat is caught, your risk will drop dramatically and you can adjust accordingly.

Re resource allocation, come up with a number for this entire project you can live with.  It can be time dependent (ie, $100 every other week, $5000 total ceiling, whatever).  Keep track of how much you spend.  Too much on one area of physical security removes resources from other areas, and the key to physical security is defense in depth. 

And finally, we get to the fun part, risk mitigation.   Focusing on one aspect (a couple safes) is not an optimum strategy.  Let's be honest, you won't put all of your important assets in the safe, and you'll on occasion forget to return assets to the safe.  You want a layered approach.  Doesn't have to be a one shot deal, continuous improvement is often the best course because of cash flow.  Take a look around your property and note the layout and vulnerabilities.  Windows with concealment aiding plants beneath it?   Flimsy doors?   Flimsy locks?  Flimsy door jamb?  Are your door hinges exposed?   Are you using standard removable pins in your hinges, or are you using security hinges?  Are the interior of your locks within arms reach of a glass exterior surface?  What do you think about putting a deadbolt on your bedroom door?  If you have a garage, is there a deadbolt on the door between the house and garage?  Do you have sliding glass doors?  Are your windows have pins?  Have you considered or quoted having a security film installed on any exterior glass surfaces?

(For the love of the Gods, do NOT post a comprehensive answer to the above questions here on a public web forum that is world readable.)


Monitoring alarm services are great for two purposes.  Discount on your home insurance, and giving you (or others) the feeling of security.  They add minimal actual security.  They get tripped off all the time by accident, and have very minimal priority response.  You'd have roughly 80% of the security enhancement of a comprehensive alarm system by putting up signs/stickers and a box within eye sight of the doors with blinky lights.  But if you believe that the monthly fees are worth the feeling of security, by all means, go with it.  You will gain a small measure of actual security by doing so.  But, far less than advertised or innately believed.

Again, I'd recommend taking a comprehensive risk mitigation consideration over looking for a "magic bullet" fix.  Yes, safes are a good idea.  But they are not the only idea.

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Boomhauer

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2010, 02:00:50 PM »
Quote
Monitoring alarm services are great for two purposes.  Discount on your home insurance, and giving you (or others) the feeling of security.  They add minimal actual security.  They get tripped off all the time by accident, and have very minimal priority response.  You'd have roughly 80% of the security enhancement of a comprehensive alarm system by putting up signs/stickers and a box within eye sight of the doors with blinky lights.  But if you believe that the monthly fees are worth the feeling of security, by all means, go with it.  You will gain a small measure of actual security by doing so.  But, far less than advertised or innately believed.

This. All alarm systems do is get tripped accidentally and thus piss off the cops that respond. And just about anything will set them off.



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AJ Dual

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2010, 03:56:50 PM »
One that calls YOU when the alarm goes off might be a better investment than one that's monitored by a service.
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Sawdust

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2010, 04:13:28 PM »
Quote
You'd have roughly 80% of the security enhancement of a comprehensive alarm system by putting up signs/stickers

I've thought of doing this; short of stealing one of my neighbor's alarm company signs, how would I get one?

Do alarm companies just sell their signs without installing a system?

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AJ Dual

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2010, 04:31:13 PM »
I've thought of doing this; short of stealing one of my neighbor's alarm company signs, how would I get one?

Do alarm companies just sell their signs without installing a system?

Sawdust

I would think that with the way any corporation holds to their branding, the answer is no.

However, eBay has all.

http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trksid=m570&_nkw=alarm+signs&_sacat=See-All-Categories

The name-brand ones seem a bit harder to come by though.

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=adt+signs&_sacat=0&_odkw=alarm+signs&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

I would at least back it up with a few of those sensors, even if not attached to anything, visible in window corners etc. on the first floor.
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KD5NRH

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2010, 06:01:41 PM »
This. All alarm systems do is get tripped accidentally and thus piss off the cops that respond. And just about anything will set them off.

Ours, for anything but a panic button, manual fire or duress trigger, calls us, then the neighbor before the police.  So far it hasn't had an actual false alarm, and the human error alarms have all been headed off before anything got dispatched.  To their credit, my cell phone rang before my wife could get to the panel when she forgot about the entry delay and assumed it hadn't been armed.  They were already listening to the live audio from the panel by that point, too, so they had a pretty good idea of what was going on.

RevDisk

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2010, 08:06:44 PM »
They were already listening to the live audio from the panel by that point, too, so they had a pretty good idea of what was going on.

Oh, forgot to mention that.  Monitored alarms setups, especially with audio pickups, work at the pleasure of someone outside your control.  Something to ponder. 
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KD5NRH

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2010, 08:32:54 PM »
Oh, forgot to mention that.  Monitored alarms setups, especially with audio pickups, work at the pleasure of someone outside your control.  Something to ponder.

Cellular signal detectors are handy.  An MP3 player with the headphones hooked on the alarm box makes a good bit of insurance if sensitive discussions are happening.


Hawkmoon

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2010, 11:25:27 PM »
I have a gun safe bolted to the concrete floor of the garage, and the Director of Operations (aka SWMBO) has decided that a wall safe in the bedroom is in order for convenience's sake, said safe to contain her bedside table revolver and jewelry while she's at work.  I think a largish "between the studs" safe located behind the door swing of the bedroom is on the immediate horizon.  Comments?

You don't think thieves will look behind the door?
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Hutch

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2010, 12:10:38 PM »
Sorry for the delay in response.

Yes, thieves will most assuredly notice the wall safe.  I realize that, given enough time, any defense measures I take (upgraded locks, a security door, a wall safe, gun safes, et ENDLESS cetera) can be defeated.  I simply want to make the risk and cost of taking my stuff higher than a "smash and grab" thief will be willing to pay.  If things generally deteriorate to the point that thieves are not afraid of the cops, pay no attention to the alert siren, ignore the signs, and so on, then I will be at home on the premises anyway.  So....

Internal safes

Hardened doors/jambs w/ double tumber deadbolts, in some cases two per door
Metal security outer door outside of most vulnerable door
Full-tilt-and-boogie home alarm set up, including remote monitoring of video, utility power, landline phone, glass break, motion detectors, driveway sensor, etc.

All I can do. 
"My limited experience does not permit me to appreciate the unquestionable wisdom of your decision"

Seems like every day, I'm forced to add to the list of people who can just kiss my hairy ass.

BridgeRunner

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2010, 12:12:19 PM »
Ha!  All that work and effort.  I have worked out the perfect solution.  Just don't own anything of value.  =D

RevDisk

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Re: Will see the ADT rep tomorrow...
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2010, 12:25:32 PM »
Sorry for the delay in response.

Yes, thieves will most assuredly notice the wall safe.  I realize that, given enough time, any defense measures I take (upgraded locks, a security door, a wall safe, gun safes, et ENDLESS cetera) can be defeated.  I simply want to make the risk and cost of taking my stuff higher than a "smash and grab" thief will be willing to pay.  If things generally deteriorate to the point that thieves are not afraid of the cops, pay no attention to the alert siren, ignore the signs, and so on, then I will be at home on the premises anyway.  So....

The more you make your place look unappetizing, the more likely they are to go somewhere else.  If they can't kick in the door or bust a window, they're going somewhere else.

Also, those steps buy YOU time if you happen to be home.  Buying you even 30 seconds can be a major difference.
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