Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Perd Hapley on September 17, 2009, 11:34:20 PM
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Click the link for the full story.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/religion/story/63C5936DF7DC18EE862576330010EF45?OpenDocument
Collora has worked for the grocery chain for 40 years and said he has displayed a crucifix at two other Schnucks stores he has managed — one on the Hill in south St. Louis and another in St. Charles — and has never had a complaint.
But some customers are reacting angrily to the new display. Lori Weinstock, 40, a health care professional from University City, was shopping a few weeks ago when, after paying, she looked up to see the crucifix.
"It startled me. It seemed so out of place," Weinstock, who is Jewish, said. She was startled enough to write a letter that was published last week in the newspaper the Jewish Light.
"It would have been equally startling if it had been a Star of David or an emblem of another religion," Weinstock said. "It's grocery shopping, and it should be welcoming to all and exclude none."
Collora says exclusion is not what he had in mind. The crucifix, he said, "is not meant to promote one faith over another. It's just an opportunity to share a part of myself and my life with people I work hard to serve every day."
Lori Willis, Schnucks communications director, said Collora was the only manager in the chain's 106 stores to have requested to display an article of personal faith.
"It's just another example of the disrespect that those without religion or those with minority religions get in our society," he said. "It's bad taste and bad business. Who wants to (shop) where someone else's faith is being pushed down your throat?"
That the display is a crucifix — an image of Jesus Christ nailed to the cross — and not just a plain cross, is of particular concern to some of Schnucks' Jewish customers. The cross bearing Christ's body has become a symbol of the Catholic Church, according to Ronald Modras, a theology professor at St. Louis University, while a cross without it has become a Protestant symbol.
"The cross is an ambiguous symbol which can mean one thing to one group and another to a different group," Modras said. "And for Jewish people (a crucifix) can mean, 'You are a Christ killer.'"
Two points to emphasize:
1. If you think a crucifix hanging on the wall means that you are being "excluded" or that religion is being shoved down your throat, that is your doing. It is all in your head. My favorite new restaurant down the street from me has Islamic stuff behind the counter. Help, help, I'm being oppressed. But boy do they have good shawarma.
2. I know Jews have been called Christ-killers, and that's very sad and stupid. I know it's a very sensitive issue. But to say that a crucifix offends you on those grounds? That's silly. You should have some pride, have some strength, and get on with your day.
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Freedom of religion, not freedom from religion.
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Lori Weinstock
She needs to take a ride on the wambulance. Don't like it? Shop elsewhere. This twit's begging for attention, I think.
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Not at all. She needs to keep shopping there, but seek counseling about that Imaginary Inquisition Syndrome.
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I managed to chew on falafel for dinner with my family, while sitting right next to the rack containing copies of the Muslim Yellow Pages! I won't even go into the Islamic religious symbols strewn about the place <shudders, while holding back tears>.
I just thank my lucky stars we got out of there before all the Muslims broke their Ramadan daily fast and hit the buffet line. Who knows what might have happened if there was a run on pita bread and I took the last round?!?!
I am not quite sure how we made it out of the restaurant without having had our heads sawn (sawed?) off, but it must have been a close-run thing!
Careful! Don't look too hards at the link, who knows what scary & delusional bogeyman might jump from the reptile part of your brain:
http://www.muslimyellowpages.com/
In all seriousness, if you are in Richardson/ N Dallas, you can get some wonderful eats here:
Afrah Pastries
314 E Main St
Richardson, TX 75081-6045
(972) 234-9898
I had a falafel pita sandwich with all the fixins, kids & wife had beef shish kebab pita sandwiches and we all shared the pita & hummus. No baklava, though, as the kids were not behaving well enough to deserve such a treat. Pistachio baklava is my favorite.
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Speaking as a member of a non-mainstream religion, allow me to simply say, some people need a few good swats with a clue bat, and that woman is one of them. A cross. How terrible.
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1. If you think a crucifix hanging on the wall means that you are being "excluded" or that religion is being shoved down your throat, that is your doing.
More to the point, do they hide the kosher foods so as not to shove Judaism down anyone's throat?
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1. Why is this newsworthy?
2. Why can this woman just not stop shopping there if she doesn't like it?
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Two points to emphasize:
1. If you think a crucifix hanging on the wall means that you are being "excluded" or that religion is being shoved down your throat, that is your doing. It is all in your head. My favorite new restaurant down the street from me has Islamic stuff behind the counter. Help, help, I'm being oppressed. But boy do they have good shawarma.
2. I know Jews have been called Christ-killers, and that's very sad and stupid. I know it's a very sensitive issue. But to say that a crucifix offends you on those grounds? That's silly. You should have some pride, have some strength, and get on with your day.
3. Whatever your faith is....or whatever the faith of the store owner is....the money you spend there still works as it was intelligently designed.....
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it's newsworthy for the same reason this is...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI
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Speaking as a member of a non-mainstream religion, allow me to simply say, some people need a few good swats with a clue bat, and that woman is one of them. A cross. How terrible.
But why should those of mainstream religions be excluded from your comments? Your post has been reported. =( =)
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Freedom of religion, not freedom from religion.
Actually it needs to be just that in some cases. I've worked in places where if you weren't of a particular variation of Christianity you might as well give up on any plans for advancement.
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Actually it needs to be just that in some cases. I've worked in places where if you weren't of a particular variation of Christianity you might as well give up on any plans for advancement.
... and how is that a problem?
Many places of business you will have to have family connections in order to get advancement.
I think there's some right about freedom of association somewhere...
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... and how is that a problem?
Many places of business you will have to have family connections in order to get advancement.
I think there's some right about freedom of association somewhere...
It's a problem when it's an unwritten rule that nobody would admit to. I just kept seeing people who I knew were less competent than me being promoted over me with BS explanations. Fortunately the private franchise was bought out by the corporate parent. Once that happened I took great pleasure in being promoted over the "my imaginary friend is cooler than your imaginary friend" morons who only stayed above me because they were in the right club.
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3. Whatever your faith is....or whatever the faith of the store owner is....the money you spend there still works as it was intelligently designed.....
Until the point it is overprinted to worthlessness...
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Some people are always looking for an opportunity to be a victim.
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Until the point it is overprinted to worthlessness...
....then it becomes un-intelligently designed.....duh.... =D
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Freedom of religion, not freedom from religion.
Not anymore. Welcome to the Progressive century.
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"It startled me. It seemed so out of place,"
Vampire?
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I think there's some right about freedom of association somewhere...
You have a right to your practices. I have a right to criticize them.
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It's a problem when it's an unwritten rule that nobody would admit to. I just kept seeing people who I knew were less competent than me being promoted over me with BS explanations. Fortunately the private franchise was bought out by the corporate parent. Once that happened I took great pleasure in being promoted over the "my imaginary friend is cooler than your imaginary friend" morons who only stayed above me because they were in the right club.
Then again it may be that your inherent disdain for them wasn't as well hidden as you thought.
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Then again it may be that your inherent disdain for them wasn't as well hidden as you thought.
I don't have any disdain for religious people until they use my lack of belief in their particular faith against me. In fact, I never said a single word about what faith (if any) I followed while I worked there.
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I am offended everytime I boot up APS. I've never complained to the Administrators about the boorishness of all of you. :angel: =D =D
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I don't have any disdain for religious people until they use my lack of belief in their particular faith against me. In fact, I never said a single word about what faith (if any) I followed while I worked there.
Maybe it wasn't what you intended, but this statement shows disdain for religion in general:
"my imaginary friend is cooler than your imaginary friend"
While I agree that contests about whose religion is better are stupid, the use of terms like "imaginary friend" when referring to the deity(ies) held dear by those of faith is going to offend people of many religious backgrounds.
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One man's theology is another man's belly laugh- Robert Heinlein
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Maybe it wasn't what you intended, but this statement shows disdain for religion in general:
While I agree that contests about whose religion is better are stupid, the use of terms like "imaginary friend" when referring to the deity(ies) held dear by those of faith is going to offend people of many religious backgrounds.
True enough, except that at that time in my life I was still a believer. I just didn't go to the right clubhouse. So no.
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"Less competent" people are promoted all the time for any number of reasons. I'd rather not have the .gov involved in telling business owners who they can promote and why. If you don't like the way your company is being ran I'd suggest getting a new job.
Actually it needs to be just that in some cases. I've worked in places where if you weren't of a particular variation of Christianity you might as well give up on any plans for advancement.
It's a problem when it's an unwritten rule that nobody would admit to. I just kept seeing people who I knew were less competent than me being promoted over me with BS explanations. Fortunately the private franchise was bought out by the corporate parent. Once that happened I took great pleasure in being promoted over the "my imaginary friend is cooler than your imaginary friend" morons who only stayed above me because they were in the right club.
I don't have any disdain for religious people until they use my lack of belief in their particular faith against me. In fact, I never said a single word about what faith (if any) I followed while I worked there.
So .gov needs to interfere in the promotion process because you were passed over because you weren't a Christian. Except you were a Christian at the time. And no one at the office knew anything about your religious beliefs. Yeah, that makes sense. ;/
Maybe your boss didn't like you and passed you over for non-religious reasons.
Edit: Ah, I see you've edited your post. The point still stands that if no one knew anything about your faith, it seems doubtful they used your faith as a reason to not promote you. Isn't it amazing how everyone is always so sure they deserve to be promoted and only got screwed out of it unfairly? Kinda like how everyone thinks they're a great driver...
And really, what's wrong with letting people use whatever criteria for hiring and promotion they want? If Schlomo only wants to hire other UO to work in his kosher deli, what's wrong with that? If Ibn al Rassim only wants to hire other Muslims in his halal shop why is that wrong?
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If Schlomo only wants to hire other UO to work in his kosher deli, what's wrong with that? If Ibn al Rassim only wants to hire other Muslims in his halal shop why is that wrong?
At a certain point it becomes religious discrimination.
Where that point is? Don't ask me but it has to be pretty obvious to be discrimination.
Like if your employer told you "Ehh I don't like Mormons, you'll never be promoted here, you should just leave."
That would be discrimination.
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At a certain point it becomes religious discrimination.
Where that point is? Don't ask me but it has to be pretty obvious to be discrimination.
Like if your employer told you "Ehh I don't like Mormons, you'll never be promoted here, you should just leave."
That would be discrimination.
And, again, what is wrong with that?
If it's an unsustainable business model, the business will fail.
If you don't like it and want to use the government to force your will on them, how is that any different than using the government to force people to go to the right church?
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At a certain point it becomes religious discrimination.
Where that point is? Don't ask me but it has to be pretty obvious to be discrimination.
Like if your employer told you "Ehh I don't like Mormons, you'll never be promoted here, you should just leave."
That would be discrimination.
And this is the .gov's concern why? If it's a .gov job, sure there should be nothing like that. But why is it the .gov's concern how a business owners decides who to promote?
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Quote
If Schlomo only wants to hire other UO to work in his kosher deli, what's wrong with that? If Ibn al Rassim only wants to hire other Muslims in his halal shop why is that wrong?
At a certain point it becomes religious discrimination.
Where that point is? Don't ask me but it has to be pretty obvious to be discrimination.
Like if your employer told you "Ehh I don't like Mormons, you'll never be promoted here, you should just leave."
That would be discrimination.
I don't see the problem really. If one wants to set up an authentic Deli or Middle eastern restaurant, how is that different than Hooter's waitress hiring policy? How is it different than the predominantly Asian cooks who work at Japanese Hibachi restaurants?
On the Mormon example, how many people outside of Mormons would still be doing doing business with them if word got out?
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Well depending. . . .
Does you business receive any government grants, or public funding, or government substitutes?
Well if it does you can't accept gov money which comes from all tax payers white, black, brown, yellow, purple, and then say "Hey we don't want purple people working here!" That's illegal and rightly so.
But if its a totally private business, well then your starting to argue Big Gov Vs. Privacy/Choice and its a valid argument to have if the gov should be allowed to decided who your allowed to work in your business but as it is now, yes its illegal to not hire people based off of race, religion, disability ect.
EDIT:
Speaking of Hooters lol. . . This lawsuit is a bit stupid, but the guy got a settlement with Hooters which I doubt they would have done if they thought they'd win the lawsuit.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,517334,00.html
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yes its illegal to not hire people based off of race, religion, disability ect.
So if I'm wheel chair bound and want to be Mickey Mouse at the Magic Kingdom, it would be discrimination if Disney didn't hire me?
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n/m
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The point still stands that if no one knew anything about your faith, it seems doubtful they used your faith as a reason to not promote you. Isn't it amazing how everyone is always so sure they deserve to be promoted and only got screwed out of it unfairly?
It was an open secret. Everyone knew. I continued to work there primarily to get experience. It was also an open secret that if you voted for anyone who didn't have an (R) after their name you'd better keep quiet about it.
I don't hate religion or religious people, btw. Heck, many of my friends are fervent believers. :angel:
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I managed to chew on falafel for dinner with my family, while sitting right next to the rack containing copies of the Muslim Yellow Pages!
I've eaten at that same restaurant. Even though I'm a Christian I also managed to get out alive.
I'm against all anti-discrimination laws because I think business owners (or anyone) should be able to discriminate against whoever they want using whatever criteria they want whether they be hiring hooters waitresses, hibachi chefs, or air traffic controllers. Maybe it's because I simultaneously believe that people should be able to shop wherever they want and buy from whoever they want using any discriminatory metric of their own.
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It was an open secret. Everyone knew. I continued to work there primarily to get experience. It was also an open secret that if you voted for anyone who didn't have an (R) after their name you'd better keep quiet about it.
I don't hate religion or religious people, btw. Heck, many of my friends are fervent believers. :angel:
You say that likes it a bad thing. Should gun companies be forced to hire Brady members? Can't discriminate based on politics now can we?
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You say that likes it a bad thing. Should gun companies be forced to hire Brady members? Can't discriminate based on politics now can we?
Heh. I'm a live and let live kind of guy. I don't care what your politics or religion are as long as you can perform your job.
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I don't believe I've ever said a word on this forum in support of anti-discrimination laws.
It's my view it should be a man's legal right to hang out a 'NO DOGS AND JEWS ALLOWED' sign, if you wish. But I have a right to think a man who does that a disgusting troglodyte, and to persuade others of that viewpoint.
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I don't have any disdain for religious people until they use my lack of belief in their particular faith against me. In fact, I never said a single word about what faith (if any) I followed while I worked there.
I'm not sure it matters what faith you follow while you worked there, nor what faith they followed. They should be free to hire and promote for whatever reason they see fit. Just as you should be able to quit for any reason you want.
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Charming idealism.
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Charming idealism.
I started to refute you, but I've come to realize Brits just seem to enjoy having the .gov tell them how to live their life and don't seem to really care about the concepts of personal responsibility or individual liberty all that much so why bother? I don't understand how you all can think like that, but unless you plan to emigrate here I don't really care anymore.
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Now that wasn't so charming.
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Charming idealism.
I find hilarious the sort of appeal to 'practicality' and criticism of 'idealism' that happens to coincide with wanting the 'idealist' to accept whatever measure the 'moderate' happens to support at a given spot in time.
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I find hilarious the sort of appeal to 'practicality' and criticism of 'idealism' that happens to coincide with wanting the 'idealist' to accept whatever measure the 'moderate' happens to support at a given spot in time.
What is it you think I want you to support?
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Sorry Iain, maybe I'm out of line but I've had about all I can take with British people telling me how they're so full of compassion and concern for their fellow man that they have the .gov run their lives for them. "Oh we banned those naughty evil guns and now we're so much better than you violent Americans. Oh we force you to pay for other people's healthcare we're so much more compassionate than you greedy Americans." Etc etc. I. Have. Bloody. Well. Had. It.
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What is it you think I want you to support?
It seems to be you referred to "They should be free to hire and promote for whatever reason they see fit. Just as you should be able to quit for any reason you want," as "charming idealism"? Am I wrong?
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Strawman Alert!
If you don't like it and want to use the government to force your will on them, how is that any different than using the government to force people to go to the right church?
There's a big difference between forcing people to go to a certain church, temple, or synagogue and saying you can't discriminate against people based on this criteria.
Well if it does you can't accept gov money which comes from all tax payers white, black, brown, yellow, purple, and then say "Hey we don't want purple people working here!" That's illegal and rightly so.
Would anyone disagree with that? Are we talking about totally private businesses or businesses that also received public funding?
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I find hilarious the sort of appeal to 'practicality' and criticism of 'idealism' that happens to coincide with wanting the 'idealist' to accept whatever measure the 'moderate' happens to support at a given spot in time.
Hilarious, indeed. On the other hand I was once told that, instead of having public decency laws, I should exercise my right to walk around with my eyes shut, so as to avoid seeing naked people. Very practical, that. :lol:
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Strawman Alert!
There's a big difference between forcing people to go to a certain church, temple, or synagogue and saying you can't discriminate against people based on this criteria.
There is? How?
I did not set up a straw man, I asked a question. It's a matter of free association. If you don't want to use religion as an example, how is it any different from forcing people to accept women into their men's club?
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Balog - it's nothing to do with being British or American or me telling you how things should be done over there.
It seems to be you referred to "They should be free to hire and promote for whatever reason they see fit. Just as you should be able to quit for any reason you want," as "charming idealism"? Am I wrong?
It's no more or less idealistic than the notion that legislation can and will prevent people from hiring and firing on dubious grounds. Regulate it all versus deregulate it all, interesting for pontification but that's about it.
I've worked in around the disability field long enough to know there are ridiculous practices (posts reserved for disabled people) and there are practices that allow disabled people access to decent employment prospects.
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For my own part, I'd prefer that folks, especially employers, be open & out front in their prejudices. I think that is fairest for the employee, who can choose not to work for folks who think less of him for some reason...or at least he'll know what he is signing up for.
Legal language about non-discrimination just makes an employer document an employee's imperfections.
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Regulate it all versus deregulate it all, interesting for pontification but that's about it.
Why so? I'd say this debate is eminently practical.
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Would all you peace and love religious folk stop fighting please? :mad:
:laugh:
:angel:
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Pipe down, unbeliever, or I shall sic my cross on thee!
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You seem pretty cross already.
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I AM NOT CROSS!
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Another cross beating? Sigh,,,I can't win either... =|
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Don't cross me boy.
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One good thing about having that cross above the door....it'll keep the vampires away....esp. those prissy, emo-type vampires from TWILIGHT...
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To re-iterate and expand on what was stated early ion the thread;
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
It seems to me that many people are actually attempting to prohibit the free exercise of one's chosen religion. Like was said, Freedom OF Religion, not freedom FROM Religion. It's just like the fact that there are going to be 50,000 Muslims praying somewhere on or about the White House lawn (or some other Government property). While I don't like Islam, it's not up to ANYBODY to prohibit their prayer day. I DON'T like the fact that 0bama neglected the National Day of Prayer (which shows NO religious preference) and yet, supports this prayer day for the Muslims.
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One good thing about having that cross above the door....it'll keep the vampires away....esp. those prissy, emo-type vampires from TWILIGHT...
I friggin HATE sparkly vampires.. (Crosses fingers hoping Larry Correia has an "Edward" cameo, that gets brutally gunned down with heavy weapons. And fire. Then staked.)
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Hot cross buns?
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Hot cross buns?
I guess they'd better keep those, and the Peeps, away from the Kosher aisle. And ironically enough for the whiny Jewess in question, Schnuck's Markets DO tend to have a Kosher section in their stores. Wanna bet she's never complained about that?
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Lots of people are ethnically Jews but don't observe the customs at all.
For example. I love me some bacon.
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Hee heeee, I worked at a Kosher meat packing plant while in high school. VERY Orthodox. They even had a Synagogue right in the family home. All us wise ass Gentiles would go there with ham sandwiches and milk for lunch just to rile the old ladies. The best one was "Stella", she'd yell at us and tell us God was going to strike us dead for doing that. "STELLLLLAAAAA!!!" was also heard quite frequently around the plant. =D
My personal favorite was "Mary". Mary was this short little fireplug looking Polish Jew, probably 4' nothing, She could one arm a full 5 gallon bucket of water straight over her head. Nobody messed with Mary. :laugh:
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Lots of people are ethnically Jews but don't observe the customs at all.
For example. I love me some bacon.
I know. Why do you mention it? ???
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I know. Why do you mention it? ???
Expressing one's love of bacon is always appropriate.
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I know. Why do you mention it? ???
Because it's possible that's the reason she hasn't complained about kosher food.
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Because it's possible that's the reason she hasn't complained about kosher food.
She hasn't mentioned it because only Christians are oppressive thugs who try to impose their views on others.
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Because it's possible that's the reason she hasn't complained about kosher food.
She hasn't complained about the presence of a kosher food aisle, because she doesn't use the kosher food aisle? =)
I'm not sure I wanna keep talking about this, though. All this talk of kosher is making me feel excluded.
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I like kosher pickles.
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Click the link for the full story.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/religion/story/63C5936DF7DC18EE862576330010EF45?OpenDocument
Two points to emphasize:
1. If you think a crucifix hanging on the wall means that you are being "excluded" or that religion is being shoved down your throat, that is your doing. It is all in your head. My favorite new restaurant down the street from me has Islamic stuff behind the counter. Help, help, I'm being oppressed. But boy do they have good shawarma.
2. I know Jews have been called Christ-killers, and that's very sad and stupid. I know it's a very sensitive issue. But to say that a crucifix offends you on those grounds? That's silly. You should have some pride, have some strength, and get on with your day.
She can be offended all she likes though, it isn't like she is trying to sue anyone, is she? If she is trying to sue, then she is, of course, in the wrong. But hey, if it makes her uncomfortable then she can write a letter to the editor and try to get the chain to establish an official policy banning articles of faith. No need to 'crucify' her over expressing an opinion. (haha!)
Honestly, as long as no-one is making a legal issue about it, who cares? She is just using her right of free speech to protest what someone else did while they were exercising their own right of free speech. The whole thing is very American!
Personally, she is probably crazy though. I don't like people who are offended that easily.
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She is just using her right of free speech to protest what someone else did while they were exercising their own right of free speech.
And so are we!
She's free to complain about the crucifix, and we're free to call her an idjit for doing so.
Personally, she is probably crazy though. I don't like people who are offended that easily.
Oppressor! :D
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Oppressor! :D
Lol. I'm totally suing you for libel!
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She can be offended all she likes though, it isn't like she is trying to sue anyone, is she? If she is trying to sue, then she is, of course, in the wrong. But hey, if it makes her uncomfortable then she can write a letter to the editor and try to get the chain to establish an official policy banning articles of faith. No need to 'crucify' her over expressing an opinion.
Nobody here is "crucifying" anyone, but the complaints about the crucifix are absurd. Anyone making such complaints can expect a little heckling. Maybe such silly people should exercise their right not to make fools of themselves. In fact, they can borrow mine. I never use it anyway. =)
We don't know whether she wants to sue, but it looks as though some have thought about it, and decided it wouldn't work. See this bit from later in the same article:
Karen Aroesty of the Anti-Defamation League of St. Louis said that despite a number of calls complaining about the display, her organization will not lodge an official complaint with Schnucks.
"After some significant discussion within the Jewish and interfaith communities, we felt this was not a battle that should be pressed right now," Aroesty said....
Some critics have said that because more than half of Culinaria's funding came from government sources such as tax credits and the Missouri Development Finance Board (which owns the building in which the store is situated), the store should be held to church-state limitations.
City resident Thomas Duda, who is Catholic, has made the crucifix an issue on his blog, notmymayor.com. He says a company that received public funding to build a store should not blatantly express a specific religious belief that could be offensive or uncomfortable to some who shop there. In an interview, Duda added that he would like Schnucks to prohibit individual managers from endorsing a specific religion.
But church-state legal experts said the establishment clause of the First Amendment was meant to prohibit the government's endorsement of religion, and that it would be a stretch to claim that a private business utilizing tax benefits would be comparable.
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Nobody here is "crucifying" anyone, but the complaints about the crucifix are absurd. Anyone making such complaints can expect a little heckling. Maybe such silly people should exercise their right not to make fools of themselves. In fact, they can borrow mine. I never use it anyway. =)
We don't know whether she wants to sue, but it looks as though some have thought about it, and decided it wouldn't work. See this bit from later in the same article:
I hope they were just talking about something like a boycott, but realized they would look intolerant.
I agree she is due for heckling, I even heckled her a bit!
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Lots of people are ethnically Jews but don't observe the customs at all.
For example. I love me some bacon.
I know. Why do you mention it? ???
No....he REALLY loves bacon....
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cinestatic.com%2Finfinitethought%2Fuploaded_images%2Fpiggy-759268.jpg&hash=c8cf8260b242c3fdde58efc5753bfdc9b3475b71)
http://www.cinestatic.com/infinitethought/uploaded_images/piggy-759268.jpg (http://www.cinestatic.com/infinitethought/uploaded_images/piggy-759268.jpg)
....hope 2swap & the pirates don't find out.... :O
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I hope they were just talking about something like a boycott, but realized they would look intolerant.
I hope they get around to apologizing for stirring things up. =)
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I hope they get around to apologizing for stirring things up. =)
I wouldn't hold my breath.
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All this talk of kosher is making me feel excluded.
I forgot what the hell the thread is about. I have to go back to the beginning. :laugh:
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Ohhhh, now I remember. I'd say she's the at least one in every crowd that has to make life miserable for everybody else. I help run a music society here. I have THREE and they all hate and bicker with each other. We "marginalize" them. Weinstock merely needs to be "marginalized" or "margarinized", whatever... =)
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I want cinnamon rolls.
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...with bacon... :P