We are not alone... maybe.

[AZRedhawk44]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1284013/Scientists-hint-life-Saturns-moon-Titan.html

Scientists have found evidence that there may be some form of life on Saturn's biggest moon Titan.

They have discovered clues that might show that microscopic aliens are breathing in Titan's atmosphere and feeding on fuel at the surface.

Data from Nasa's Cassini probe has analysed the complex chemistry on the surface of Titan - the only moon known to have a dense atmosphere.

Its surface is covered with mountains, lakes and rivers which has led astronomers to call it the most Earth-like world in the solar system.
Saturn's moon, Titan, pictured using ultraviolet and infrared cameras on board the space probe Cassini. Scientists now believe that the moon could harbour life

Saturn's moon, Titan, pictured using ultraviolet and infrared cameras on board the space probe Cassini. Scientists now believe that the moon could harbour life

Organic chemicals had already been detected on the 3,200-mile wide moon. But the liquid on Titan methane, rather than water, and scientists expect life there to be methane-based.

The startling discoveries, made using an orbiting spacecraft, are revealed by two separate teams reporting in two science publications, Icarus and the Journal of Geophysical Research.

The paper in Icarus shows that hydrogen gas flowing down through Titan's atmosphere mysteriously disappears at the surface, suggesting it could be being breathed by alien bugs.

The second paper reports that there is a lack of the chemical acetylene on the surface, leading scientists to believe that it may be being consumed once it reaches Titan.

Scientists had expected sunlight interacting with chemicals in the atmosphere to produce acetylene that falls down to coat Titan. But Cassini detected no acetylene on the surface.

Experts caution that there could be other explanations for the results observed.

But taken together, they fulfill two important conditions necessary for methane-based life to exist.

Nasa astrobiologist Chris McKay, of California, who drew up the list of conditions, said: 'We suggested hydrogen consumption because it’s the obvious gas for life to consume on Titan, similar to the way we consume oxygen on Earth.

'If these signs do turn out to be a sign of life, it would be doubly exciting because it would represent a second form of life independent from water-based life on Earth.'
An artist's conception showing Titan's earth-like surface with Saturn appearing dimly in the background through the thick atmosphere

Look familiar? An artist's conception showing Titan's earth-like surface with Saturn appearing dimly in the background through the thick atmosphere

Roger Clark, a Cassini team scientist, said: 'Titan's atmospheric chemistry is cranking out organic compounds that rain down on the surface so fast that even as streams of liquid methane and ethane at the surface wash the organics off, the ice gets quickly covered again.

'All that implies Titan is a dynamic place where organic chemistry is happening now.'

But Mark Allen, principal investigator with the Nasa Astrobiology Institute Titan team said one possibility is that sunlight or cosmic rays are transforming the acetylene in icy aerosols in the atmosphere into more complex molecules that would fall to the ground with no acetylene signature.

'Scientific conservatism suggests that a biological explanation should be the last choice after all non-biological explanations are addressed,' Allen said.

'We have a lot of work to do to rule out possible non-biological explanations. It is more likely that a chemical process, without biology, can explain these results - for example, reactions involving mineral catalysts.'

Scientists say Titan resembles Earth as it was four billion years ago and so could be a new cradle for life. They believe that when the sun swells up, swallowing the Earth, conditions for life could be ideal on a warmed-up Titan.

Professor John Zarnecki, of the Open University, who landed a probe called Huygens on Titan in January 2005, said: 'We believe the chemistry is there for life to form. It just needs heat and warmth to kick-start the process.

'In four billion years time, when the sun swells into a red giant, it could be paradise on Titan.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1284013/Scientists-hint-life-Saturns-moon-Titan.html#ixzz0puVNlG1g

Question:

Hydrogen is the lightest element on the periodic table and would float above the atmosphere, even in a methane/hydrocarbon soup like Titan.  How can Hydrogen precipitate out of the atmosphere and "fall" to where the little microbugs can ingest it and make it disappear?

I understand that acetylene would be more dense than methane... but not hydrogen.

[230RN]

Gases do mix when the thermal energy (molecular velocity) of the other gas molecules around it bang it around a little or winds mix it up.  Otherwise, you'd have a layer of CO2 down at sea level.

Even comparitively big heavy things like dust particles get banged around by gas molecules:

http://galileoandeinstein.physics.virginia.edu/more_stuff/Applets/brownian/brownian.html

Frankly, I would consider it the most perverse and outrageous facet of nature if there were no life elsewhere in the universe. 

Terry, 230RN

[makattak]

Wait, there's life on saturn?

And we discovered it this year?

Shouldn't we have interplanetary travel, first?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0086837/

[bedlamite]

That's quite a leap to go from 'we found evidence of hydrogen' to 'there must be bugs there'

[makattak]

That's quite a leap to go from 'we found evidence of hydrogen' to 'there must be bugs there'

Hush now- We're talking about ALIENS!

[BridgeRunner]

Hush now- We're talking about ALIENS!

I would just like to get on record stating that I respect our future alien overlords. 

[AJ Dual]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1284013/Scientists-hint-life-Saturns-moon-Titan.html


Question:

Hydrogen is the lightest element on the periodic table and would float above the atmosphere, even in a methane/hydrocarbon soup like Titan.  How can Hydrogen precipitate out of the atmosphere and "fall" to where the little microbugs can ingest it and make it disappear?

I understand that acetylene would be more dense than methane... but not hydrogen.

Part of the "hydrogen escape" mechanism is heat. The warmer a planet is, the more energy gas molecules have to bounce around etc. and eventually reach escape velocity. Also is the ability of UV light to crack the hydrogen atoms out of other hydrogen bearing molecules like water. And the solar wind plays a role as well.

And for heat, UV, and solar wind Saturn is roughly 20x farther out from the sun than the Earth is, give or take an AU or two. I can't recall if Titan has a significant magnetosphere which is what protects Earth from solar wind stripping (and why Mars suffers from it) but the gas giant Saturn itself certainly does which could protect Titan further.

I agree with the notion of scientific conservatism. If I were to bet on it, I'd lay my money on it being complex hydrocarbon chemistry we just don't understand as of yet, than actual life. However I certainly agree it bears further study.

If we find so much as fossil bacteria on Mars or living organisms eking out a meager existence in the permafrost, or Earthly ocean trench analogues under the ice on Europa, it'll be ground breaking and tell us a great deal about the probable existence of life in the entire Universe, seeing as it arose more than once just in our own star system.

Although in both cases, while they'd be "extremophiles", they'll likely be examples of "life as we know it", with similar cousins in our own Antarctic, or the sea floor.

If there's "Methane based life" on Titan, that will be truly ground-breaking. As that would mean the arena for life to develop is even wider than we first thought. For every 'warm' place like Earth, Mars, or under the ice of Europa, there's hundreds more 'cold' ones like Titan.

[MillCreek]

I would just like to get on record stating that I respect our future alien overlords. 

I, for one, welcome our new insect overlords!

[RocketMan]

Has fistful been hanging out on Titan again?

[Perd Hapley]

The paper in Icarus shows that hydrogen gas flowing down through Titan's atmosphere mysteriously disappears at the surface, suggesting it could be being breathed by alien bugs.

The second paper reports that there is a lack of the chemical acetylene on the surface, leading scientists to believe that it may be being consumed once it reaches Titan.

I want to hurt this "writer."

[280plus]

No acetylene? How do they survive? 

Does anyone else want to hop on Jamis' boat and take a spin out there? 

[RocketMan]

Does anyone else want to hop on Jamis' boat and take a spin out there? 

Only if it's got good impulse drive.  I've got to be home by the 17th.

[Jocassee]

I, for one, welcome our new insect overlords!

Dangit, beat me to it.

Where does that meme come from anyways?

[BridgeRunner]

Where does that meme come from anyways?

See, I alluded to it instead of using it because I don't know where it's from and didn't want to misquote because I couldn't verify the correct quote. 

I agree though, this business of water! gasses! ZOMG, some critter might be able to survive there, therefore there's critters that have evolved there! is a bit of a stretch and more than a little tiresome.

[41magsnub]

Insect overlords

http://videosift.com/video/I-for-one-welcome-our-new-insect-overlords

[MillCreek]

Dangit, beat me to it.

Where does that meme come from anyways?

The quote gained popularity after the 1994 episode of The Simpsons, “Deep Space Homer”, when news announcer Kent Brockman believes the Earth to be under invasion by giant space ants. Fearing for his life, he announces his willingness to collaborate with the insectoid invaders:

“One thing is for certain: there is no stopping them; the ants will soon be here. And I for one welcome our new insect overlords. I’d like to remind them that as a trusted TV personality, I can be helpful in rounding up others to toil in their underground sugar caves.”

http://www.hulu.com/watch/17611/the-simpsons-giant-space-ants

I laugh everytime I watch this.

[280plus]

I love marge. I was just checking out her playboy spread. Woo hooo baby! [cue wolf whistle]