Front Sight

[AZRedhawk44]

Front Sight has a "deal" that for $200, you get:

-hardcopy manuals of Front Sight’s Defensive Handgun, Tactical Shotgun, Practical Rifle, Submachine Gun, Select Fire M16, Empty Hand Defense, and Edged Weapons Courses
-4-day defensive handgun course (you must travel to Front Sight to use this)
-30-state concealed weapons course (you must travel to Front Sight to use this)

http://www.frontsight.com/patriot/?order=DVD#DVD

Sounds like a pretty good deal.  I missed out about 2 years ago on a similar FS deal, for $125 for the defensive handgun course.

But, the part that irks me is the tacit acknowledgement of a subscription... $50 annual to some sort of "Front Sight Patriot" newsletter.  However, they say that on a monthly basis they will make similar offers for other training to members of this newsletter list.  So I can take Tactical Shotgun, Practical Rifle, etc for $200 or so rather than the thousands of dollars they typically want for them.


What says APS?  A worthwhile investment or not?

[Marnoot]

I took the 4-day handgun course a few years ago. It was courtesy of my brother-in-law so I don't know how much it cost then, but I'd say the class was worth well more than worth $200. The subscription thing they've added is annoying, but all you'd have to do is cancel it immediately.

[brimic]

Is there a timeline for when you have to take the course?
Do you have tokeep the subscription until you took the handgun course, if planning to take it?
It sounds like a heck of a deal at any rate.

[AZRedhawk44]

OK, I signed up.

No expiration date.

I'll keep the subscription until renewal next year, and I'll probably end up using the handgun course this spring sometime.  If the monthly offerings look good, I'll keep the subscription and take advantage of a course or two every year.

[roo_ster]

I still get chuckles out of the "Four Weapon Combat Master" marketing of Piazza.

Wouldn't keep me from taking a course from them.

[Marnoot]

The classes are good, but Pizza's infomercial-like marketing does get annoying. I'm not currently subscribed to his email list as a result. When I was there they did pimp various membership packages a bit but it wasn't bad, he relegates most of the huckstering to email/website.

[ArfinGreebly]

Remember Billy Mays?

Most annoying huckster evar, and yet he sold a ton of stuff.

You want to stay in business?  You want to grow a business?  You mean to make a business thrive?

You absolutely have to market what you do, even to the point of being annoying.

I have no problem with Front Sight doing all the sales and marketing they can afford.  I want them to stay in business and I want them to thrive.

And I want anyone else who's in that same business to thrive as well.  We need them all.

[Marnoot]

Remember Billy Mays?

Most annoying huckster evar, and yet he sold a ton of stuff.

You want to stay in business?  You want to grow a business?  You mean to make a business thrive?

You absolutely have to market what you do, even to the point of being annoying.

I have no problem with Front Sight doing all the sales and marketing they can afford.  I want them to stay in business and I want them to thrive.

And I want anyone else who's in that same business to thrive as well.  We need them all.

Oh I have no issue with how he (or the late Billy Mays) does marketing from any conceptual or moral standpoint I just found it annoying, thus my un-subscription from the email list. As mentioned they're not heavy-handed about it at the courses.

[41magsnub]

I remember those ads!  They made me think those guys were the eXtreme shock! of the firearms training world.

[Balog]

Front Sight isn't Gabe Suarez levels of con man BS, but it's still enough semi-culty Mary Kay with guns that I'd prefer getting my training elsewhere.

[roo_ster]

Front Sight isn't Gabe Suarez levels of con man BS, but it's still enough semi-culty Mary Kay with guns that I'd prefer getting my training elsewhere.

Heh.

[Fly320s]

Front Sight isn't Gabe Suarez levels of con man BS, but it's still enough semi-culty Mary Kay with guns that I'd prefer getting my training elsewhere.

That is the second or third time in as many days I've heard something negative about Suarez. What's up with him?

[Hawkmoon]

I still get chuckles out of the "Four Weapon Combat Master" marketing of Piazza.

Wouldn't keep me from taking a course from them.

It would stop me cold.

Piazza is a scam artist, IMHO. I don't deal with scam artists (at least, not knowingly).

[roo_ster]

That is the second or third time in as many days I've heard something negative about Suarez. What's up with him?

Didn't he serve time for worker's comp fraud? 

Something about doing force-on-force airsoft training and rolling around on the ground & wrestling while getting a check for hurting his back or some such.  He shoulda sprung for the 4-poster cane with the tennis balls.

Unlike "Four Weapon Combat Master(1)" Piazza, I would not pay $$$ for one of his courses.  Piazza supposedly hires some competent folk with all the money he makes.  Balog hit the nail on the head WRT Suarez, though: semi-culty.



(1) Without actually having experienced combat.

[Boomhauer]

That is the second or third time in as many days I've heard something negative about Suarez. What's up with him?

Well, other than he's a convicted felon (Worker's Comp fraud), almost becoming an active shooter (there's a video out there where he talks about getting ready to kill some coworkers and only just stopping short of committing it), and a winning personality, nothing. Dude's nuttier than a fruitcake, IOW

[roo_ster]

OK, with all this talk about Piazza, I am now going to claim to be a "Four Continent Supermodel Seducer," since I have qualifications analogous to Piazza's.

[Balog]

That is the second or third time in as many days I've heard something negative about Suarez. What's up with him?

Well, the worker's comp fraud thing. The "claiming to be an elite tactical operator from a SWAT team after being a prison guard for a couple years" thing. The "Extreme Shock!" style BS marketing of his warrior cult mentality. The advocating violence when folks disrespect you. The line of AK mags he made with US Palm and lied about their construction.

I could go on. Dude is both a con man, and represents the worst stereotypes of violent and unstable nutjobs looking for an excuse to kill someone the Brady bunch could dream up.

[gunsmith]

I've heard good things about front sights courses, but that piazza guy is plenty annoying.