"Guns prohibited" signs

[BReilley]

Since getting my Arizona CCW permit(which is now itself worthless), I have been paying a great deal more attention to the "we're scared of guns here and want to feel good about ourselves" signs businesses put up to tell me not to spend my money there.  What often cracks me up is the choice of silhouette used to illustrate the evil object in question.  For instance, I note that the community college I attended some years ago has something against the Beretta 92, whereas Indigo Joe's doesn't want you bringing in your 1911 race gun(seriously, their sign shows a 1911 with magwell, compensator/muzzle weight, etc), and IKEA singles out that ever-so-common carry weapon...
the Tokarev TT.

French G.'s thread made me wonder: the revolver is ubiquitous and unmistakeable.  Why go to the trouble to find a silhouette of Robocop's pistol, when you can get the point across with a plain old service revolver?

Anyway.  These things amuse me, and I thought I'd share. :)

[vaskidmark]

One sign-selling company's picture has to be different than everybody else's picture so they don't get accused of copying, or something.

It's really probably about selling the picture based on how scary it can be made to appear.

Or maybe it was just the first picture the kid in the back room came up with from the intebebz.

When the picture is recognizable as a very specific brand/model I like to go in and inquire why they allow all the other mean guns.  I get lots of puzzled looks.

But then that happens a lot even when not discussing guns.

stay safe.

[charby]

[AZRedhawk44]

The official AZ approved sign is the 1911 racegun one, pictured here.

Any other sign that does not conform to the specific description in ARS 4-229 is invalid, much like the Texas 30-06 laws.

http://www.accuform.com/store/product.cfm?pID=7C51434149187E5A

http://www.azliquor.gov/assets/documents/firearm_faq.pdf

Someone "can" make their own sign with a different gun silhouette, but the font, paper weight and size specifications are rather explicit.  Much easier to just request a free one from AZ DLLC.


BReilly:

You MUST have an AZ CCW to carry into a bar in AZ (that is not posted).  Non-CCW holders are still prohibited from carrying into establishments that serve alcohol.  CCW permitees may carry, if not posted, and they don't imbibe.

[Angel Eyes]

You MUST have an AZ CCW to carry into a bar in AZ (that is not posted).  Non-CCW holders are still prohibited from carrying into establishments that serve alcohol.  CCW permitees may carry, if not posted, and they don't imbibe.

Getting off topic a bit: is the Utah CCW permit honored in Arizona?  How about in bars?

[AZRedhawk44]

AZ grants reciprocity with Utah.  Don't quote me on this, but I believe any honored CCW permit allows for bar carry, not just an AZ one.

[BReilley]

The official AZ approved sign is the 1911 racegun one, pictured here.

Any other sign that does not conform to the specific description in ARS 4-229 is invalid, much like the Texas 30-06 laws.

http://www.accuform.com/store/product.cfm?pID=7C51434149187E5A

http://www.azliquor.gov/assets/documents/firearm_faq.pdf

Someone "can" make their own sign with a different gun silhouette, but the font, paper weight and size specifications are rather explicit.  Much easier to just request a free one from AZ DLLC.


BReilly:

You MUST have an AZ CCW to carry into a bar in AZ (that is not posted).  Non-CCW holders are still prohibited from carrying into establishments that serve alcohol.  CCW permitees may carry, if not posted, and they don't imbibe.

How interesting; I was not aware that the permit conferred any special privileges anymore.  Neat, thanks!

[AJ Dual]

How interesting; I was not aware that the permit conferred any special privileges anymore.  Neat, thanks!

The main thing being reciprocity with other states.

Few if any, accept AZ, AK, or VT residency as your "permit".

Assuming the elections go well, and WI FINALLY gets shall-issue CCW sometime in 2011, I hope the signage requirements are like they are in other versions of the bill that had come up.

Monkeyleg might be able to fill in more details, but I think the bill required a sign of a certain size and format (anti-gun forces wanted 8 1/2"x11" so they could fax/mail every business in WI a sign should it have passed) however, a reading of the bill seemed to indicate that the signs only had the "trespass authority", meaning, if you carried in violation of the sign, you still had to be noticed carrying, and be instructed to leave, and were then only in legal peril of misdemeanor trespass if you were so hard-headed that you still refused to leave.

My read of the whole thing was that it's a wink-and-a-nod to the "concealed means concealed" part of CCW. 

The one upside of going shall-issue second-to-last here in the U.S. is that the pro-gun drafters of the bill can learn from all the tricks and roadblocks, and poison-pills that all the other CCW states have had to deal with already.

[charby]

On Jan 1, 2011 Iowa will recognize anyone with an out of state CCW.

 

[Monkeyleg]

As I've said before, I haven't encountered one non-public building with a "no guns" sign. It must be due to the fact that AL has had legal carry forever.

I hope Wisconsin can get a bill passed, and a clean bill. The last two we had provided for instant reciprocity with all issuing states, a provision that was shot down early in negotiations.

How are the races for legislative districts shaping up, AJ?

 

[Tallpine]

I figure if my gun doesn't look like the one in the picture, that it's okay 

[AJ Dual]

As I've said before, I haven't encountered one non-public building with a "no guns" sign. It must be due to the fact that AL has had legal carry forever.

I hope Wisconsin can get a bill passed, and a clean bill. The last two we had provided for instant reciprocity with all issuing states, a provision that was shot down early in negotiations.

How are the races for legislative districts shaping up, AJ?

Hard to say.

I think that the Wisconsin left is making a pro-forma show at backing Barrett for the governor's race. Their only hope is Neumann steals the GOP primary, or he loses it, and makes his threatened independent run, either of which will split the Republican vote.

I think the Democrats expect to lose big, and instead are more focused on trying to purge the ranks of what they consider to be DINO's like Plale down in his Oak Creek/southeast coast district.

Other indicators, that stupid train from Spain that Doyle bought that will go from Downtown Milwaukee to nowhere useful in the outskirts of Madison, they're trying to rush through last-minute town meetings along the I-94 corridor trying to get them to spend money to build stations, trying to get it so far along that a prospective Gov. Walker and GOP legislature can't kill it.

Every indicator I can see, reading between the lines at the Shepherd Express, and other sources tells me they're engaged in HEAVY triage and preventative measures to save what they can before a GOP rout.

First hurdle in that becoming true is Neumann losing the GOP primary tomorrow, and taking it like a man and bowing out.

[French G.]

I figure if my gun doesn't look like the one in the picture, that it's okay 

Operated on that theory before. Sucks to be you revolver guys!

[Tallpine]

Operated on that theory before. Sucks to be you revolver guys!

But the one in the picture isn't a single action 

[S. Williamson]

All the Signs on the Wichita State campus, I noticed, were Beretta 92/96es.   

[Perd Hapley]

I think Berettas and revolvers are the most popular on signs in these parts.

[Ryan in Maine]

I have guns prohibited blindness. It's like face blindness, only, y'know... It's a serious condition.

[HankB]

. . . Other indicators, that stupid train from Spain that Doyle bought that will go from Downtown Milwaukee to nowhere useful in the outskirts of Madison, they're trying to rush through last-minute town meetings along the I-94 corridor trying to get them to spend money to build stations, trying to get it so far along that a prospective Gov. Walker and GOP legislature can't kill it . . .

So WI bought a train, too?

Cap Metro (the Austin, TX government run bus company) bought a foreign train to start "light rail" service from the NW suburbs to downtown. Lots of money spent (>$100,000,000) and it's expensive to run. Ridership is about 1/4 of what they said it would be, about 800 riders/day. And since most of those are probably commuters, they're counted twice. So somewhere between 400 and 500 people a day actually ride it. That's over $200,000 per rider in capital investment, plus operating expenses.

The people who fought against it used the motto "Costs too much, does too little." They were ridiculed . . . but it turns out they were right.

Why do politicians LOVE passenger trains so much? (I wish I had the resources to " . . . follow the money.")

[Monkeyleg]

Why do politicians LOVE passenger trains public transportation so much?

It's public transportation in general, not trains, that the lib's like. It's difficult to control a mobile population. With public transportation, the citizen moves when the government says he can move. He arrives and departs when the government says he can do so.

Just like guns, education, and other issues, it's all about control. It's difficult to control an armed and mobile population of educated, free thinkers. Just think how frightening that last sentence must be to a liberal, and what images it conveys.

[AJ Dual]

That's definitely part of it.

Although at the root of it all, I think liberals just simply associate trains with large urban liberal cosmopolitan strongholds like NYC, Chicago, and Europe in general.

Since a key feature of liberals is emoting, rather than reasoning, they emote that trains = big liberal city. Therefore adding trains to a region that did not have them makes the area more liberal.

[roo_ster]

On Jan 1, 2011 Iowa will recognize anyone with an out of state CCW.

 

Sweet.  I can now visit my folks and carry more than the "when I'm not carrying anything" carry weapon.

[charby]

Sweet.  I can now visit my folks and carry more than the "when I'm not carrying anything" carry weapon.

Make sure to keep it concealed, we do have our share of Barneys that don't stay current with the new laws.

[Strings]

>First hurdle in that becoming true is Neumann losing the GOP primary tomorrow, and taking it like a man and bowing out. <

So basically, we're hosed (again)?

[AJ Dual]

>First hurdle in that becoming true is Neumann losing the GOP primary tomorrow, and taking it like a man and bowing out. <

So basically, we're hosed (again)?

I hope not. 

I think it just hinges on out-state WI using it's antipathy for Milwaukee to realize that Walker is perfect if they "hate Milwaukee", because he's the guy that's stomped hard on the county and controlled it's budget and put tons of hurt on the local .gov unions etc.

Neumann's swan song that he's not a "career politician" over and over is bunk, because sometimes a "career politician" is the real deal.

The real worry is that Neumann will go full-retard (you NEVER go full-retard!) and declare an independant candidacy if the primary does not go his way, and splits the conservative vote out of spite, letting Barrett waltz in to the Governor's seat.

[vaskidmark]

That's definitely part of it.

Although at the root of it all, I think liberals just simply associate trains with large urban liberal cosmopolitan strongholds like NYC, Chicago, and Europe in general.

Since a key feature of liberals is emoting, rather than reasoning, they emote that trains = big liberal city. Therefore adding trains to a region that did not have them makes the area more liberal.

If you look at the history of "public transportation" in the late 19th-early 20th century you will find the manufacturing mogols behind it.  They created "workers' housing estates" as way to suck back up some of that loot they were paying out.  In order to ensure the availability of the work force they got car lines running from the housing tracts to the factories and to the shopping in downtown.  Then the cities saw they could rake in more money by making connections between neighborhoods, which also kept the workers from going out and buying automobiles which might eventually take them away to some place where the wages, or conditions, or weather, or politics might be better.

As strange as it may seem, these moves actually did vastly improve the general living conditions of the workers and their famililies, as well as contrbute to the introduction/improvement of public education.  It just left an immobile population of workers available to be exploited.

Long live the workers!

The peasants are revolting!  (Yes, they are, but they're the only ones we have got.)

stay safe.