Penn State Gets What It Had Coming

[roo_ster]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8191027/penn-state-hit-60-million-fine-4-year-bowl-ban-wins-dating-1998

The NCAA has hit Penn State with a $60 million sanction, a four-year football postseason ban and a vacation of all wins dating to 1998, the organization said Monday morning. The career record of Joe Paterno will reflect these vacated records, the NCAA said.

Penn State also must reduce 10 initial and 20 total scholarships each year for a four-year period.

I am still partial to the "plow the athletic fields under and plant corn" response, but the above will do in a pinch.

SMU still hasn't recovered and that was nigh 30 years ago. 

[TommyGunn]

Well, to quote the immortal words of the Simpsons' Nelson Muntz;

HA-HA!

[Harold Tuttle]

The last quarterback to win a game for PSU was Mike McQueary in 1997

[AJ Dual]

Works for me.

The consensus on the talk-radio this AM was that Penn State deserved something, but they're all aghast at voiding the wins for all those years.

I stand up and give props to the NCAA, what they're reminding everyone, universities, alumni, students, fans, coaches, and players is that FOOTBALL IS JUST A GAME. IT'S NOT IMPORTANT. Especially when compared against the rape/molestation of children...

The NCAA does try pretty hard to do what it can to ensure that universities aren't just life support systems for sports programs, even if it's a Sysaphean task, and akin to beating back the tide with a spoon. However this takes the cake.

[golfclap]

[Balog]

I was hoping they'd get the SMU death penalty treatment. But this is more than I feared would happen, and strikes directly at the hero worship of that vile and pathetic excuse for a human Paterno so I'll take it without too much complaint.

[RevDisk]

I was hoping they'd get the SMU death penalty treatment. But this is more than I feared would happen, and strikes directly at the hero worship of that vile and pathetic excuse for a human Paterno so I'll take it without too much complaint.

No, it doesn't. Hero worship is quite strong, and a lot of Pennsylvanians are highly pissed at any sanctions whatsoever. Think of anything you could say to trivialize the situation, and I hear it on a daily basis. 

[grampster]

They should have taken away ALL scholarships, disallowed bowl games, prohibited playing for Big 10 championships for 14 years, 1998 when this travesty began to seep out from under a rock.

[Balog]

No, it doesn't. Hero worship is quite strong, and a lot of Pennsylvanians are highly pissed at any sanctions whatsoever. Think of anything you could say to trivialize the situation, and I hear it on a daily basis. 

Sure, you'll never convince the cultists that Paterno wasn't a demi-god. But it does strike at his reputation amongst the non-brainwashed.

[AmbulanceDriver]

Personally, I don't think the got half of what they deserved...  But what they deserve isn't fittin' to be posted...

Needless to say, I'm glad that it also sounds like a couple more of the admin types are facing charges for their complicity in this monster's actions. 

[Scout26]

I agree with AD.

I would call this a good "first step".  I would have completely shut down PSU athletics for 14 years, at a minimum.

But I hope that those who knew and did nothing, are sent to prison for the rest of their natural lives, and that Joe Paterno is being slow roasted on a spit in hell. 

[ArfinGreebly]

Disagree.

I think they missed the mark here.

The wrong people are being penalized.

Identify the responsible parties in the school administration, then ban the school from the relevant sports conference until every one of them is no longer employed at the school.

What they've done will cost their donors and the taxpayer a bunch of money, and may result in the loss of a couple of administrative jobs, but the people who colluded on this will, by and large, still be there.  And this penalty isn't coming out of their pockets.

So we levy a huge fine -- not to be paid by those responsible -- and we void victories of games played by people who weren't involved, and we leave the bulk of the jerks responsible in their positions.


The NCAA can't criminally prosecute anyone, but they could certainly turn up the heat on the actual individuals responsible by simply shutting the school out of conference athletics until all of them were gone.

Punishing "the school" is absurd.  A "school" is not someone who colluded in a crime.

The idea of "collective punishment" is symbolic but can't really be called justice.

Yes, if you gut the administration, there's going to be some collateral damage, but the approach they've taken results in even greater collateral damage.

Target the actual people rather than "the institution."

[seeker_two]

Two things that don't sit right with me....

1. No mandatory firing of all athletic personnel in the football program with inelligiabity for hire in NCAA schools. This sends a strong message to anyone participating or knowing about the cover-up & not saying anything.

2. The way the NCAA levied the punishment by not going through its established procedure opens up the possibility that Penn sues & gets the sanctions overturned. Intentional?.....

 http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8191027/penn-state-hit-60-million-fine-4-year-bowl-ban-wins-dating-1998

[RevDisk]

I'd just like to state that I completely and totally disagree with ArfinGreebly.

[French G.]

They shoulda tried to recreate the Saddam statue scene while pulling down Joe Pa's. I pretty shocked the NCAA didn't close down all the athletic program.

[ArfinGreebly]

I'd just like to state that I completely and totally disagree with ArfinGreebly.

Oh, good.

I was worried that I might be subjected to waves of fawning adoration.

[SADShooter]

AG, I see your point, and I'll agree that the collateral damage is unfortunate. However, punishing the "institution" is what creates the opening to change the culture which enabled the failures. I'm certain the individuals involved rationalized protecting the "institution", the tradition and mythic stature of Penn State football. Bursting that cultural bubble, and letting it be seen to burst, is the best shot at preventing a repetition of this disgrace. That non-offenders will suffer is regrettable, but at least it should reinforce the lesson.

[Harold Tuttle]

[AJ Dual]

I'd just like to state that I completely and totally disagree with ArfinGreebly.

Same.

We absolutely do have a long and storied history of punishing institutions, or even destroying them.

If we didn't, there'd still be an Enron, (once it came out of receivership) just with other folks at the helm.

There would still be a Nazi party of Germany...

We fight wars with plenty of "collateral damage" in terms of "innocents" too.

Something needed to be done about all those football fan lunkheads who protested on behalf of Penn State and Paterno in this mess. So now Penn State gets to be the Cubs of college football for a few decades while they "rebuild". They got off lighter than many think they should have.

And most of us who are happy with this determination are only so because while it's not enough, it was at least more than we were expecting.

[Scout26]

And the "kids" are not harmed.

Athletes can transfer to other schools without penalty (the "sit out a year" rule).

Students can go back to doing what they are supposed to being doing: studying and learning.  Not so wrapped up in a sport that the aforementioned gets forgotten.   

They should have gotten the death penalty, permanently.

[Northwoods]

Ultimately, I think PSU got off easy.  While I agree on some level that innocent people are being punished, that was inevitable.  It was just a matter of which innocent people, and how badly they suffered.  But their ire should not be directed at the NCAA.  It should be directed at Sandusky, Paterno, the exec's that colluded with Paterno in the cover-up and the board of trustees.  A severe punishment had to happen.  To not level a severe sanction would have been to just further participate in the victimization of those boys.

[Hawkmoon]

Students can go back to doing what they are supposed to being doing: studying and learning.  Not so wrapped up in a sport that the aforementioned gets forgotten.

This. In spades.

I had no idea how BIG big college football has become. 85 scholarship players -- just on a football team? I didn't know a college football team had anywhere near 85 players, let alone 85 on "scholarships." In that respect, the 20-scholarship penalty means Penn State is going to have a football team that's only the size of the entire senior class of some small colleges, rather than the size of the entire student body.

I don't pay attention to big college football, for the same reason I ignore both college (mens) basketball and professional basketball. They simply don't carry any resemblance to the way the respective sports were designed and intended to be played.

I think the penalty is appropriate. And I think the message was intended for a much wider audience than State College, PA. Allowing college football to act as the de facto minor league for the pro teams is bad enough, but for senior administrators to intentionally conceal serious criminal activity for a period of fourteen freakin' YEARS is (or was) inconceivable.

[lupinus]

When you consider offense, defense, special teams, second strings/backups/etc...it adds up pretty quickly I suppose.

As to innocent kids getting a shitty deal, it sucks but it's not the NCAA's fault. It's the fault of the morons that thought the program was best served by hiding it.

Would they be better off NCAA just killed the program, temporarily or permanently? Would it be worth all that much if they tossed the entire coaching staff (or at least all the ones that matter)? Great opportunity there. If anything the ability to switch schools without penalty is the best deal the athletes are going to get out of this mess.

[ArfinGreebly]

Same.

We absolutely do have a long and storied history of punishing institutions, or even destroying them.

If we didn't, there'd still be an Enron, (once it came out of receivership) just with other folks at the helm.

There would still be a Nazi party of Germany...

We fight wars with plenty of "collateral damage" in terms of "innocents" too.

Something needed to be done about all those football fan lunkheads who protested on behalf of Penn State and Paterno in this mess. So now Penn State gets to be the Cubs of college football for a few decades while they "rebuild". They got off lighter than many think they should have.

And most of us who are happy with this determination are only so because while it's not enough, it was at least more than we were expecting.

My objection is not to "punishing institutions" per se, because there are such things as evil institutions.

My objection is to punishing an institution -- made up largely of people who are not culpable -- while failing to punish those who are culpable.

Sixty million bucks?  Who's paying that?  The people who committed these crimes?  Not likely.  Who suffers when the university is stripped of its victories and banned from bowl games?  The perpetrators?  Well, no.

You want to punish the "institution?"  I have no beef with that so long as your punishment reaches the actual perpetrators.

Everyone is dancing around and cheering this decision as though it constitutes justice.

I'd really like to see a list of the people who actually committed this atrocity, along with a list of how the punishment directly affects each of them.

I can accept a certain level of collateral damage, but the collateral damage without an actual hit on target is kinda pointless, wouldn't you think?

[Fitz]

My objection is not to "punishing institutions" per se, because there are such things as evil institutions.

My objection is to punishing an institution -- made up largely of people who are not culpable -- while failing to punish those who are culpable.

Sixty million bucks?  Who's paying that?  The people who committed these crimes?  Not likely.  Who suffers when the university is stripped of its victories and banned from bowl games?  The perpetrators?  Well, no.

You want to punish the "institution?"  I have no beef with that so long as your punishment reaches the actual perpetrators.

Everyone is dancing around and cheering this decision as though it constitutes justice.

I'd really like to see a list of the people who actually committed this atrocity, along with a list of how the punishment directly affects each of them.

I can accept a certain level of collateral damage, but the collateral damage without an actual hit on target is kinda pointless, wouldn't you think?

Can i steal this word for word for another forum?

[Lee]

I mostly agree with ArfinGreebly...lot's of valid points.  However, it does send a message to every institution that crap like this will result in severe penalties to the whole institution, and that the whole institution (every/any institution) will pay a price for turning a blind eye to moral, ethical, and legal issues.