Where is my shocked face - Pope edition?

[vaskidmark]

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/48e13a4f1ddc41aa83db5f44ff9e78a4/la-immigration-group-center-girls-encounter-pope

WASHINGTON (AP) — Sophie Cruz's brief encounter with Pope Francis during his parade in Washington this week appeared to be the kind of spontaneous moment that is so endearing about this pope: an initially hesitant young child wrapping an arm around his neck as he offers a kiss and a blessing.

But for 5-year-old Sophie, the moment unfolded as perfectly as it was scripted by members of a coalition of Los Angeles-based immigration rights groups. They had been preparing for nearly a year for the young girl from suburban Los Angeles to make a dash for the popemobile to deliver a message about the plight of immigrant parents living in the country illegally.

They had even pulled off a similar public-relations coup a year ago in Rome using a 10-year-old girl with the pope.

"We planned to do this from the moment we learned he was coming to the States," Juan Jose Gutierrez of the Full Rights for Immigrants Coalition told The Associated Press.

Say it aint so!

stay safe.

[TommyGunn]

Why should this surprise anyone?   Really??   This is exactly the sort of thing I would expect from people like Juan Jose Gutierrez and others involved in immigrants rights organization.
So the Pope gives a kid a kiss or hug?  In the end this isn't going to change a thing.  I don't think anyone expects the Pope to trebuchet the kid back to Mexico.
The Pope probably blesses 50,000 kiddies a year.   Do you think he knew the agenda -- or cared? 
Or should?
Jesus said, "my kingdom is not of this world."  As the Vicar of Christ the Pope also is more concerned about saving souls than triffling in politics.

[Scout26]

Why should this surprise anyone?   Really??   This is exactly the sort of thing I would expect from people like Juan Jose Gutierrez and others involved in immigrants rights organization.
So the Pope gives a kid a kiss or hug?  In the end this isn't going to change a thing.  I don't think anyone expects the Pope to trebuchet the kid back to Mexico.
(ed.  I'd pay money to see that !!)

The Pope probably blesses 50,000 kiddies a year.   Do you think he knew the agenda -- or cared? 
Or should?
Jesus said, "my kingdom is not of this world."  As the Vicar of Christ the Pope also is should be more concerned about saving souls than triffling in politics. But he's not.

FTFY

[TommyGunn]

Why should this surprise anyone?   Really??   This is exactly the sort of thing I would expect from people like Juan Jose Gutierrez and others involved in immigrants rights organization.
So the Pope gives a kid a kiss or hug?  In the end this isn't going to change a thing.  I don't think anyone expects the Pope to trebuchet the kid back to Mexico.
(ed.  I'd pay money to see that !!)

The Pope probably blesses 50,000 kiddies a year.   Do you think he knew the agenda -- or cared? 
Or should?
Jesus said, "my kingdom is not of this world."  As the Vicar of Christ the Pope also is should be more concerned about saving souls than triffling in politics. But he's not.

FTFY

  Nobody's perfect.    

[Scout26]

  Pobody's Nerfect.  

FTFY  

[brimic]

So Francis, how many muzzy refugees is vatican city taking in?  
It's always easier to spend someone else's money and to *expletive deleted*it where someone else eats.
edit: sorry, a bit of topic, but francis really overstepped his pontification on all of the social justice bullshit.

The local la raza office sent some people to follow Gov Walker on his campaign trail and act as sympathy whores whenever they could get a well choreographed presentation in front of a media camera.

[griz]

I was curious about that as well so I looked it up earlier in the week.  The Vatican opened it's doors and took in a refugee family.  I believe it was four people.

[brimic]

I was curious about that as well so I looked it up earlier in the week.  The Vatican opened it's doors and took in a refugee family.  I believe it was four people.

Yes they did, and it was a christian family which will assimilate easily. Until VC takes in a few thousand male muslim invaders, he can stfu.

[lee n. field]

So Francis, how many muzzy refugees is vatican city taking in?  

And, how many middle eastern Christian refugees.  If any group's got good cause to bug out, it's them.

[BlueStarLizzard]

The US is predominantly protestant, right?

So... I'm not sure how this even really matters if they are trying to sway US citizens to their cause, because the majority isn't going to be listening to the pope anyway, right?

[MechAg94]

I just get tired of anyone in a Church or religious office playing politics. 

Global warming?  To me, that just proves his focus is on politics and not God's Word. 

[Hawkmoon]

Jesus said, "my kingdom is not of this world."  As the Vicar of Christ the Pope also is more concerned about saving souls than triffling in politics.

Jesus also said, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's." As the Vicar of Christ, his Holiness should stay the [bleep] out of politics [the things that are Caesar's] and concern himself with saving souls [the things that are God's].

[Perd Hapley]

Jesus also said, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's." As the Vicar of Christ, his Holiness should stay the [bleep] out of politics [the things that are Caesar's] and concern himself with saving souls [the things that are God's].

I think you're smarter than that. Do you really want religious leaders to be totally indifferent to what governments do for/to people (or don't do)? "Oh, sure, he liquidated all of the _______ minority group, but he let us go in and get 'em baptized first, so it's OK." Really? You'd be OK with that?

While Christianity is not (and should not be) a political party, caring about the people with the souls is part of the deal. Under your formula, Religion would have to shut its mouth about anything government decides to get involved in.


All of that being said, the media is embarrassing themselves with all this fawning coverage. It's also funny how much they adore this guy, who shares the Duck Dynasty view of teh geyz. He talks nicer than that other pope (and more carelessly than any world leader should), so they think he's some kind of rainbow-flag-waving Bono. 

[De Selby]

Hilarious - Pope speaks about ensuring the hungry are fed, and the naked are clothed.  American conservatives froth at the mouth, ironically not realising that he's basically quoting the bible.

Whatever Christianity is, the idea that it's all about market incentives and freedom of contract is simply preposterous.  Yet that's what American Christianity has become - sort of like the bible predicts, perverted and self interested people abound preaching and quoting bibles to justify their views.

[griz]

While Christianity is not (and should not be) a political party, caring about the people with the souls is part of the deal.

When he spoke to congress the topics that the news reports mentioned (I'll admit I didn't listen) were global warming, refugees, helping the poor, and the death penalty.  Now the catholic church has some more, shall we say, conservative views that have long been their policy.  But you didn't hear about them.  Ill grant that he didn't come out and say "vote democrat", but you have to admit his comments are more big government leaning than a straight up love your neighbor sort of thing.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

Perhaps  listening to what he actually said might help. Using pam Gellar or al Jones to interpret might mislead

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[griz]

Point taken.  Instead of listening I read the transcript.  It was a much more agreeable than I expected, quite positive.  In that speech he never said the words global warming for instance, so the reports that I saw must be drawing that conclusion from other talks he gave in the US.  I'm still not comfortable with some of the things he is implying, but I will say that the speech to congress does not strike me as overtly political or even big government-ish.  So I am sorry for my accusations and will admit that I even thought he did a good job.

[Perd Hapley]

Hilarious - Pope speaks about ensuring the hungry are fed, and the naked are clothed.  American conservatives froth at the mouth, ironically not realising that he's basically quoting the bible.

Whatever Christianity is, the idea that it's all about market incentives and freedom of contract is simply preposterous.  Yet that's what American Christianity has become - sort of like the bible predicts, perverted and self interested people abound preaching and quoting bibles to justify their views.

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

That being said, to claim that American conservatives (much less Christians) oppose the feeding of the hungry and the clothing of the naked does not even work as comedy.

[MechAg94]

The commentary I heard felt the Pope was talking more about Govt Welfare and handouts to feed the poor.  That isn't Christian Charity.  That is Govt theft and wealth redistribution.  There is also the point that in this country, we always thought it was better to teach or help a man work to buy his own food rather than just give them food repeatedly.  We are not a bunch of aristocrats throwing scraps to the peasants. 

That said, there is no good reason to go hungry in this country.  Between uncounted charity groups and the govt welfare I mentioned, the only people who are hungry are that way because they chose it, they made bad decisions, or their parents did one of the first two.  Food is cheaper and more abundant in this country than just about anywhere. 

[TommyGunn]

Jesus also said, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's." As the Vicar of Christ, his Holiness should stay the [bleep] out of politics [the things that are Caesar's] and concern himself with saving souls [the things that are God's].

Well, he said that in response to the Pharisees atempt to trick him by showing him a denarius, a coin with the image of the Caesar on it.  His response was to ask if that image was of Caesar, and when he was told it was, he replied that the coin must then belong to Caesar.

I think you're smarter than that. Do you really want religious leaders to be totally indifferent to what governments do for/to people (or don't do)? "Oh, sure, he liquidated all of the _______ minority group, but he let us go in and get 'em baptized first, so it's OK." Really? You'd be OK with that?

While Christianity is not (and should not be) a political party, caring about the people with the souls is part of the deal. Under your formula, Religion would have to shut its mouth about anything government decides to get involved in.


All of that being said, the media is embarrassing themselves with all this fawning coverage. It's also funny how much they adore this guy, who shares the Duck Dynasty view of teh geyz. He talks nicer than that other pope (and more carelessly than any world leader should), so they think he's some kind of rainbow-flag-waving Bono. 

   I didn't take hawkmoon's post in that light at all.  But maybe that's just me.

[Perd Hapley]

TommyGunn,

The problem with Hawkmoon's post is the false dichotomy between religious and political issues. For example, taxation is certainly a political issue, but if (as many claim) the American income tax somehow oppresses the poor, then Francis would not be out of bounds to say something about it. When it comes to government policies that really do oppress the poor, e.g. the minimum wage, he would not be out of bounds to suggest its repeal.

Conceivably, there could be a religion that contains no moral precepts about how we're to treat our fellow humans on this earthly plane (Buddhism, perhaps?). And for such a religious leader, just saving souls may be enough. Catholicism is not such a religion, however.

[Hawkmoon]

Well, he said that in response to the Pharisees atempt to trick him by showing him a denarius, a coin with the image of the Caesar on it.  His response was to ask if that image was of Caesar, and when he was told it was, he replied that the coin must then belong to Caesar.

Actually, the Pharisees tried to trick him by asking if he believed the Jews should pay taxes to Rome. They expected that He would say, "No." His response ("Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's ...") is essentially a statement in favor of separation of church and state. No, Fisty, it's not saying that governments have a right to commit genocide. It's just saying that there are two levels of law: mundane law, as enacted by governments, and God's law.Where people are dealing with things that aren't of concern to God (like paying your taxes), you should follow man's law. Where the issue is addressed by God's law -- we should follow God's law.

[Perd Hapley]

No, Fisty, it's not saying that governments have a right to commit genocide. It's just saying that there are two levels of law: mundane law, as enacted by governments, and God's law.Where people are dealing with things that aren't of concern to God (like paying your taxes), you should follow man's law. Where the issue is addressed by God's law -- we should follow God's law.

No, Hawky, it's not that simple.

[BlueStarLizzard]

TommyGunn,

The problem with Hawkmoon's post is the false dichotomy between religious and political issues. For example, taxation is certainly a political issue, but if (as many claim) the American income tax somehow oppresses the poor, then Francis would not be out of bounds to say something about it. When it comes to government policies that really do oppress the poor, e.g. the minimum wage, he would not be out of bounds to suggest its repeal.

Conceivably, there could be a religion that contains no moral precepts about how we're to treat our fellow humans on this earthly plane (Buddhism, perhaps?). And for such a religious leader, just saving souls may be enough. Catholicism is not such a religion, however.

Total aside, but, Fistful, why don't you do some research on other religions?

Because Buddishm is chalk full of moral precepts on how to treat fellow human beings.

[Perd Hapley]

Total aside, but, Fistful, why don't you do some research on other religions?

Because Buddishm is chalk full of moral precepts on how to treat fellow human beings.

Shrug. Just a guess. Must have disremembered. Sorry.