Author Topic: battleship reactivation - Reagan era.  (Read 10290 times)

richyoung

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« on: October 11, 2006, 11:25:34 AM »
Why were the four Iowa class BBs reactivated in the '80s?  I've heard a few suggestions why, such as:

1.  Naval gunfire support.  We hadn't built any new "gun" cruisers since right after WWII, and hteones we had were worn out.  As low-time hulls with big guns, and as the acme of the "battlecruiser/fast battleship" evolution, the Iowas made good substitutes.  The 5" on DDs/frigates wasn't felt adequate to support Marines going "over thet beach".

2.  As force-on-force balance/equivalent tot he recently splashed Kirov class missle battlecruiser of the Soviet Navy.

3.  As a quick way to get to a "600 ship Navy".

4.  As a substitute for a CV as the center of a battle group.

5.  As a quick and dirty replacement/suppliment to Blue Ridge/mount Whitney command vessels.

Any others rationals floating out there?
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Matthew Carberry

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2006, 11:49:06 AM »
Don't underestimate the raw morale and intimidation effect of us having the most powerful warships ever created back afloat at the zenith of the Cold War.  I think that adds to all the reasons you listed and is more complete than just the "counter to the Kirov" idea.

"Nice navy Ivan.  Say, seen our freakin' BATTLESHIPS?"

Plus, they provided a quick ability to take a 4-to-1 lead in the space race were the Japanese able to get Project Starblazers off the ground. Cheesy
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Perd Hapley

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2006, 11:53:13 AM »
The Navy was compensating for something.  Then they went to a Village People concert.  Sissies.  

Rest assured, fistful can always be relied on for interservice rivalry.  Cheesy
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Keith Wheeler

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2006, 12:02:57 PM »
I'm massively paraphrasing here, but this is something I remember from the first gulf war...they were using a battleship as an offshore artillery platform (uh, well duh, that's what a battleship is) and a reporter asked the briefing military officer:

"and the battleship, what, uh what special properties does it possess that other coalition forces don't?"

military officer:  "it floats"

Brad Johnson

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2006, 12:12:50 PM »
Quote
Any others rationals floating out there?
I had a rationale, but it sunk.

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280plus

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2006, 12:41:34 PM »
Believe me, with all the gay sailor jokes that have been around forever I was MOST appalled when the Navy picked the Village People as the group to do a recruiting song for them. I had to LIVE through that! shocked
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Perd Hapley

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2006, 12:56:58 PM »
280, we know that song makes you shake your can - nancy-boy.  Tongue

Besides, you've got to tailor your recruiting methods to your target.  Smiley
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The Rabbi

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2006, 01:06:52 PM »
Watch out Fistful or you'll be waking up to a grease-gun enema...
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280plus

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« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2006, 01:07:04 PM »
LOL,,,No, it actually makes me shake my head in wonder.

Tongue
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280plus

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« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2006, 01:11:27 PM »
The Rabbi knows about greasing?

They tried but they never did grease my ass. I was a bit scrappier than most. Cheesy
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280plus

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« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2006, 01:12:52 PM »
I don't know, If I saw the Village people headed in my general direction with a grease gun I think I'd RUN!!

LOL...
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The Rabbi

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2006, 01:24:52 PM »
Quote from: 280plus
I don't know, If I saw the Village people headed in my general direction with a grease gun I think I'd RUN!!

LOL...
Run?  Dive for it.  I'd take my chances with the sharks.
No, I was never privelaged to serve in the military but had friends in NROTC.  One of them reported that on a summer cruise one of the guys got it into his head that he was an officer and could order men around.  Men with 30+ years of service.  He found out the hard way to what usages grease guns can be put.
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280plus

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2006, 01:32:55 PM »
I'm sorry I missed that... Cheesy
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280plus

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« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2006, 01:34:30 PM »
Rich, if you do a search on Battleships over at THR you'll find a bunch of articles on the subject that I have posted over the years.
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wingnutx

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« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2006, 01:44:58 PM »
Quote from: fistful
Then they went to a Village People concert.
I couldn't decide if I wanted to be the construction worker or the sailor, so I compromised and went Seabee Cheesy

Perd Hapley

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2006, 01:45:49 PM »
off-topic:

"ass" is not acceptable in polite conversation, and therefore not on APS.  Unless, of course, you're talking about a donkey.
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280plus

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« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2006, 01:48:29 PM »
LOL,,, good compromise.

I was later again pleased with the Nav when I saw Cher straddling that big 16 incher. I'd bet they STILL haven't washed that spot. Tongue

I like to imagine whoever picked "In the Navy" as a recruitment song was summarily court martialed.
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280plus

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« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2006, 01:49:55 PM »
Yes, Mom, I was talking about my donkey, they tried to grease my donkey but I wouldn't let them. Tongue
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The Rabbi

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2006, 02:49:24 PM »
Quote from: 280plus
Yes, Mom, I was talking about my donkey, they tried to grease my donkey but I wouldn't let them. Tongue
Yeah, those Navy guys will grease anything.
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280plus

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« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2006, 03:12:50 PM »
Yep, if we can't grease it we'll paint it...
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Perd Hapley

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« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2006, 05:17:06 PM »
Quote from: 280plus
Yes, Mom, I was talking about my donkey, they tried to grease my donkey but I wouldn't let them. Tongue
That's alright dear.  Now go wash up for supper.
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Parker Dean

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2006, 07:33:46 PM »
Getting back to the topic....

I'll never be able to prove it, but IMO the big reason was to show the average Joe and non-military-savvy politicos around the world that we were serious this time. I know BB's can't control the seas like they once did but to most people they still carry a formidable intimidation factor. Naval experts would, and did, laugh but they weren't what I consider the intended audience.

They would still carry a healthy propaganda punch in much of the world but their manpower costs are far too high.

Matthew Carberry

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2006, 09:00:11 PM »
Quote from: Parker Dean
Getting back to the topic....

I'll never be able to prove it, but IMO the big reason was to show the average Joe and non-military-savvy politicos around the world that we were serious this time. I know BB's can't control the seas like they once did but to most people they still carry a formidable intimidation factor. Naval experts would, and did, laugh but they weren't what I consider the intended audience.

They would still carry a healthy propaganda punch in much of the world but their manpower costs are far too high.
The argument on that has been fought back and forth on THR.  Modernizing the electrical, propulsion and weapons would shave hundreds off the manpower requirements.  The savings in billeting space could fit more AA, AS and cruise missiles than any platform afloat today.  The Marines had a plan to pull the rear turret and put in a flight deck and hanger space for helos and Harriers.  You could fit a hell of an assault force on that ship.

Self-defense weaponry, naval gunfire support, Tomahawks and a company or two of Marines for air assault.
Assuming the thing could be refitted for a reasonble cost and the hull was not too degraded by time.

Which was what the arguments hinged on, cost and remaining useful life of the hull.
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"As for affecting your movement, your Rascal should be able to achieve the the same speeds no matter what holster rig you are wearing."

Silver Bullet

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« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2006, 10:23:49 PM »
Quote
I couldn't decide if I wanted to be the construction worker or the sailor, so I compromised and went Seabee
My favorite Seabee anecdote:  

What do you call a Marine ?

A Seabee with a light duty chit !

280plus

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battleship reactivation - Reagan era.
« Reply #24 on: October 12, 2006, 02:13:57 AM »
One thing I know is the Marines LOVE those 16" guns. Don't forget, during desert storm Iraqi troops were surrendering at the sight of the drone that directed the 16" guns. They wanted nothing to do with actually having one of those shells drop in their vicinity.
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