Author Topic: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...  (Read 8184 times)

Manedwolf

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Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« on: July 08, 2008, 08:48:45 AM »
Good man. Why can't anyone say this anymore? "Quit trying to change my identity. I never lived in Africa."

What a speech...

(language warning for an N-word in context, and some other minor profanity)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_82myl2lW1w

He is really proud to be an American here, and mentions how so many people are coming here, and few are leaving.


K Frame

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2008, 09:24:35 AM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2008, 01:15:52 PM »
I'm OK with "white," just don't call me Caucasian.  I have no ancestry in the Caucasus (that I know of) and that term has white-supremacist origins, anyway. 
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Declaration Day

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2008, 01:36:23 PM »
Smokey's a great guy.  I had a chance to meet and speak with him at the Motown Records reunion last year:




Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2008, 01:47:53 PM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
Awesome.  I officially declare myself to be European American. 

When is my European American Pride month?

De Selby

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2008, 01:55:37 PM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
Awesome.  I officially declare myself to be European American. 

When is my European American Pride month?

It runs from January to December.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Ezekiel

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2008, 01:59:56 PM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
Awesome.  I officially declare myself to be European American. 

When is my European American Pride month?

It runs from January to December.

An tradition like no other, since 1492.
Zeke

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2008, 03:47:29 PM »
Yep, remember it's only racist if white people do it.
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Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2008, 05:43:44 PM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
Awesome.  I officially declare myself to be European American. 

When is my European American Pride month?

It runs from January to December.

That's brilliant!  Why didn't I think of that?  There are just so many great Americans of European descent, and so many great accomplishments have been performed by those European Americans.  Of course we'll need an entire year to highlight and celebrate European American heritage!

De Selby

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2008, 05:46:43 PM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
Awesome.  I officially declare myself to be European American. 

When is my European American Pride month?

It runs from January to December.

That's brilliant!  Why didn't I think of that?  There are just so many great Americans of European descent, and so many great accomplishments have been performed by those European Americans.  Of course we'll need an entire year to highlight and celebrate European American heritage!

It's already the case-I can't count how many times I've heard people tell me how America was founded and made great by white people, how Latinos "don't have the culture that built this place up", how blacks made no contribution to America's first rate living conditions, etc etc.

"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Perd Hapley

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2008, 06:02:43 PM »
shooter,

I could be wrong, but you seem to be implying that a Euro-American Pride Month would be a disparagement of the contributions of other races.  If so, do you find Black History Month to be disparaging to the history of other races?
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De Selby

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2008, 06:25:00 PM »
shooter,

I could be wrong, but you seem to be implying that a Euro-American Pride Month would be a disparagement of the contributions of other races.  If so, do you find Black History Month to be disparaging to the history of other races?

That isn't what I'm implying.  What I'm implying is that there are many people who are quite explicit in stating that they think America was built by white people and that other races and "cultures" (mainly Latinos) had no hand in it, and further that what they do contribute or possess is actually bad for the country.

You see plenty of criticism of the "latino culture" taking over America, or the 'inner city gang banger lifestyle' and its evils, but you rarely see similar criticism where the target is white/european America.  And where such criticisms are raised, it is immediately attacked as racist.

I see black history month and multi-cultural programs mostly as an effort to counteract the perception that only white people have ever done anything good in America-not as disparagement.  Of course some groups make it into a racist rant against the evil white man, but these groups are widely marginalized and disparaged themselves.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Perd Hapley

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2008, 06:53:35 PM »
Thanks for the clarification. 

Quote
You see plenty of criticism of the "latino culture" taking over America, or the 'inner city gang banger lifestyle' and its evils, but you rarely see similar criticism where the target is white/european America.  And where such criticisms are raised, it is immediately attacked as racist.

And criticism of "Latino culture" or "the gang-banger lifestyle" are also attacked as racist. 

I think you're conflating the issue of race with that of culture.  One can laud the contributions of Latino-Americans, without embracing "Latino culture."  And one can lament the influence of a culture, without disparaging the contributions of those of a particular race.  Further, to bemoan the negative effects of illegal immigration is not to disparage the contributions of those who came before. 

As far as "inner-city lifestyles" go, well, you can read that as a slam on Black Americans if you like.  But that would be silly.  The inner city culture is not quite the same animal as larger Black American culture.

It would also be silly to deny that this nation's greatness was founded on European traditions, modified to suit our tastes.  That fact would be hard to miss.  Doesn't mean there hasn't been a lot of salutary influence from non-Euro cultures or people, that have made this country that much better. 
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2008, 06:58:20 PM »
I love what the man has to say.  I could (almost) have written that piece. 

But I must point out that he used the n-word rather freely.  I thought that bothered a lot of you people.  Tongue
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De Selby

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2008, 07:16:14 PM »
fistful,

The problem is that many of the proponents of the "latino culture" type critiques are conflating race with culture-or at least are perceived to be, because none of the cultures they attack have mainly white faces representing them.

I generally agree with what you posted there-but I think most of the people who propose these black history type events do so because they think that mainstream celebrations of Americana conveniently only focus on the achievements of whites, so they raise a special black or latino history month in order to raise awareness of the fact that it isn't just one race that made America great, and that many races are part of the American culture.

"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

roo_ster

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #15 on: July 09, 2008, 06:06:28 AM »
To not criticize and desire to compartmentalize/marginalize/stamp out latin and gangbanger culture in the USA is the mark of a fool or an race/culture hustling opportunist.

Gangbanger Culture
To attempt to elevate gangbanger culture to the level of the culture that made this country what it is is an exercise in or multi-cultism. One only has to look at the social science data to see the deleterious effects of that culture on the people who live in its midst.  Crime, poverty, unemployment, education...pick your metric and it will be quantifying a culture of failure and inability to cope with modernity.

Latino Culture
There are two primary subsets of latino culture in this discussion: that inside the USA and that in Latin America.

The latino culture in the USA has portions of it that can be considered gangbanger.  Usually, the longer the particular individuals have been in the USA, the less likely are they to be in that latino sub-culture (with the exception of second & third gen immigrants, who are less law-abiding and less employable than their parents/grandparents).  Unfortunately, the US latino culture is moving toward the black underclass culture, rather than striving for (as Rev Wright would say) "middleclassedness."  It would be better for the USA and those in this partcular culture that it be stamped out/subsumed rather than add to an already hard core of poverty and failure.

Latino culture outside the USA is somewhat more diverse, as it encompasses not just the under/lower/lower-middle classes, but the whole class spectrum*.  The outcome of such culture is nothing to write home about, given the history of Latin America.  Wanting to stop the spread of that culture at the border is not only smart, but moral.  That is, if one has reverence for the COTUS, the concepts of liberty & individualism, honesty in government service, rule of law, and an antipathy to oligarchy & dictatorship.  Make no mistake: governments of nation-states are expression of / functions of that state's culture.  To express antipathy toward them or to work assiduously to avoid their manifestation in the USA is showing one has judgment and doing the good/hard work of civilization.


The Difference Between Race and Culture
(This ought to go without saying, but my sig line is in effect.)

Race =! Culture, especially here in the USA.  There are whites, blacks, asians, latinos, etc. who are part of the gangbanger culture.  They are all equally debased and humped.  All that differentiates them is superficial, considering the weight of gangbanger culture.

The same goes for the brighter side, as the many examples of successful minorities demonstrate.

Same thing with latino culture.  It is a race thing only to those who don't understand it or can't see farther than the illegal aliens cutting their neighbor's lawn, who are disproportionately skewed toward one of the latino racial sub-demographics.  One has to only look at two examples: Mexico & Cuba.

In Mexico, the political leaders and oligarchs are of pure Spanish blood (limpieza).  The lower classes are almost exclusively of mixed or whole indian blood.  In Cuba, the leadership is also limpieza, but the lower classes are black (as are a great number of the dissidents the Castros have imprisoned).



* Though it is bimodal rather than a normal distribution like the USA.
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HankB

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #16 on: July 09, 2008, 06:17:56 AM »
Friend of mine almost got fired a couple of years ago.

During a "diversity awareness" session he was required to attend, he got into it with the instructor when he demanded that he be referred to as a European American.

Apparently a couple of his "highly pigmented" coworkers still won't speak to him.  laugh
Interesting.

I took some heat at our "diversity awarness" classes when, as an exercise, we were supposed to bring in a famous quote from someone that addressed the matter of diversity.

I chose the following excerpt from a speech the man gave in 1915 . . .

Quote from: Theodore Roosevelt
"There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism. When I refer to hyphenated Americans, I do not refer to naturalized Americans. Some of the very best Americans I have ever known were naturalized Americans, Americans born abroad. But a hyphenated American is not an American at all. This is just as true of the man who puts "native" before the hyphen as of the man who puts German or Irish or English or French before the hyphen. Americanism is a matter of the spirit and of the soul. Our allegiance must be purely to the United States. We must unsparingly condemn any man who holds any other allegiance. But if he is heartily and singly loyal to this Republic, then no matter where he was born, he is just as good an American as any one else.

The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin, of preventing all possibility of its continuing to be a nation at all, would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities, an intricate knot of German-Americans, Irish-Americans, English-Americans, French-Americans, Scandinavian-Americans or Italian-Americans, each preserving its separate nationality, each at heart feeling more sympathy with Europeans of that nationality, than with the other citizens of the American Republic. The men who do not become Americans and nothing else are hyphenated Americans; and there ought to be no room for them in this country. The man who calls himself an American citizen and who yet shows by his actions that he is primarily the citizen of a foreign land, plays a thoroughly mischievous part in the life of our body politic. He has no place here; and the sooner he returns to the land to which he feels his real heart-allegiance, the better it will be for every good American. There is no such thing as a hyphenated American who is a good American. The only man who is a good American is the man who is an American and nothing else.

For an American citizen to vote as a German-American, an Irish-American, or an English-American, is to be a traitor to American institutions; and those hyphenated Americans who terrorize American politicians by threats of the foreign vote are engaged in treason to the American Republic.
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K Frame

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2008, 06:45:58 AM »
That Roosevelt quote gets filed away for possible later use...
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Tallpine

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Re: Smokey Robinson on being black, not "African American"...
« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2008, 06:48:29 AM »
Quote
they think America was built by white people

Well, that's mostly the case.  How many of the founding fathers were black or hispanic?

There are notable exeptions, of course.  Most of what comprises the "American Cowboy" is Spanish in origin: saddles, riatas, latigos, chapaderos, tapaderos, boots, hats, et al.

By means of the shame of slavery, blacks can be said to have physically built much of early America.

But what is "America" ?  Basically, a place where you are at least supposed to be free to stand on your own merits and earn rewards for your own efforts.  That is something (however flawed) that the Anglo/Celtic colonists put together from scratch, and made a place where many have come to start over.  The rest of the world is just now starting to catch up (in some cases exceed) our standard of living.

Lots of folks of various origins have come here and greatly contributed.  I doubt most of them want to remake America in the image of the place they came from (escaped).
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