Growing vegetables indoors

[never_retreat]

After noticing my one and only pepper plant just decided to bud again (only 3 buds and 21/2 peppers all summer) I thought about moving it inside. Its planted in a pot all ready.
I started googling growing plants indoors. We let me tell you pot seems to be the most popular item, 2nd pot, and 3rd pot.
Anyone know a good website for growing vegetables indoors? Or any first hand experience.
I've got room in the basement and it stays fairly warm down there so I figured what the heck. Would be nice to have some fresh lettuce in the winter. I was also considering hydroponics, also when googled seems to indicate pot.

[Jamie B]

Not an expert, but I think that the key is sunlight, and the duration of said light.

I would be curious also.

[freakazoid]

So I have this friend, and he would like to know how to grow "vegetables " indoors.

 

[GigaBuist]

This guy seems legit, and by the domain name I'm guessing he's really into this stuff:  http://www.jasons-indoor-guide-to-organic-and-hydroponics-gardening.com/

I share your frustration.  Trying to look around the web for different grow light technologies had me in all sorts of places I wouldn't usually be.

Light is probably going to be your most expensive purchase.  Again, Jason to the rescue:  http://www.jasons-indoor-guide-to-organic-and-hydroponics-gardening.com/high-pressure-sodium.html

Same thing we use in the greenhouses.  Prepare for a hike in your electric bill and possibly a raid from the local police when they discover you're running a grow operation in your basement. :)  Some guy, Barry Cooper is his name, set up a Christmas tree grow operation in his basement specifically to attract cops.  Yep, they raided him.

For more on the lights this little write-up covers the basics:  http://raised-bed-gardening-tips.com/2011/03/28/about_grow_light_technologies/

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

check craigslist for someone shutting down their indoor grow

[Jamie B]

Local SO auction.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

do they resell grow equip?  that could be interesting...
wait 3months get a warrant

[Jamie B]

Bait weed!

[GigaBuist]

After noticing my one and only pepper plant just decided to bud again (only 3 buds and 21/2 peppers all summer) I thought about moving it inside. Its planted in a pot all ready.

Just curious, but where you do you live and what are you fertilizing it with?

[never_retreat]

Just curious, but where you do you live and what are you fertilizing it with?

The Garden state. Da dump.
I fertilized a little with some miracle grow I had laying around.


GigaBuist

Thats a good link. Did not find that one yet.

I'm not talking about a huge thing here, just a shelf with some fluorescent lights I was thinking.

[Gowen]

Check out aquaponics on youtube.  You could rig up an aquarium with it.

[MrsSmith]

I'm not talking about a huge thing here, just a shelf with some fluorescent lights I was thinking.

I've always had good luck with just plain old fluorescent lights. House plants in offices thrive under them. Also, if you have a good spot in the main part of your house that gets direct sunlight, couldn't hurt to put smaller plants there.

[never_retreat]

I've always had good luck with just plain old fluorescent lights. House plants in offices thrive under them. Also, if you have a good spot in the main part of your house that gets direct sunlight, couldn't hurt to put smaller plants there.

Most of our windows do not get good sun. Plus the south only has 2 windows and no room to work with.

[MillCreek]

I've always had good luck with just plain old fluorescent lights. House plants in offices thrive under them. Also, if you have a good spot in the main part of your house that gets direct sunlight, couldn't hurt to put smaller plants there.

My wife has one of those Ott full-spectrum floor lamps that she uses while she is scrapbooking.  I have often wondered if those full-spectrum bulbs would be of any use for growing indoor plants.  It is a moot question for us, since the cat destroyed all the indoor plants, so we don't have any more. 

[GigaBuist]

I'm not talking about a huge thing here, just a shelf with some fluorescent lights I was thinking.

That might work.  Advise from an old biology teacher I had (and he was smart) is to use one "cold" bulb on the blue end of the spectrum and one "hot" one from the red end of the spectrum.  Not sure what kind of plants he was talking about at the time.

If you look at a chart of what lights chlorophyll actually uses it's kind of a shallow U shaped, sucking up light heavily in the red and blue sides of the spectrum and less so as you get toward the middle where green resides.  That's why plants are typically green.  They reflect the light that they're not using.  Remember the rainbow: ROYGBIV

If you concentrate the light sources on the far ends of the spectrum the plant will have enough to live, but sometimes lacking in the middle ground can make them rather sickly looking.  I'm skeptical that you'd get a healthy enough tomato or pepper plant without the middle ground to actually produce good fruit but I could be wrong.

I suppose it wouldn't hurt to try it just with some fluorescent tubes, one on the cool and one on the warm end.  If you find them getting sickly or not producing you could possibly augment it with an LED that gives off a nice warm yellow/orange glow to fill in the gaps. 

I've always had good luck with just plain old fluorescent lights. House plants in offices thrive under them.

House plants can thrive under them because house plants don't take much light.  They're all, basically, shade plants that don't require much at all.  Spider plants and Wandering Jew, for example, don't have much of a flower at all, and basically propagate by rooting themselves off their own vines IIRC.

The fruits and veggies propagate via the stuff we want to eat and it's costly for the plants to produce their offspring.  They need a lot more energy than something like a Wandering Jew so the light requirements are going to be different.

[never_retreat]

That might work.  Advise from an old biology teacher I had (and he was smart) is to use one "cold" bulb on the blue end of the spectrum and one "hot" one from the red end of the spectrum.  Not sure what kind of plants he was talking about at the time.

That seems to be a common trend for people not using the actual grow bulbs.
Too much red and the plants will get tall and lanky, too much blue and no flowers.
That seems to me the same trend with the HID lamps. HPS is too red, MH is to blue. So they switch bulbs part way through the "grow".
Since I will hopefully have different veggies in different stages of growth I don't think that would work.
I might just rig up some mixed lamps and maybe get some of the grow type if it works.
I really can't see setting up a large grow area that would be conducive to a big grow lamp.

[Sindawe]

Too much red and the plants will get tall and lanky, too much blue and no flowers.

Yep, you need to tailor the spectrum of light the plants will "see" to mimick the natural conditions present for the type of harvest you want.   Leafy materials like lettice and spinach you want strong vegetative growth typical of high summer, fruiting and seeding bodies coming to ripening generaly need more of the longer, late season wavelenghts and shorter light to dark cycles.

I read a fair amount of material written by Dr. Howard Resh (http://www.howardresh.com/) in the late 90s when I started getting interested in horticulture again, well worth checking out.  If you have hydroponics stores in the area talk to them as well.

On lighting, I've had some good results with power compact flourecents with aquatic plants (my primary horticultural interest), the plants in the image below were grown under one 65 watt PCF.



Not food stocks of course, but demonstrative in my view of what can be achived with the right bulb and fixture setup for the task at hand.

On food crops, I think a couple of 96 watt PCF or T5 tubes would work quite well for a modest garden if attention was paid to the frequency output of the bulbs for the desired crop.  About cost equivelent to HPS or MH, and since you can get them from aquarium shops (folks use T5 + some actinic bulbs to grow corals IIRC) less risk of hassle from ignorant/close minded LEOs.

[Hugh Damright]

I suspect that your outdoor peppers would do better planted in the ground rather than in pots. You could start them indoors in pots to get a head start in the spring. It doesn't take much to grow seedlings indoors.

But growing plants indoors in the winter is fun. I've never grown peppers indoors, but I've grown many other things. I think you'd have to use hps (sodium) lights, what they call "agro" bulbs, to get fruit. Although some of the compact flourescent lamps are good if you can get the right color and good reflectors. And it also helps to have a reflecting surface around the plants to keep the light on them. Even if you're just growing seedlings under shop lights, you can drape some aluminum foil over the lights so that it hangs down and keeps the light in, and it makes a big difference.

I used to start plants under compact fluorescent lamps with good reflectors ... you can see them at http://www.ahsupply.com/96watt.htm ... but I don't think these bulbs come in a warm color like you would need for fruiting. But I think something like lettuce would grow very well.

Also, unless you are going with a 600 watt or 1,000 watt bulb, you're going to have a very limited grow space ... too close to the bulb and the plants can burn, too far away and there's not enough light ... so you need to grow short plants or somehow train the plants to stay short.

I'm thinking that a 400 watt hps bulb would be appropriate. The "agro" bulbs have the best color and the electronic ballasts are more efficient. Personally, I might start small with a 2' x 2' grow chamber with a 250 watt bulb.

Lowe's sells insulation that's a styrofoam panel with foil facing which makes a nice grow chamber ... I'd enclose three sides and then just lean a piece of the foam up against the open side to keep the light in, moving it out of the way for watering and viewing. And of course you need good ventilation to keep the plants from cooking. A heating pad under the pots might make a difference with peppers. And a fan blowing on the plants makes them stronger.

Growing indoors can also lead to an interest in crossing plants and coming up with your own peppers. I think that's what I would do ... grow plants indoors over the winter and cross them and then start the new/hybrid seeds indoors in early spring and move them outdoors to grow. I find it's fun to grow plants like that, not knowing exactly how they are going to turn out, and coming up with something new.

[Jamie B]

This is why I love the internet - always finding experts on gun boards about anything other than guns!

[GigaBuist]

Lowe's sells insulation that's a styrofoam panel with foil facing which makes a nice grow chamber ... I'd enclose three sides and then just lean a piece of the foam up against the open side to keep the light in, moving it out of the way for watering and viewing.

This idea has merit.  We had an entire room like that IIRC, somewhere between 1985 and 1998.  I don't believe we used it for finishing any product, but rather stuck a simple electric heater in there, flipped on the fluorescent lights, and used it to start plants from seed.

[never_retreat]

I suspect that your outdoor peppers would do better planted in the ground rather than in pots. You could start them indoors in pots to get a head start in the spring. It doesn't take much to grow seedlings indoors.

But growing plants indoors in the winter is fun. I've never grown peppers indoors, but I've grown many other things. I think you'd have to use hps (sodium) lights, what they call "agro" bulbs, to get fruit. Although some of the compact flourescent lamps are good if you can get the right color and good reflectors. And it also helps to have a reflecting surface around the plants to keep the light on them. Even if you're just growing seedlings under shop lights, you can drape some aluminum foil over the lights so that it hangs down and keeps the light in, and it makes a big difference.

I used to start plants under compact fluorescent lamps with good reflectors ... you can see them at http://www.ahsupply.com/96watt.htm ... but I don't think these bulbs come in a warm color like you would need for fruiting. But I think something like lettuce would grow very well.

Also, unless you are going with a 600 watt or 1,000 watt bulb, you're going to have a very limited grow space ... too close to the bulb and the plants can burn, too far away and there's not enough light ... so you need to grow short plants or somehow train the plants to stay short.

I'm thinking that a 400 watt hps bulb would be appropriate. The "agro" bulbs have the best color and the electronic ballasts are more efficient. Personally, I might start small with a 2' x 2' grow chamber with a 250 watt bulb.

Lowe's sells insulation that's a styrofoam panel with foil facing which makes a nice grow chamber ... I'd enclose three sides and then just lean a piece of the foam up against the open side to keep the light in, moving it out of the way for watering and viewing. And of course you need good ventilation to keep the plants from cooking. A heating pad under the pots might make a difference with peppers. And a fan blowing on the plants makes them stronger.

Growing indoors can also lead to an interest in crossing plants and coming up with your own peppers. I think that's what I would do ... grow plants indoors over the winter and cross them and then start the new/hybrid seeds indoors in early spring and move them outdoors to grow. I find it's fun to grow plants like that, not knowing exactly how they are going to turn out, and coming up with something new.

The veggies are in pots on the deck because of the dam dear. I have a huge yard but have not built a garden with a big fence.
I know this is APS and the solution would be to blast the four legged bastards but I can't do that being in town. With or without the det cord.
I might go to the electrical supply house and pick up a strip fixture or 2. Might get the 4' t5 ho type , each one of those bulbs puts out 5000 lumen's. I can try a mix of warm and cold or spend about 12 bucks each and get the grow type. Even if I outgrow those I can put them in the garage so they wont go to waste.
I've also been looking at some of the compact hybrid plants that are developed for container growing. Cherry tomato bushes and stuff like that.

[zxcvbob]

I have a 400W HPS security light in my basement, which replaced a 400W MH "high bay" ceiling fixture.  They both are expensive to operate, but at least in the winter they are helping to heat your house.  I'm fixin' to buy one of these:  http://relightdepot.com/fixtures/high-bay-fixtures/t5ho-high-bay/4-lamp-t5ho-full-body-high-bay-enhanced-reflector.html  It should provide as much light as the 400W HPS for half the electricity.  (the HPS lamp is slightly more efficient, but the reflector and lens eat up a lot of the light)  Also the plants just look terrible under HPS even if they are healthy because the color rendering is so poor.

You're gonna have trouble with pollination -- you might have to play honeybee with a Q-Tip -- and at some point little insects (white flies) take over and are hard to kill indoors.

[gunsmith]

ooooops!

[gunsmith]

I have a 400W HPS security light in my basement, which replaced a 400W MH "high bay" ceiling fixture.  They both are expensive to operate, but at least in the winter they are helping to heat your house.  I'm fixin' to buy one of these:  http://relightdepot.com/fixtures/high-bay-fixtures/t5ho-high-bay/4-lamp-t5ho-full-body-high-bay-enhanced-reflector.html  It should provide as much light as the 400W HPS for half the electricity.  (the HPS lamp is slightly more efficient, but the reflector and lens eat up a lot of the light)  Also the plants just look terrible under HPS even if they are healthy because the color rendering is so poor.

You're gonna have trouble with pollination -- you might have to play honeybee with a Q-Tip -- and at some point little insects (white flies) take over and are hard to kill indoors.

Sooo, you're a medical marijuana grower ?

[zxcvbob]

No, not pot plants, I have plants in pots that I try to keep alive in the winter.  Mostly peppers and amaryllis (I gave up on the cactus and citrus and mango.)  They usually do really well for the first month or two after I move them indoors, but the winters are about 6 months long up here.