Author Topic: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?  (Read 14290 times)

Ex-MA Hole

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2009, 10:38:57 AM »
I have only loved one other woman in my life.  Like passionate love.

That said, we were in High School and into early college.  We accepted that we love each other, but could never be together.

She is Baptist, I am Jewish.  When something goes wrong, she prays to Jesus.  I get up and try to solve the problem.

She goes to church regularly.  I went out and partied regularly.

I love her to this day.  We actually recently reconnected via Facebook, and we both reconfirmed our deep love.

We also accepted the fact that it would never have worked, nor would it now.





You need to realize that you may love her to the bottom of your cockles, but the religious/ ethnic aspects of her and her family will always be in the way.

It's not easy, but you need to walk.
One day at a time.

Kyle

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2009, 11:13:25 AM »
Thanks to those of you who are viewing this post in the correct light. I told her last night that we should probably not see each other in the manner we have been. I invited her to meet for lunch in the middle of next week so we can hang out one more time before I have to leave. She was sad about it but very understanding. There is more to it but that is the gist.

I have learned a lot from this episode.

#1: I have had deep feelings for this person for a long time. I didn't own up to this fact until very recently. Apparently she behaved the same way. I wonder if/how things could have worked differently if we had been more honest about  our feelings, say, a year or two ago?

#2: Unfortunately, it seems that it might be best to "stick to your own kind" after all. It is a shame, but maybe it's not worth it. It is just depressing to me to limit your options to those people who are similar enough to you in appearance/background as to not cause issue.

#3: This thread says a lot about the people on this board.

Ex-MA Hole

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2009, 11:18:55 AM »
I'm not so sure about #3....

We've all been there, and if you reread what most of us wrote, we are all telling you to run but in various ways....

It's tough, but it is what it is....
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Balog

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #28 on: May 20, 2009, 11:20:39 AM »
Thanks to those of you who are viewing this post in the correct light.

What light is that? That you're a poor widdle victim of cruel fate? Go cry emo-kid.

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I told her last night that we should probably not see each other in the manner we have been. I invited her to meet for lunch in the middle of next week so we can hang out one more time before I have to leave. She was sad about it but very understanding. There is more to it but that is the gist.

Huh, maybe you can learn. Good for you.

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I have learned a lot from this episode.

#1: I have had deep feelings for this person for a long time. I didn't own up to this fact until very recently. Apparently she behaved the same way. I wonder if/how things could have worked differently if we had been more honest about  our feelings, say, a year or two ago?

I'm a fan of going for it and seeing.

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#2: Unfortunately, it seems that it might be best to "stick to your own kind" after all. It is a shame, but maybe it's not worth it. It is just depressing to me to limit your options to those people who are similar enough to you in appearance/background as to not cause issue.

Nonsense. If she's not worth fighting for, she's not worth it full stop. And if she doesn't care about you enough to choose you over her family, you're better off without her. Is your goal to have a relationship, or "not cause issues"? Caring about what other people think is for high school students.

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#3: This thread says a lot about the people on this board.

Asking for sympathy when you're in the wrong on APS is like asking /b/ for relationship advice. :P We don't suffer fools well here. It's happened to me when I've posted a complaint about a problem I caused. The real question is how are you going to deal with it?
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makattak

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2009, 11:25:10 AM »
Quote
Nonsense. If she's not worth fighting for, she's not worth it full stop. And if she doesn't care about you enough to choose you over her family, you're better off without her. Is your goal to have a relationship, or "not cause issues"? Caring about what other people think is for high school students.


Caring about what your peers (will) think is immature.

Caring about what other people think when those other people are your or your intended's family is not "high school."

That's mature and realizing that your "feelings" aren't the most important thing in the world.

Life involves more than just what you want. It also involves what is right. It's a rather selfish desire to say "Screw your family, I'm all you need."
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

Balog

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2009, 11:26:22 AM »


Caring about what your peers (will) think is immature.

Caring about what other people think when those other people are your or your intended's family is not "high school."

That's mature and realizing that your "feelings" aren't the most important thing in the world.

Life involves more than just what you want. It also involves what is right. It's a rather selfish desire to say "Screw your family, I'm all you need."

Meh, depends on the family. I'd say "You ain't datin' no white boys" is prima facie evidence her family is not worth consideration.

Oh, and in terms of a marriage the two people involved are, in fact, the most/only important thing. What do you mean by "what is right"? People are supposed to leave their family and cleave solely to their new spouse. If the families support that, great. If they don't, then "screw them" is indeed an appropriate response.
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roo_ster

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2009, 11:41:57 AM »
Yeah, I think we were all saying the same thing.

If you want value-free affirmation and support for questionable behavior, let your fingers do the walking and find a local Unitarian/Universalist church.

"Similarities are like money in the bank.  Differences are like debts you owe."
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roo_ster

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charby

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2009, 11:46:43 AM »
Not to be an ass, but reading what you have wrote, this isn't going to work out. Cut ties, cry and learn the word next. Your perfect woman is still out there waiting to meet you.

-Charby

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Balog

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2009, 11:56:05 AM »
If you want value-free affirmation and support for questionable behavior, let your fingers do the walking and find a local Unitarian/Universalist church.

 :lol:

You are seriously on a roll today. Pure comedy gold.....
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Antibubba

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2009, 12:01:21 PM »
Quote

#2: Unfortunately, it seems that it might be best to "stick to your own kind" after all. It is a shame, but maybe it's not worth it. It is just depressing to me to limit your options to those people who are similar enough to you in appearance/background as to not cause issue.

That isn't what was said.  But you've already stated what you will and will not do.  Were you to convert and embrace Islam, with your full heart and soul, then your "whiteness" would not matter.  I would certainly understand if the parents were suspicious for a while, and so should you.


Quote
#3: This thread says a lot about the people on this board.

I would include the original poster in that statement.   :rolleyes:  You asked us a question, hoping we could give you a workable answer--a "Yes, Kyle, true love prevails always".  Given what you told us about yourself, we can't.  And I think you knew that going in.  You were just surprised by the intensity.

In the end, it is your decision, Kyle.  But ignore all this advice at your own peril.  Don't blame us for it.

If life gives you melons, you may be dyslexic.

Kyle

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2009, 12:14:40 PM »
I direct your attention to post number twenty-six. I have decided and stated what I am going to do. When I say I've learned a lot from people on this board, I mean it.

Some folks think along the lines of "Man, I know how you feel, but its better just to let it go cuz it probably won't work."

Others think along the lines of "You need to man up and grow some balls before she gets honor killed by her terrorist parents!"

Both are uh, viable, uh... viewpoints I guess. Neither is what I like to hear, but one of them is a crazy knee-jerk reaction and the other is a reasonable one.

To shift gears a bit... has anyone here ended up in a successful marriage with someone from a truly different background? Do tell. Lets hear some happy endings, if there are any  =)

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2009, 12:32:47 PM »
To shift gears a bit... has anyone here ended up in a successful marriage with someone from a truly different background? Do tell. Lets hear some happy endings, if there are any  =)

Do-able, just more difficult.  The quote in my post above encapsulates the difficulty.

Here is the author of the quote in an interview:



http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=ZWVjZDBhYzhiZDdlYTNhNjk5MDk1MjFkNjVkMTYyNjI=

The Love Doctor
Does eHarmony have the right love potion?

An NRO Q&A

Are you looking for love in all the wrong places?

Is online dating the right place?

Dr. Neil Clark Warren, the founder of eHarmony thinks he has a winning formula for helping singles find their "soul mate"—and save marriage in America in the process.

"Of all the people you meet in life, only a few would make a great marriage partner for you," Warren writes in his latest book Falling in Love for all the Right Reasons: How to Find Your Soul Mate. The eHarmony approach is to match up people based on their responses to an involved personality questionnaire (there are more than 500 questions). The name of the game is similarities—not "opposites attract."

In an interview with NRO editor Kathryn Lopez, Dr. Warren explains his philosophy and gives some love advice.

You decide if he has a sweet deal or not.

National Review Online: Dr. Warren, You know the song:
"Some enchanted evening, when you find your true love

When you feel her call you across a crowded room

Then fly to her side and make her your own

Or all through your life you may dream all alone"

Aren't you complicating something very natural with long questionnaires and tests?

Dr. Neil Clark Warren: I love this song, but it conveys a painfully inaccurate understanding of how to find your true love. Discovering your soul mate is a complex, terribly underestimated, challenge that requires the best of your cognitive potential—along with, of course, a discerning eye for chemistry. If you try to solve the whole puzzle on the basis of chemistry alone, you will inevitably risk failing in the most important decision you will ever make.

The fact is that almost everyone in this society wants to believe that you will "just know" when your true love comes along. But the marital failure rate in our country is catastrophic. Twenty percent of all first marriages have ended in divorce before the end of five years, 33 percent in ten years, and 43 percent in 15 years. The divorce figure is eventually right at the fifty-percent mark. Beyond this awful divorce rate, in some forty to fifty percent of all continuing marriages, at least one partner complains that they are not maritally happy.

Bottom line: I believe totally in the importance of chemistry in any good marriage, but most marriages will be over early if the chemistry is not undergirded by strong compatibility on nearly two and one half dozen other dimensions.

NRO: You are matching people up based on similarities. Is "opposites attract" a lie?

Warren: I often say that opposites do attract, and then they attack. It is downright exciting to find that someone who is quite different from you is very attracted to you. But, over time, when you have to negotiate all these differences and try to find one compromise after another, the task often becomes daunting.

It is so much better to find someone to love who is a lot like you. We have dozens of empirical research studies that stand behind this statement.

In one of my books, Finding the Love of Your Life, I list 50 areas in which it is good to be similar to your mate. You don't have to have all 50 of these similarities, but it certainly is good to have in the upper 30s or lower 40s. You want to have way more similarities than differences. Otherwise, you will be maritally bankrupt at a frighteningly early point in your marriage.

NRO: eHarmony, unlike your previous private practice, is somewhat impersonal—you're removed from each individual who signs up, looking for love. Does that worry you—as a doctor?

Warren: Yes. You can imagine how exciting and fulfilling it is for me these days to meet some of these couples who are getting married after having met on our site. I ask them every question I can think to ask them. When a man finds his wife, and a woman finds her husband, it is simply the most exciting moment in the human experience. How very much I loved being involved in this process on a close-up, first name, and intimately personal basis.

We have over six and one-half million men and women registered on the eHarmony site, and we receive ten to fifteen thousand new registrants every day. I can't be personally involved in very many of these. The leverage of this large population gives us in our effort to "change the world" is stunning, but, oh my yes, I really miss being involved in the day to day growth of people and their most important relationships—like I was for nearly 35 years.

And I have to confess that I worry that some of the couples who are getting married after meeting on our site may do so too quickly, may lack the somewhat more objective perspective of having someone to talk to on a regular basis about this major decision. This more intimate therapeutic function gets replaced by our efforts to help thousands instead of dozens, and I can only trust that what we are trying to do is worth this loss in detailed assistance.

NRO: How did you and Mrs. Warren meet?

Warren: Marylyn and I have been married for 46 years come March 22 of this year. We both attended Pepperdine University, but it wasn't until we graduated that we began to date. I feel like the luckiest man alive to have found Marylyn. We didn't know the first thing about selecting a marriage partner. I often say, only somewhat kiddingly, that all I knew was that I should be taller.

The fact is that so many of our best friends from college have had to suffer the excruciating pain of divorce. Marylyn and I avoided this pain because we had broad based compatibility without even knowing it up front. Others were not nearly so lucky. I got started studying mate selection because I didn't want our three girls to have to rely on the luck that saved our own marriage.

NRO: As many happily married couples as you've helped get together, there's definitely a stigma when it comes to online matchmaking. Only losers would have to opt for paid cyberdating, some (many?) would say. How do you overcome that presumably huge obstacle?

Warren: I've heard this argument hundreds of times. I staked my own professional reputation on my belief that it is terribly wrong. Only the Internet allows a person to get into a large pool of candidates (which makes more and more precise choices possible). And only the Internet allows for the massive storing and accessing of huge amounts of data which can be used to help people determine their level of compatibility with others over all these dimensions.

The stigma of meeting on the Internet has diminished enormously over the last three or four years. My prediction: In five or ten years, there will be such an awareness of the massive challenge of finding someone with whom you have broad based compatibility that almost everyone will use the internet for this critical task.

NRO: You discourage photo exchanges initially. Is that fair to the couples? Physical attraction is important, isn't it?

Warren: There's no question that physical attraction is terribly important. But the reason we have encouraged people to wait a little while to exchange pictures is so they won't make such a strong early judgment about a person based exclusively on external factors.

The fact is that the most important qualities that contribute to long term marital satisfaction are qualities from the inside of a person—their values, their "heart," their character, their personality. When you get to know these inside qualities, you will tend to be more forgiving of external features. Sometimes people veto another person on the basis of external factors, but if they had actually gotten to know them from the inside out, they would have discovered what a perfect mate this person might have been for them.

So, we believe deeply in the importance of appearance and attraction—but we believe that judgments made of a person on the basis of internal qualities, then followed by judgments based on the external factors, are the best judgments of all.

NRO: We all know mixed marriages that work—-even among devout folks. Despite your focus on similarities, do eHarmony matches ever mix it up? Is it conceivable that eHarmony would match, say, a Christian with a Jew? Catholics and evangelicals, etc.?

Warren: Similarities in areas that are really crucial to persons are the most critical similarities of all. If spiritual orientation, for example, is highly defined and passionately held for a person, it would be a mistake to try to match them with someone with a significantly different spiritual orientation. The same is true of politics—and any other body of convictions and values about which people often feel very strongly. If certain dimensions are simply of little importance to a couple, these people can often make their marriage work even when pretty major differences are present.

Bottom line: Similarities are like money in the bank. Differences are like debts you owe. It's all right to have a few debts as long as you have plenty of equity in your account. Otherwise, your marriage may be bankrupt at an early point.


NRO: What's the demographic makeup of your audience? Age range? More women than men?

Warren: Our largest numbers are in the 25 to 40 range. All states in the union (especially the large population centers) are highly represented. We have a large group of registrants from all the Provinces of Canada. Moreover, we have some relatively small representation from slightly over 240 countries.

We have about 55 percent women and 45 percent men. Interestingly enough, we are one of the very few sites in our space that has more women than men. I attribute this to our extensive focus on safety, and our obvious commitment to thoroughness.

NRO: Besides logging onto eHarmony.com and/or buying your book, what would you say to a single person reading this, perhaps alone on Valentine's Day, anxious about never finding "the one."

Warren: Decide that before Valentine's Day of 2006, you're going to do everything in your power to find your soul mate. Once you get deeply involved in this process, you will feel so inwardly hopeful—and good about yourself—because you are trying to do it right. You are no longer involving yourself in a lottery-like experience—hoping against hope. You are using the most thoughtful approach to mate selection that has yet been developed. This will get you through a lot of lonely weekends and holidays.

NRO: To folks who are reading this and are currently dating—is there a basic tool, short of your personality profile, that will guide them through whether they are seeing the right person or not?

Warren: Read Falling in Love. You can easily skim it in an hour. After that one hour, you will know whether the person you are dating is in the ballpark for you. If you're still not convinced after this reading, buy one of the other books that bears on this subject: Finding the Love of Your Life or Date or Soul Mate? How to Know If a Person is Worth Pursuing After Two Dates or Less.

NRO: What have you learned about love since starting eHarmony? Is there anything that has surprised even an experienced professional like you?

Warren: For most people, the inner yearning for a primary love relationship is overwhelmingly strong. In the grip of this set of strong desires, people often fluctuate between hope and fear. For a while, they focus heavily on hope that everything will work out for them. When they experience a few tangles along the way, they begin being dominated by fear. Sometimes they back off from their search. Once their fear abates, they begin to hope again.

It is a terribly scary thing to pursue a soul mate. Because the process has a double veto, the amount of control for either individual is slim. It is truly petrifying to consider that I might find my soul mate and then be told that they don't believe I am their soul mate.

NRO: Do men and women know how to court anymore? Do singles need eHarmony because no one taught them how to date?

Warren: To some degree this is true. But even deeper in the human experience is the lack of tutoring of any kind relating to the fundamental relational processes.

Let me briefly explain. The most important task in one's effort to find the right marriage partner is getting to know yourself well. How in the world can anyone find their soul mate if they don't know themselves at a deep level? But virtually no one in this culture has been taught to identify themselves in the most important inner places. And, clearly, if you don't know yourself well, your choice of a mate will be a stab in the dark.

When you get on eHarmony, our first effort is to help you get to know yourself better. We give you a personality profile designed to do just this. We also ask (and assist) you in identifying your top ten "must have" qualities in a mate (out of a set of 50 such qualities)—as well as your top ten "can't stand" qualities (out of a set of 50 of the most frequently reported can't stands). All of these efforts are designed to help you get to know yourself well.

NRO: How worried are you about the state of marriage in America?

Warren: The marital deterioration rate in America, if we don't bring it under control, will destroy our society. Seventy percent of all persons in our country have experienced a broken home—either the home of their parents or their own marital home. Kids are being devastated by this epidemic.

But here's the good news: We can bring this epidemic under control! Seventy-five percent of what makes for a great marriage has to do with the successful selection of a partner. And we're better prepared to do this now than ever before.

NRO: You're hoping to strengthen marriage through eHarmony-on large-scale, aren't you? How does/will that work?

Warren: We have 10,000 marriages now that we know about—with addresses, etc. We are carefully following these to make sure that they work in every way. Our research so far is highly encouraging.

We actually think that some 30 to 50,000 couples have met and married on the basis of their eHarmony matches. We are doing everything in our power to identify and reach these people. (We just announced a new program in this regard today in conjunction with Tiffany).

When the number of couples reaches 100,000 in the next few months, it will be obvious that we have begun the job—at a significantly level—of changing the world. We are aimed at nothing less.

Think of this: For every one percent that we can reduce the divorce rate in North America, this will affect about one million people in one generation. If we can ever get the divorce rate down to single digits, it will be the greatest single social revolution in the history of the human race.
Regards,

roo_ster

“Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.”
----G.K. Chesterton

RevDisk

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #37 on: May 20, 2009, 12:54:09 PM »
Thanks to those of you who are viewing this post in the correct light. I told her last night that we should probably not see each other in the manner we have been. I invited her to meet for lunch in the middle of next week so we can hang out one more time before I have to leave. She was sad about it but very understanding. There is more to it but that is the gist.

I have learned a lot from this episode.

#1: I have had deep feelings for this person for a long time. I didn't own up to this fact until very recently. Apparently she behaved the same way. I wonder if/how things could have worked differently if we had been more honest about  our feelings, say, a year or two ago?

#2: Unfortunately, it seems that it might be best to "stick to your own kind" after all. It is a shame, but maybe it's not worth it. It is just depressing to me to limit your options to those people who are similar enough to you in appearance/background as to not cause issue.

#3: This thread says a lot about the people on this board.
Quote
ome folks think along the lines of "Man, I know how you feel, but its better just to let it go cuz it probably won't work."

Others think along the lines of "You need to man up and grow some balls before she gets honor killed by her terrorist parents!"

Both are uh, viable, uh... viewpoints I guess. Neither is what I like to hear, but one of them is a crazy knee-jerk reaction and the other is a reasonable one.

To shift gears a bit... has anyone here ended up in a successful marriage with someone from a truly different background? Do tell. Lets hear some happy endings, if there are any

Unfortunately, some people are not very nice people.  Whether it's Balog here, or your lady interest's parents.  People often don't intend to be mean.  They honestly do see themselves as doing the right thing.  Everyone rationalizes or justifies their behavior.  Her parents think they are doing the honourable thing by being racists and more culturally isolationist.  Balog thinks insulting and belittling people that are/were hurting is giving useful guidance.  Maybe they're both right, maybe not.  But from their own perspective, they think they are doing the right thing.

Everyone's got an opinion.  My suggestion would be try to do your best within the guidelines of your moral or ethical framework.  Don't sell out your morals or ethics for anyone or anything.  But give it your best so you don't regret it later.  That's now the most important aspect.  Say or do what you need to get off your chest, and prepare to move on if she's not willing to meet you halfway.  I understand she's working against a lot of pressure, from her culture and family.  If she truly loved you, she would be willing to work something out even if it had consequences.  She views you as being secondary in importance to her parents, culture or whatever.  At the end of the day, that's her priority. 

I'm sorry.  If it helps, I've been there myself and know how much it sucks.  Try to remember the good times, but try not to dwell too much on it after a time.  Good luck.



"Rev, your picture is in my King James Bible, where Paul talks about "inventors of evil."  Yes, I know you'll take that as a compliment."  - Fistful, possibly highest compliment I've ever received.

Balog

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #38 on: May 20, 2009, 02:24:40 PM »
Stupid hurts, and I can sympathise. Selfish hurts too, but sympathy is more difficult. Throw em both together, stir in a side of self-pity and you're damn right I don't care.

I'm glad this girl got out before she was ostracized (or worse) by her family. Doesn't absolve you of the responsibility of putting her in that position when you knew the risks and had no plan to take care of her if the SHTF.
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Standing Wolf

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #39 on: May 20, 2009, 03:03:54 PM »
Quote
Unfortunately, it seems that it might be best to "stick to your own kind" after all.

That was brutally painful for me to learn.
No tyrant should ever be allowed to die of natural causes.

Kyle

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #40 on: May 20, 2009, 03:35:20 PM »
Balog, how about a side of snide internet-based self-righteousness to go along with it?

I'm glad my childlike and innocent little sweetheart escaped from the trap I was luring her into as well. I mean, it's a good thing that she could see through my facade and see me as the ruthless and selfish predator that I am.   :rolleyes:

I'm also not quite understanding the Unitarian comments... The Unitarians I know are some of the happiest and most well adjusted people I have ever met.

Anyway...

That Warren guy is on the right track. The problem is that you cannot tell how compatible you and your partner are until you have spent a LOT of time together.

If the e-harmony formula works (which I know it must at least to a certain degree because I know some people who got hitched through that site) the benefit is that you can hopefully find out how compatible you are up front, and not spend years figuring it out.



Werewolf

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #41 on: May 20, 2009, 03:36:54 PM »
As far as the possibility of her family being ok with me as a non-Muslim of any kind, its just not gonna happen. She has carefully explained that Muslim women cannot be with non-Muslim men (at least where she comes from).

Then what the hell is she doing with YOU? Doesn't sound at all like she's very loyal to either her family or her faith. If she was then as soon as she recognized the relationship blossoming into something more she would have stopped it. Being friends yes, but once she realized the possibility of it becoming more any real loyalty to her family and their feelings and any real belief in her faith would have resulted in her putting the brakes on very, very quickly.

Also, I forgot to mention the fact that even if I DID convert to Islam (which I wont), that doesnt change the fact that I am white. White American converts are at the very lowest rung of the social hierarchy. Arabs (generally) are really, really, really racist.

Again - then what the hell is she doing with YOU?

Hypothesis: You're safe because You're not marriage material. She can enjoy your company, get in some cuddle time and not have to worry about having to marry you.

At best you're just her current boy toy (then again you're not even getting the full benefit of that), or maybe just forbidden fruit if you will.
At worst you're being taken for a ride.

I realize that this is an impossible situation. I am (like the subject line says) just whining. Constructive advice/criticism is much appreciated, especially when based on personal experience or the details of my first and second posts.

IMPOSSIBLE is the key here. Pay attention to your own words. It ain't gonna happen, ever - you've said it yourself.

So cut the freaking cord and get on with your life.


That'll be best for the both of you - especially you, if I am right and she's just enjoying you with no intention ever of marrying you.

On the other hand: If you both truly love each other as you've said and it's the real deal then get married. In the long run it's each of you that counts and not what your families think. If its the real deal (and how often is it the real deal) y'all will get over the families' reactions. If not...

Still - I'm betting you're just her latest toy...
« Last Edit: May 20, 2009, 03:43:04 PM by Werewolf »
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Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #42 on: May 20, 2009, 03:40:42 PM »
Do I understand correctly that she's OK with you not being Muslim, and it's just her family that presents a problem?  If so, and if you really care about each other, then I suggest you do whatever you can to pursue the relationship. 

I don't care who you are, where you are, who you know, what your religion is, or anything else.  You absolutely cannot run your life according to the opinions and wishes of other people.  Deferring to other peoples' opinions over your own desires is probably one of life's biggest mistakes.

You two need to determine what you want, not what her family wants (or what your family wants, or what idjits on the internet think).  Once you know what you yourselves want, then go after that full speed and damn the torpedoes.

Balog

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #43 on: May 20, 2009, 03:51:05 PM »
Balog, how about a side of snide internet-based self-righteousness to go along with it?

I'm glad my childlike and innocent little sweetheart escaped from the trap I was luring her into as well. I mean, it's a good thing that she could see through my facade and see me as the ruthless and selfish predator that I am.   :rolleyes:

Predator? No. Selfish? Yep. The young "lady" in question bears culpability as well, of course. But you aren't the one who'd get hurt if things went bad, are you? Claiming to "love" someone, then risking their (societal/mental/emotional/physical) safety so you can play grab ass is about the most selfish thing I can think of. Like I said, I can sympathize with [deleted] , as this girl evidently is. It's just the selfish, stupid, and whiny combo that upsets me.

In any case, I fail to see how this discussion is productive. [deleted, Balog knows better...] it was risky but nothing happened. You'll not find the sympathy you're looking for here, and I doubt you'll stop being selfish and whiny just cause we tell you to.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2009, 02:05:59 PM by Gewehr98 »
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makattak

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #44 on: May 20, 2009, 03:55:36 PM »
Quote
Deferring to other peoples' opinions over your own desires is probably one of life's biggest mistakes.

Listening to your own desires over other people's warnings is probably one of life's biggest mistakes.

There are a lot of people smarter than you. There are a lot of people with more wisdom than you. There are a lot of people with more experience than you.

Don't ignore them because "But I REALLY want it!". You'll create far more problems than if you are "Deferring to other peoples' opinions over your own desires."

Your desires are often childish, selfish, and stupid. Don't (just) listen to your stupid side.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

Werewolf

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #45 on: May 20, 2009, 03:58:02 PM »
Quote
Like I said, I can sympathize with stupid, as this girl evidently is.

If the level of loyalty to her family and her faith are being accurately assessed by Kyle then this girl is not stupid at all. She knows exactly what she is doing.

Kyle, on the other hand, is just your typical 21 year old male. Which means he still mostly thinks with his thang and not his brain. One is capable and rational one is not. I'll give you one guess which one is both in control and  incapable of rationality.

Young females are subject to the same irrationality but not nearly to the same extent as young males.

Yes indeedy - she knows what she's doing. The question then becomes WHY is she doing it.
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Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #46 on: May 20, 2009, 04:03:34 PM »
Listening to your own desires over other people's warnings is probably one of life's biggest mistakes.

There are a lot of people smarter than you. There are a lot of people with more wisdom than you. There are a lot of people with more experience than you.

Don't ignore them because "But I REALLY want it!". You'll create far more problems than if you are "Deferring to other peoples' opinions over your own desires."

Your desires are often childish, selfish, and stupid. Don't (just) listen to your stupid side.
How is desiring to be with the woman he loves (and who apparently loves him) inherently stupid, childish, or unwise?

Some of the best wisdom I've ever heard was "who cares what they thing, what do you think?"  I think that applies perfectly to Kyle's situation.

seeker_two

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #47 on: May 20, 2009, 04:07:43 PM »
I have a question......

What are her true feelings toward you?  Does she love you as deeply as you seem to love her? Or are you the "forbidden fruit" that adds a little temporary spice to life but will soon pass?

You need to look past your warm-&-fuzzies and really assess how she feels about you before any further steps are taken.....
Impressed yet befogged, they grasped at his vivid leading phrases, seeing only their surface meaning, and missing the deeper current of his thought.

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #48 on: May 20, 2009, 04:14:00 PM »
It's interesting to see this devolve into Balog throwing around fighting words (calling someone a dick, or any other vulgar reference to such a body part is fighting words where I come from). Putting "lady" in quotes? Really? C'mon... I could say a lot more but I'm gonna choose not to engage. Something I learned from my happy and well-adjusted Unitarian friends  :laugh:

Of course there is the issue of thinking with my "thang." However, I have been in love once before and if you don't mind me saying (Forest Gump voice), I know what love is.

This situation wasn't about playing grab-ass. If thats is your interpretation of it, fine, that's not my problem.

It has crossed my mind that the situation might have been a sort of "wanting what you can't have" thing. I can say for certain that I love her, but I am not totally certain that this phenomenon doesn't play a part in her actions.

I have decided that we need to cool off, and just have lunch before I go. There I plan to tell her exactly how I feel and that it is probably best that we figure out what we are doing with our lives and where we are going. Staying in contact with the hope that at some point in the near-ish future that our situations might be different, something might change, etc. That seems to be the only viable plan of action. Sound good?

makattak

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Re: I just want to whine... life is so unfair... advice?
« Reply #49 on: May 20, 2009, 04:16:18 PM »
How is desiring to be with the woman he loves (and who apparently loves him) inherently stupid, childish, or unwise?

Some of the best wisdom I've ever heard was "who cares what they thing, what do you think?"  I think that applies perfectly to Kyle's situation.

I'm sorry I was unclear, I should have written "Man's desires are often...."

I did not intend to describe that situation as stupid. I intended to warn in general of listening to desires over the warnings of wise counsel.

"Who cares what they think, what do you think?" is not wise counsel when the person you are dealing with is blinded by desire and youth. (Incidentally, I'm only 30, I don't claim to be wise and experienced. I just claim to be experienced enough to know I should listen to those who ACTUALLY have experience and wisdom.)
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought