Larry Vickers had a bunch of guns seized by the AFT.

[Fly320s]

Not much info yet.  No one knows why.

https://northeastshooters.com/xen/threads/breaking-atf-has-sized-some-of-larry-vickers-collection.420356/

The PDF that lists what was seized.  Vickers' guns are listed on pages 3 through 11.
https://www.forfeiture.gov/pdf/ATF/OfficialNotification.pdf

[Ben]

Bastards.

That's some high value stuff, most of which he'll likely never see again.

[dogmush]

I had no idea that there were that many $1000 machine guns in existence.

[Fly320s]

I had no idea that there were that many $1000 machine guns in existence.

Probably just a place holder or a default value. 

[WLJ]

Posted in another forum

Yea, the feds have been after him for awhile.
Been harassing him and his girlfriend.
He has a medical Marijuana card for his cancer, gave his GF some pot, and here comes the alphabet boys.

[230RN]

Well, with a name like Vickers...

   

Say, I'm not reallly up on medical marijuana, but I thought the trigger words were "habitual user of."  How can someone be a "habitual user" if he's got an MD's Rx for the stuff?

[dogmush]

The phrasing is "Unlawful user of".  And since MJ is still illegal everywhere in the country,  that's  an excuse if they are looking for one.

[Boomhauer]

The feds railroaded Kyle Meyers, the guy who was FPSRUSSIA, seized 400k of guns and threw him into federal prison for 6 months over a little MJ. They will do the same to Vickers most likely

[Fly320s]

This could make an interesting court case.

Legal marijuana vs legal guns.  Do they cancel out or are both protected under law?

[cordex]

This could make an interesting court case.

Legal marijuana vs legal guns. 

As far as the Feds are concerned, the marijuana isn't legal, though.  And his use of marijuana makes the possession of the guns illegal.  Whatever state he has a pot card from might not prosecute him (NC doesn't seem to allow medical marijuana except for certain CBD oils), but he's not facing state level charges right now, is he?

Do they cancel out or are both protected under law?

Or, more likely, are neither protected?

[Ron]

Well, smoking dope or machine guns, choose one or the other but don't try and choose both unless you are looking for potential legal/Fed trouble.

Hopefully he has good lawyers and he escapes punishment.

[Ben]

Well, smoking dope or machine guns, choose one or the other but don't try and choose both unless you are looking for potential legal/Fed trouble.

Hopefully he has good lawyers and he escapes punishment.

Yup. You can't even say that an ATF under a Republican admin wouldn't be doing the same thing. This time they're using pot laws because they hate guns. Under an R they might punish a gun owner because they hate pot.

Leave me alone.

[WLJ]

Can't speak to the truthfulness of the MJ rumor. That just what I saw in another forum.

Also seeing he lost/gave up his SOT and the guns seized are post 86 https://twitter.com/FreedomFriedF/status/1445501276419018761

[cordex]

I thought it was interesting that Brandon Herrera got one of his early model AKs a little while back - must have been related to him giving up his SOT.

[MechAg94]

I thought it was interesting that Brandon Herrera got one of his early model AKs a little while back - must have been related to him giving up his SOT.

Makes me wonder if he was working on unloading them, but it was a work in progress and the AFT got impatient or wanted to jump the gun.

[HankB]

The Feds probably don't recognize STATE issued medical MJ cards since MJ is FEDERALLY illegal.

I know that there used to be a FEDERAL program providing "legal" MJ to a (very) few people for medical conditions like glaucoma, but I heard that this program was terminated for new applicants; perhaps older users were grandfathered.

Disclaimer: What I think the current status is of this program shouldn't be considered reliable info, and I've no ideal what if anything MJ has to do with Vickers.

[WLJ]

"SOT probably expired"

ATF Takes 179 Machine Guns from Larry Vickers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkT0SHWMpSo

[Hawkmoon]

The Feds probably don't recognize STATE issued medical MJ cards since MJ is FEDERALLY illegal.

I don't think there is any "probably" involved. Federal law does not recognize state-issued marijuana cards. This point has been made on "gun" forums many, many times in response to questions about how holders of medical marijuana cards should respond to the question on the 4473. The answer is always "Don't." If you are using marijuana, you can't lawfully possess firearms under federal law.

[Ben]

I don't think there is any "probably" involved. Federal law does not recognize state-issued marijuana cards.

More to the point, they both don't recognize the state laws, but then also ignore the Federal laws until it suits them. They ignore the medical mary laws until they can use them to their advantage.

Ayn Rand was prescient.

[charby]

I guess we can toss out the "We don't need new gun laws, just enforce the existing ones on the book" argument?

[Ben]

I guess we can toss out the "We don't need new gun laws, just enforce the existing ones on the book" argument?

I'm not sure where you're going with that, but there's a difference between the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. They raided him while he was in chemo. It could very well be that he had health issues that overrode his keeping up on paperwork. If his SOT expired, okay, that's the law, but the spirit of the law would take extenuating circumstances into account and maybe they could have worked with him. Even the IRS follows the spirit of the law most of the time and doesn't just seize assets - they work with people first.

This sounds too much like some Chapman like chap at the ATF saw an opportunity (letter of the law) to get some "evil machine guns off the street". Perhaps there will be more info released over time that clarifies just what happened.

[charby]

I'm not sure where you're going with that, but there's a difference between the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. They raided him while he was in chemo. It could very well be that he had health issues that overrode his keeping up on paperwork. If his SOT expired, okay, that's the law, but the spirit of the law would take extenuating circumstances into account and maybe they could have worked with him. Even the IRS follows the spirit of the law most of the time and doesn't just seize assets - they work with people first.

This sounds too much like some Chapman like chap at the ATF saw an opportunity (letter of the law) to get some "evil machine guns off the street". Perhaps there will be more info released over time that clarifies just what happened.

Hopefully more info is released, Vickers might of told them to FO since he might not be alive that much longer and all out of F's.

[230RN]

I guess we can toss out the "We don't need new gun laws, just enforce the existing ones on the book" argument?

That's why I can't abide that stupid argument.

Yes.

Stupid.

It's another case of successive compromises (since 1933) resulting in transformation of a right into a privilege with approval by unthinking acclamation.

Terry, 230RN

[Hawkmoon]

More to the point, they both don't recognize the state laws, but then also ignore the Federal laws until it suits them. They ignore the medical mary laws until they can use them to their advantage.

Ayn Rand was prescient.

Truth.

[Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas]

Let's ignore the guys smuggling guns to the Sinaloa cartel en masse, and let's raid the cancer patient who is absolutely not doing such things. Yeah that's pretty standard ATF procedure.