Author Topic: British show exposes global warming 'lies'  (Read 2389 times)

Desertdog

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British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« on: March 17, 2007, 06:20:50 PM »
Be sure to go to the movie on Youutube, it is very interesting.
I just had to post this, even though I know the Gloal Warmist will want to wring my neck.


British show exposes global warming 'lies'
Documentary's scientists, climatologists agree: 'The whole thing stinks'
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=54737


"THE ICE IS MELTING," blares the opening headline in the latest TV documentary on global warming. Amid thunderous music and video bites of furious ocean waves, melting glaciers and tornadoes, the headlines continue:

"THE SEA IS RISING."

"HURRICANES ARE BLOWING."

"AND IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT."

But then, the dramatic documentary, produced by the UK's Channel 4 TV, deviates from the rest of today's dire presentations on impending global-warming disaster. The headlines continue:

"SCARED?"

"DON'T BE."

"IT'S NOT TRUE."

In "The Great Global Warming Swindle," (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XttV2C6B8pU) British TV director Martin Durkin interviews scientist after scientist who claim the current hysteria over global warming is, in a word, nonsense.

Here's how the announcer introduces the controversy at the outset of the 60-minute program:


"Manmade global warming is no longer just a theory about climate change. It is the defining moral and political cause of our age. Campaigners say the time for debate is over. Any criticism, no matter how scientifically rigorous, is illegitimate  even worse, dangerous.
"But in this film, it will be shown that the earth's climate is always changing, that there is nothing unusual about the current temperature, and that the scientific evidence does not support the notion that climate is driven by carbon dioxide, manmade or otherwise.

"Everywhere, you are told that manmade climate change is proved beyond doubt.

"But you are being told lies."

Readers can view the entire British documentary on YouTube.

Currently, the video is going viral in the online world, and threatens to break the stranglehold that global-warming hysteria has on the world's major media.

But what's behind the hysteria?

The current edition of WND's popular Whistleblower magazine  titled "HYSTERIA: Exposing the secret agenda behind today's obsession with global warming"  reveals why so many scientists, journalists and others are so gripped by global warming fever.

Whistleblower shows how all the main players  from politicians and scientists to big corporations and the United Nations  benefit from instilling fear into billions of human beings over the unproven theory of man-made global warming. Indeed, just three weeks after the U.N. ratcheted up international fears over global warming, a panel of 18 scientists from 11 countries has now reported to the U.N. that the only thing that can stop catastrophic climate change is a global tax.

Chuck Dye

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Gee, I'd love to see your data!
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2007, 06:33:45 PM »
The science is debatable. I am more inclined to take articles in peer reviewed scientific journals seriously than pop media noise (the notion of taking Rush Limbaugh et al seriously on matters of science, or anything else, nauseates me.)  The peer reviewed literature is still in conflict, but it seems to me obvious that "Dont foul your nest" is a wise course to take.

Desertdog

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2007, 06:42:49 PM »
"Gee, I'd love to see your data! "
First watch the movie, and you can see the data they have, and how it has been displayed.

RJMcElwain

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2007, 04:27:33 AM »
All in all, it was a good, well done program. And the one point of view they offer counterbalances the hysteria from the other side.

Having read a fair amount of the scientific literature out there, I'd say that, yes, the globe is warming. However, I think mankind is a fairly insignificant factor in the mix.

And the worldwide debate is only beginning. And yes, I'm still looking for the ulterior motive behind all the media blitz. Promoting a tax, or massive spending, or the removal of a few more parts of the Bill of Rights comes to mind.

Bob
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geronimotwo

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2007, 07:16:55 AM »
i just did a search, as i was looking for a reasonable source to be able to refute the claims of manmade global warming. i personnally believe the climate is changing, but i'm not certain if man has a big impact. unfortunatly this source seems to have dubious resources.

here are a couple of wiki links about this show, and the director.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Global_Warming_Swindle

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Durkin_(television_director)

does anyone have better resource?
make the world idiot proof.....and you will have a world full of idiots. -g2

Iain

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2007, 07:23:21 AM »
Wiki is probably a good place to start with that show and with Durkin.

Besides that, this show was aired months and months ago, and this whole business was kicked to death here around then. Suffice it to say, there are plenty of responses to this show out there, take your pick as to which you 'believe'.
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atomd

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2007, 07:31:10 AM »
They took this off of youtube. If you wanted to check it out, it's still at:
http://en.sevenload.com/videos/ha4PoKY/The-Great-Global-Warming-Swindle

Creeping Incrementalism

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Re: Gee, I'd love to see your data!
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2007, 07:51:01 AM »
it seems to me obvious that "Dont foul your nest" is a wise course to take.

Actually, this attitude is dead wrong, even if the majority opinion on global warming is correct.  Their disastrous estimate of sea level rise is... ready for this?  Three feet.  When you consider the enormous costs to combat it, the minimal beneficial effects of the solutions, and the minor problems of global warming effects, the wisest choise is to do little or nothing.  Compound interest has a lot to do with the economic analysis--when you consider any benefit won't be seen for 100 years, if you invesnt only a single dollar that you would have otherwise spent on global warming fixes, you would have $2,199.76, assuming an interest rate of 8%, which is a pretty safe bet for a 100 year period.  The actual formula is $1*1.08^100.

Also I find the thought of trying to get the China, set to become the world's #1 carbin emitter, to go along with any global warming restrictions, unrealstic.

Manedwolf

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2007, 08:14:32 AM »
Carbon credits is a Ponzi scheme worth billions of dollars. Follow the money.


Gewehr98

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2007, 08:26:17 AM »
Carbon Credits = Papal Indulgences.   sad
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Thor

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2007, 08:33:57 AM »
Here is the real truth about Global Warming based on what little historical knowledge we have.

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Manedwolf

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2007, 08:38:44 AM »
So obviously, by that chart, the previous warmings were caused by the Hebrew exodus, the Roman empire, and Viking explorations.  grin

(At least, using the sort of correlations ALGORE uses...)


geronimotwo

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2007, 09:20:38 AM »
Quote
Their disastrous estimate of sea level rise is... ready for this?  Three feet.

see, that just doesn't make sense. i did the calculations on just the ice on greenland, which (if it all melted) would equal a 7-8 ft rise in global sea level.

Quote
take your pick as to which you 'believe'.

that's my problem. i want to believe i couldn't possibly have an effect on the global environment, but i want to be sure, i have kids.

thor, that's a great graph, but if it is trying to show that eruptions cool the planet, then how can temps rise throughout the 1700-1900 period? it seems that the chart prooves there is no correlation to the title stated in the lower left corner. also i don't see any part of the graph refering to solar irradiation, which is part of the titles statement. do you have a link for where this graph came from?

So obviously, by that chart, the previous warmings were caused by the Hebrew exodus, the Roman empire, and Viking explorations.

hahaha that is funny.

make the world idiot proof.....and you will have a world full of idiots. -g2

Iain

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2007, 09:50:57 AM »
The enquiry should begin with the mainstream position - that man is having an effect, and how man is having that effect. I'm not talking about needing to have complete comprehension of the science, but perhaps rather comprehension of the scale of the science, the sheer amount that exists.

I'm glad you question that chart, random charts that appear from nowhere (especially when google scholar searches on the creators yield little to nothing) that seem to 'prove' anything definitely have a certain smell about them. Especially in the light of the fact that claims about volcanoes and solar radiation as drivers of the present situation are outside of the mainstream scientific consensus (that's become a dirty word lately by the way).

There is little point in my contributing more, you're better off starting your enquiry elsewhere, but I'll leave where entirely to your discretion.
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Thor

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2007, 10:52:46 AM »
The chart came from here: http://www.longrangeweather.com/images/GTEMPS.gif

and is posted here: http://www.longrangeweather.com/Long-Range-Weather-Trends.htm

Quote
Climatologist Cliff Harris has been often rated as one of the top ten climatologists in the world for nearly 4 decades. Cliff Harris' long-range weather forecasts have been used by high-ranking government officials and quoted in USA Today, The Wall Street Journal, New York Times, The Wall Street Digest, Farm Journal, Top Producer, Successful Farming, Futures Magazine, The Boston Globe and many other publications. He also provides several weekly local and national radio weather broadcasts to various stations throughout the country. As one of the partners of Harris-Mann Climatology, Cliff provides daily weather updates to hundreds of subscribers through DTN, Farm Dayta, the Internet and various local media. His weather and commodity forecasting success rate is approximately 75% and he accurately predicted the current prolonged cycle of global weather "extremes" in 1966. Since age 11, he has compiled nearly 100 weather scrapbooks that detail major events throughout the U.S. and the world on a daily basis. Cliff operates a weather station in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho and writes a popular weekly column called 'Gems' for the Coeur d'Alene Press. He has been quoted in CNN and "Not by FIRE, but by ICE" by Robert W. Felix. Cliff and his wife Sharon have been married for 43 years and have 2 children, 3 grandchildren and 2 toy poodles.

Quote
Meteorologist Randy Mann has been recognized by the American Meteorological Society since 1988. As a partner of Harris-Mann Climatology, he provides some of the daily weather information, computer graphics and maintenance for the company. Randy has also had an extensive background in television and radio weather production, and has provided on-air television weather forecasts to KCPQ in Tacoma, Washington; KCRA-TV in Sacramento, California, WPTZ-NewsChannel 5 and was Chief Meteorologist for WVNY Channel 22 and WEZF Radio in the Burlington/Plattsburgh area. He currently provides on-air weather forecasts for KREM-2 in Spokane, Washington and is currently the Chief Meteorologist for the Coeur d'Alene Press weather page. He also writes a weekly weather column for the Valley Edition of the Spokesman Review. In the past decade, Randy has also designed other weather-related publications that include two North Idaho weather calendars, the International Traveler's Weather Guide, Tom Loffman's Sacramento Weather Guide, the Vermont Town and Weather Almanac (7 Editions), the award-winning 1997 Frederick County Weather Almanac and the 1998, 1999, Year 2000 and the 2001 Frederick County Weather Almanacs. He has been married to his wife Sally for over 15 years.
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geronimotwo

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2007, 11:04:00 AM »
thanks for the links and info.

Quote
The enquiry should begin with the mainstream position - that man is having an effect, and how man is having that effect.

the most convincing argument for the case of global warming is that 30 years ago people were denying it even existed, whereas now the argument is whether man can have a major effect on it or not. while your statement may imply that more people believe this than any other theory, i am not sold on the quantity = quality line of thought. i am one of those people that will have ten people tell me not to do something one way, but i have to try it for myself. unfortunatly in this case, i need to determine a credible source for my info. the tough part is determining which source is correct.

Quote
Carbon credits is a Ponzi scheme worth billions of dollars. Follow the money.

i was reading about the ships that are being used to seed the oceans with iron filings. this in turn feeds plankton or algea, and causes co2 to be converted back to oxygen at a very large quantity. so i start thinking, "great, problem solved!", until i continue reading where they then sell the co2 credits they are creating to industries to allow them to release more co2.
make the world idiot proof.....and you will have a world full of idiots. -g2

grampster

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2007, 11:28:42 AM »
According to a couple of American scientists, Quantum theorists, humans are destroying The Universe because we are looking at it.  I'm going out tonight and look again so I can say I shortened the life of The Universe. shocked

Crap, it's gonna be cloudy, so I guess I'll just have to wait till another night. undecided
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Nitrogen

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2007, 02:27:21 PM »
Ok, let's take a look at some of these theories scientifically.
(After getting my chemistry on in the other thread, I guess I'm on a roll here.)

First, there's a popular theory that the sun's increased solar output is responsible for warming.
it's a great theory, if you only look at earth. 

Some scientists point to warming on mars as proof of this theory.  The problem with this is that Mars' warming can be explained by its Milankovitch cycles.  (Basically, these are explained by orbit excentricity, Axial tilt, and axial wobbling.  Mars's excentricity is more pronounced than ours, that that has an effect.

Another scientist has pointed to warming on Jupiter.  One problem with this, is that atmospheric dynamics of Jupiter are driven by internal planatery heat, not solar output.  Basically, the warming is better explained by convection than solar output.


Oh, and if anyone says we're destroying the universe by looking at it, they have quite a misunderstanding of quantum mechanics, which is understandable because NOBODY really understands it.

Basic debunking of that: Observation in QM destroys possabilities, not the system.
Most people know the "Schrödinger's cat" thought experiment.  This demonstrates the observation collapse of the waveform quite well.  For those that dont know it, a quick referesher:

Quote
A cat is in an opaque box with a canister of poisonous gas, a radioactive isotope, and a geiger counter. You can't see inside the box.  The isotope has a 50% chance of decaying within one hour.  If it decays, the geiger coutner detects it, and releases the poisonous gas.

Until you open the box, (in QM terms) the cat is both dead and alive.  The act of opening the box "collapses the waveform" or, destroys all possabilities but one, which ends up being the "true" one.

This is a thought experiment meant to explain some of the crazy crap involved with quantum mechanics.  If you take the idea that observing the universe destroys it, to put it in "cat" terms, observing the cat would destroy it.  It only destroys infinity-1 possabilities, not the whole system
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Tallpine

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2007, 02:57:18 PM »
Causation aside, is there any argument that the earth was not warmer around 1100 BC and 1300 AD than it is today Huh?
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wooderson

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2007, 03:14:47 PM »
The question is never whether or not the Earth was warmer at a given point compared to today. That is, at best, a non-sequitur. As relevant to genuine debate as the nuts who try to claim that scientists were preparing for an ice age one generation past.

The question is whether or not this period of climate change is abnormal - and if the process will spin out of control compared to previous periods because of our impact on the environment. Warming and the rising sea levels are not the only factors in play - climate change may well lead to longer droughts in large parts of the world, stronger and more common hurricanes, etc..
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Desertdog

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2007, 06:53:05 PM »
For What it's Worth.

Satellite Data Shows Temps FALLING Since 1998, declining to 1983 levels...

Christopher Booker's Notebook
By Christopher Booker
Last Updated: 1:48am GMT 25/11/2007
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtmlxml=/news/2007/11/25/nbook125.xml


We are set on a course of 'planet saving' madness

The scare over global warming, and our politicians' response to it, is becoming ever more bizarre. On the one hand we have the United Nation's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change coming up with yet another of its notoriously politicised reports, hyping up the scare by claiming that world surface temperatures have been higher in 11 of the past 12 years (1995-2006) than ever previously recorded.

This carefully ignores the latest US satellite figures showing temperatures having fallen since 1998, declining in 2007 to a 1983 level - not to mention the newly revised figures for US surface temperatures showing that the 1930s had four of the 10 warmest years of the past century, with the hottest year of all being not 1998, as was previously claimed, but 1934.

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On the other hand, we had Gordon Brown last week, in his "first major speech on climate change", airily committing his own and future governments to achieving a 60 per cent reduction in carbon emissions by 2050 - which is rather like prime minister Salisbury at the end of Queen Victoria's reign trying to commit Winston Churchill's government to achieving some wholly impossible goal in the middle of the Second World War.

Mr Brown's only concrete proposal for reaching this absurd target seems to be his plan to ban plastic bags, whatever they have to do with global warming (while his government also plans a near-doubling of flights out of Heathrow).

But of course he is no longer his own master in such fantasy exercises. Few people have yet really taken on board the mind-blowing scale of all the "planet-saving" measures to which we are now committed by the European Union.

By 2020 we will have to generate 20 per cent of our electricity from "renewables". At present the figure is four per cent (most of it generated by hydro-electric schemes and methane gas from landfill).

As Whitehall officials privately briefed ministers in August, there is no way Britain can begin to meet such a fanciful target (even if the Government manages to ram through another 30,000 largely useless wind turbines).

Another EU directive commits us to deriving 10 per cent of our transport fuel from "biofuels" by 2020. This would take up pretty well all the farmland we currently use to grow food (at a time when world grain prices have doubled in six months and we are already face a global food shortage).

Then by 2009, thanks to a mad gesture by Mr Blair and his EU colleagues last March, we also face the prospect of a total ban on incandescent light bulbs.

This compulsory switch to low-energy bulbs, apart from condemning us to live in uglier homes under eye-straining light, is in practice completely out of the question, because, according to our Government's own figures, more than half Britain's domestic light fittings cannot take them.

This year will be remembered for two things.

First, it was the year when the scientific data showed that the cosmic scare over global warming may well turn out to be just that - yet another vastly inflated scare.

Second, it was the year when the hysteria generated by all the bogus science behind this scare finally drove those who rule over us, including Gordon "Plastic Bags" Brown, wholly out of their wits.

Billions of MoD spending is off target

The great row over under-funding of our forces in Iraq and Afghanistan, led in the Lords by five former Chiefs of the Defence Staff, has so far missed a hugely important part of the story, although it was hinted at by General Sir Mike Jackson when he was interviewed on the Today programme.

Alas, John Humphrys failed to pick up the significance of Jackson's observation that "we may not have enough to do the things which we do now and the things which we may have to do in the future".

The problem with our defence spending in recent years is not that the Ministry of Defence has been starved of cash. On the contrary, it has been earmarking colossal sums for projects designed to equip us to fight imaginary wars in the future, as part of the European Rapid Reaction Force to which Tony Blair and Geoff Hoon committed us around 2000: £20 billion on the Navy's two giant carriers (with planes and infrastructure); £16 billion on FRES, a new family of vehicles for the Army; not to mention the £20 billion already committed to Eurofighters for the RAF.

It was the diversion of resources into planning for that imaginary future that took the eyes of the MoD and the then-Chief of the Defence Staff off the need to equip our forces adequately for the totally different type of insurgency war they have actually been having to fight.

The MoD is belatedly trying to make amends for this disastrous blunder, for instance equipping our troops with properly mine-protected Mastiffs, instead of the unprotected Snatch Land Rovers that have caused so many deaths. It may also help that enthusiasm for the EU's fantasy armed forces of the future has been on the wane.

But no one at the time shared that enthusiasm more obviously (or was happier to send those hopelessly inadequate Land Rovers to Iraq) than the officer who was then Chief of the Defence Staff, General Sir Mike Jackson.

Schools minister neglects homework

Desmond Swayne, MP for New Forest West, tells me of a fearful problem affecting Hampshire schools, which have been told by the county education officer, Ian Beacham, that under new rules teachers must no longer drive pupils in mini-buses unless they have a full "passenger vehicle licence" - "a huge and expensive undertaking which entitles them to drive a coach or bus".

Threatening many extra-curricular activities, such as away sporting fixtures, this is causing such grief that Mr Swayne has asked in Parliament whether it is right that teachers should be forbidden to drive children in this way.

Schools minister Jim Knight didn't know the answer but said he would look into it. Harriet Harman, Leader of the House, suggested that Mr Swayne should move for a debate on the issue.

Had those ministers or Hampshire's education officer learned to use Google, they might have found in seconds that this is all a fuss about nothing. The two relevant EU directives on driving licences, 91/439 and 2003/59, make clear that teachers are exempted from the licensing requirements, as does a leaflet available at the click of a mouse on the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency website.

But does it not say something about the way we now allow our laws to be made in Brussels that neither ministers nor a council official responsible for enforcing them appear to know what those laws say?

" On October 19, 1999 I reported here a remarkable "personal message" sent out to Britain's small businesses over the signature of Nick Montagu, then head of the Inland Revenue Board. He told them how "exciting and important" it was for him and his staff to be "at the forefront of implementing the new Labour Government's policy agenda".

How apt, in light of the mega-grief they are currently causing the Government, that eight years later our incompetent tax-gatherers appear to be playing such a significant part in New Labour's impending downfall.
 

gunsmith

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2007, 07:51:31 PM »
I never took it serious, the same people yelling "global warming"
told me that guns kill people.
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Iain

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2007, 04:50:00 AM »
Quote
This carefully ignores the latest US satellite figures showing temperatures having fallen since 1998, declining in 2007 to a 1983 level

Booker is cherry-picking.

There were a couple of warm months in '83 that have exceeded some cooler months in 2007, and there was an El Nino event during a couple of months of 1998. All these are more unusual events, overall though the trendline for the whole period is up.

Moreover Booker seems to only be referring to US satellite temps, and when he refers to 34 as being the hottest year he is definitely only referring to the US. There's a 'global' in AGW.

Not sure that we need our daily Drudge report rehash back again.
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Creeping Incrementalism

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Re: British show exposes global warming 'lies'
« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2007, 06:17:54 AM »
Quote
Their disastrous estimate of sea level rise is... ready for this?  Three feet.

see, that just doesn't make sense. i did the calculations on just the ice on greenland, which (if it all melted) would equal a 7-8 ft rise in global sea level.

That's probably because only some of the ice on Greenland will melt.  The number I got is from the last widely publicized report from the U.N. climate change commission.

Quote
the most convincing argument for the case of global warming is that 30 years ago people were denying it even existed, whereas now the argument is whether man can have a major effect on it or not.

Actually, 30 years ago the scientists were talking about global cooling.  And the argument about whether or not man could have an effect on it or not is about new, I started reading about it not long after the Kyoto treaty was first proposed.

Here's one from 2001 http://www.reason.com/news/show/34824.html:"Climatologists estimate that implementing the Kyoto Protocol would, by 2100, avoid only 0.14 degrees C of temperature rise."

Either way, there is not a thing we can realistically do about it that will make any difference, and furthermore, the cure is worse than the disease.  By their own estimates, global warming would cause between 1 and 5 percent decrease in GDP in 100 years.  So instead of the $2200 in compound interest that develops, you have "only" $2090 to $2180.  Compare that with the effectively 0 present value of any dollar we spend today combating global warming, when you consider the discounting effects of a benefit derived a hundred years in the future.

There is no debate.  Even by their own numbers, economically, the obvious best course of action right now is to do nothing, other than continue to study the issue.  With the money we don't spend fighting global warming, in 100 years we will be easily able to afford sea walls that are a few feet higher, better medicine to fight the spread of any tropical diseases, and probably the technology (cold fusion or another advanced tech.) to begin a truly effective reduction of carbon emissions, and all without strangling the economy of industrialized nations today.  I would say "strangling the economy of the entire world" but the developing world will never go along with this stupidity when they need a modern economy so badly, which would completely defeat the purpose of any efforts by the developed world to fight global warming in the first place.

Global warming is just a farce for environmentalists to impose their long wishlists against industrialized society, consumption, cars, and the good life.  No one will really give up their comfortable lives to fight something so vague, not even the environmentalists like Al Gore.