Wisconsin Senate orders arrest of Democrats who refuse attendance

[Ned Hamford]

http://weaselzippers.us/2011/03/03/wisconsin-senate-orders-arrest-of-14-dem-fleebaggers/

I am quite amused at the calls that the republicans have 'gone around the bend' and are 'forcing a constitutional crisis' by their action to compel attendance.

What do they expect to happen when duly elected folk refuse to participate in the democratic process when they can't get their way?

I feel like I'm watching the antics of elementary school children.

[Jamie B]

It’s unclear whether the resolution to force the senators back to the Capitol is constitutional.

The Repubs are showboating - never trust any politician, as all they do is look forward to their next election.

[kgbsquirrel]

The Repubs are showboating - never trust any politician, as all they do is look forward to their next election.

Show boating or not, is it actually wrong to find these people in contempt and issue arrest warrants for them? A minority group of people who are intentionally stalling the democratic process.

[AJ Dual]

Show boating or not, is it actually wrong to find these people in contempt and issue arrest warrants for them? A minority group of people who are intentionally stalling the democratic process.

Minor difference it's not an "arrest warrant", it's contempt of the State Senate. Like if the fed.gov Senate holds hearings, and you refuse to honor a subpoena etc.

The Master of Arms for the Senate does have Senate rules/WI constitutional authority (in theroy anyway) to drag members into the chamber by the scruff of the neck to force a quorum if the President of the Senate has called them into session.

So it's not "showboating", at least within the borders of WI.

How to negotiate that or extradition with IL is another matter though.

The stakes are kind of high for the WI Senate Dems, as the Senate only has to catch one of them, and dump them on the floor, and they can then vote, the Senator can wail, scream, refuse to vote etc. it does not matter, they just need his warm body there for the quorum.

If one more Republican had won (one Dem held his district by 400-odd votes) it would not have been an issue, as the Republicans would have been sufficient in number to quorum all on their own.

[Waitone]

Evidently the Wisconsin constitution can deal with the problem fairly easily.

Article 13, section 10 says

Vacancies in office. SECTION 10.  [As amended April 1979]
(1) The legislature may declare the cases in which any office shall be deemed vacant, and also the manner of filling the
vacancy, where no provision is made for that purpose in this constitution.

You can drive a truck through the provision but it does demonstrate the legislature is a hostage only because it wants to be a hostage.  I would expect just discussing a bill to declare a handful of seats vacant would result in renewed enthusiasm for fulfilling civic duties.

[AZRedhawk44]

Evidently the Wisconsin constitution can deal with the problem fairly easily.

Article 13, section 10 says
You can drive a truck through the provision but it does demonstrate the legislature is a hostage only because it wants to be a hostage.  I would expect just discussing a bill to declare a handful of seats vacant would result in renewed enthusiasm for fulfilling civic duties.

Lol... hold an election in the STRONGEST D-district in WI.  Unseat the biggest pain in the @$$ currently in the Senate.

Let a new D-candidate campaign and even win.  Don't run an R.

Then swear him in and have the Senate Master-at-Arms grab him by the scruff of the neck.

[Waitone]

http://www.channel3000.com/politics/25619322/detail.html
According to the article republicans are in the majority 59 to 38 in the lower house and in the majority 19 to 14 seats in the senate.  Oh, and the governor is a republican.

[Scout26]

Evidently the Wisconsin constitution can deal with the problem fairly easily.

Article 13, section 10 says
You can drive a truck through the provision but it does demonstrate the legislature is a hostage only because it wants to be a hostage.  I would expect just discussing a bill to declare a handful of seats vacant would result in renewed enthusiasm for fulfilling civic duties.

Have the governor declare the seats vacant and appoint (R) replacements.  Problem solved.   And really watch them HOWL !!!

[HankB]

Have the governor declare the seats vacant and appoint (R) replacements.  Problem solved.   And really watch them HOWL !!!

And tell them if they have to fight it, they have to appear in person before a Wisconsin court.

[seeker_two]

Evidently the Wisconsin constitution can deal with the problem fairly easily.

Article 13, section 10 says

Vacancies in office. SECTION 10.  [As amended April 1979]
(1) The legislature may declare the cases in which any office shall be deemed vacant, and also the manner of filling the
vacancy, where no provision is made for that purpose in this constitution.

Have the governor declare the seats vacant and appoint (R) replacements.  Problem solved.   And really watch them HOWL !!!

Problem solved....wish Gov. Perry had done this back when the Texas Legislature pulled this junk....

[Jamie B]

it's contempt of the State Senate

I guess that I am hosed, as I have held the US senate and house in contempt for years.

[Waitone]

But wait, there's more.  Evidently monetary legislation requires a quorum of 3/5's of the legislators.  So what is the rule for all other legislation in the great state of Wisconsin?  Seems a quorum can be a simple majority, which republicans have in both houses. 

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/wisconst.pdf
Article IV, section 7 says:

Organization of legislature; quorum; compulsory attendance. SECTION 7.  Each house shall be the judge of the elections, returns and qualifications of its own members; and a majority of each shall constitute a quorum to do business, but a smaller number may adjourn from day to day, and may compel the attendance of absent members in such manner and under such penalties as each house may provide.

Here are few other interesting details:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/02/two_solutions_to_the_wisconsin.html

So back to my original question.  Where is the problem?  Why all the political theatrics?  I am about to conclude the phenomenon of a "spinelessrepublican" is less of a moral or intellectual problem and more of a matter of DNA.

[grampster]

But American politics is more about Gotcha! and rubbing the other guys nose in it, than actual governance.

[kgbsquirrel]

So Waitone, the R's in WI have the opportunity right now to pass any piece of legislation they have ever dreamed of while completely unfettered by any interference from the D's who have fled the state, and they're not using this time to actually do anything because .... why?  I'm starting to think the labeling as The Stupid Party is very appropriate.

[Strings]

My take is that the Republicans always want to "play fair", with politics being looked at as a "gentleman's game".

They never seem to connect the dots that playing a gentleman's game with a chimpanzee (which is pretty much what the Democrats act like) results in nothing but being covered in flung poo...

[Scout26]

Perxactly !!  If the Democrats can "Deem and Pass" Healthcare, then the R's in Wisconsin ought to use this time to shove every piece of legislation; that doesn't require any of the "Illinois 14"; down their throats. Sideways.  With a red hot poker.  

Opportunities like this are rare, do not let them pass....

[AZRedhawk44]

-Constitutional Carry.
-Montana-style "Eff Ewe" to the ATF and MG registry.
-Repeal all reverse discrimination laws, especially pertaining to University requirements for the student body.
-Implement standardized tests for the K-12 student body (and without mentioning pay so as to dodge the quorum issue) make it mandatory for poor-performing teachers to be fired.
-Declare Obamacare Unconstitutional under the WI Constitution.


That's just off the cuff.  I'm sure there's other pet legislation that would drive D's absofrigginlutelynuckingfuts.

[AJ Dual]

The WI GOP is well aware of the opportunity to slam through all the non-budget bills they can think of.

It's not some deluded sense of fairness, it's pragmatism. They have plenty of time left in the session to pass all these other desired bills, CCW, voter-ID etc. They are just looking to mitigate the whining and all the legal challenges that would happen if they did them without the Democrats present.

If we were at the end of a session, rather than the beginning, it would be different. The GOP can afford to wait, and the advantages of looking like adults outweighs the downsides of not having a legislative blitzkrieg... for now.

[Strings]

Does it REALLY make them "look like adults", or does it make them look like they have no flexibility?

Not trying to be argumentative here. Just seems that, if you can't take care of one of your assigned tasks at work, you move on to those you CAN do...

[AJ Dual]

Does it REALLY make them "look like adults", or does it make them look like they have no flexibility?

Not trying to be argumentative here. Just seems that, if you can't take care of one of your assigned tasks at work, you move on to those you CAN do...

It's really just pragmatic cost-benefit calculations.

They're balancing having that interim legislation tied up for YEARS in all the "Illegal LAW! We weren't here! WAH!(despite that being our own fault)"-lawsuits the Dem's and Liberals will file, or just waiting them out a few more days/weeks.

The Democrats are probably really stalling so as many school districts and .gov unions can finalize one last cushy contract before the law goes into place. Then they'll probably do it again (or something worse) when the REAL fight over the state budget starts, as Walker and the GOP plan to cut municipal aid severely, and impose a property tax freeze so they can't make up the shortfall on the backs of the public.

[Balog]

That assumes the R's in power actually want those things, instead of just making pretty talk about it to get elected. 

[AJ Dual]

That assumes the R's in power actually want those things, instead of just making pretty talk about it to get elected. 

Shall-issue CCW has actually had/has LOTS of bi-partisan support in WI. Despite being libtarded on tax and fiscal/labor issues, a fair number of the more rural/small-city Democrats are solidly pro-gun, either because they are, or at least consistent because they have to be.

It's passed with initial super-majorities in both houses two times before. Granted, support wasn't SO strong former Gov. Doyle couldn't buy off one or two votes at the actual veto override (first time was an actual Dem bill sponsor...), and who knows how many were "fair weather" votes, knowing the fix was in and someone would take one for the team.

However, there is still well more than 51% support for CCW in the Legislature. And the RKBA issue is a strong wedge one, even with blue-collar/labor vote, so I don't see the pro-RKBA/pro-CCW Democrats defecting over the issue just out of spite over the budget/union bills.

The other big one is Voter photo-ID, doing away with mail-in registration, and same-day registrations to combat vote fraud. Because the vote fraud is concentrated in the urban areas, and double-voting college students, there's no reason not to support it even if you're a RINO, because even RINO's don't get elected in those districts. So nothing for them to lose on that one.

[bedlamite]

Just got a contact number for the AWOL 14: 414-301-2612

[Monkeyleg]

I get a "no longer in service" message for that number, Bedlamite.

[Scout26]

Walker and the WI R's needs to give "The Fleeing 14" two drop dead dates. 

After #1) We're passing every onerous, hated and shove it up your tuchus sideways piece of legislation we can think of and some we haven't thought of, but we're asking Rush Limbaugh, Ron Paul, Michelle Bachmann and Sarah Palin for ideas and to help draft 'em.

After #2) We're asking a judge to declare your seats vacant and that the Governor will be empowered to appoint replacements. 

Suck it B*tches.