Why white working-class single moms should stay single

[Scout26]

[pleo]

Wake up. The money is in running your own biz, without the risks and bs of a storefront.  Think "flophouse" rental, but it has to be bought right, run right, and be in the right part of town.  but if you know a vet who is single, no kids, and is sober/clean, you've got the basics, right there

[Perd Hapley]

I think the poem reproduced here expresses our current malaise, and its principal cause.

[lee n. field]

Wake up. The money is in running your own biz, without the risks and bs of a storefront.  Think "flophouse" rental, but it has to be bought right, run right, and be in the right part of town.  but if you know a vet who is single, no kids, and is sober/clean, you've got the basics, right there

I could park my wheelbarrow in the back yard, next to the doglet's house.  Life is good.

[Boomhauer]

Wake up. The money is in running your own biz, without the risks and bs of a storefront.  Think "flophouse" rental, but it has to be bought right, run right, and be in the right part of town.  but if you know a vet who is single, no kids, and is sober/clean, you've got the basics, right there

Does the name John Melvin Davis mean anything to you Pleo?

[Jamisjockey]

Wake up. The money is in running your own biz, without the risks and bs of a storefront.  Think "flophouse" rental, but it has to be bought right, run right, and be in the right part of town.  but if you know a vet who is single, no kids, and is sober/clean, you've got the basics, right there

Gun kid is that you?

[birdman]

Had a pagan men's weekend last year, where the question "What defines a man in our society?" was a common theme

And honestly, there was no good answer.

What defines it now? Or what it should be?

I had this discussion with a close friend last night and my answers was "not an insect"
"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

[Strings]

Thank you, Mr Heinlein

Actually, the discussion kinda breaks down at "what is a man's role?". We used to have a defined purpose: to hunt, impregnate the females, and sacrifice our lives to protect the tribe. Isn't so clear-cut anymore...

[SADShooter]

Thank you, Mr Heinlein

Actually, the discussion kinda breaks down at "what is a man's role?". We used to have a defined purpose: to hunt, impregnate the females, and sacrifice our lives to protect the tribe. Isn't so clear-cut anymore...

The expression "social norms" is out of favor in an environment where "normative" behavior is the devil, but we are seeing the chaos that arises in the absence of broadly understood and accepted gender/social roles. I'm not going all Archie Bunker for the good old days, but change is disruptive and sometimes painful. We're starting to see the bill for the social justice and diversity and "tolerance" (so named) roll out of the register. Sticker shock'll be a bitch, I'm thinking.

[fifth_column]

Oh gods yes, apparently. Or at least in the wild. I'm not exactly handsome, sophisticated or romantic. But I'm not hideous, have employment, have a home, have a car, no drug habit and "domestic violence" isn't a hobby of mine. Back when I was dating, there were numerous women essentially putting in a resume for marriage. It was actually kinda creepy. While finding a person they loved was nice, it almost seemed like there was no need for positive aspects, only a lack of negative ones.

This was my experience as well.  The focus is so much on finding a guy that doesn't have the same faults as the last guy, that she doesn't even notice the qualities of the guy in front of her.

This as well. US is still manufacturing a lot of stuff. We manufacture approximately $2T worth of goods, which China only surpassed in 2009 and are now at $2.5T officially. We're just doing it with a lot less people. Automation is allowing us to make more stuff, cheaply. Which is great for the consumer, and stockholder. Problem is... The displaced labor isn't going anywhere productive.

A strong, commercial, space industry would provide an outlet for all that misdirected male energy.

[Pb]

I think the decay of sexual morality has been a contributor to this...

When women give romantic affection to rotten males, rather than responsible men, it reduces the rewards for being a responsible man... leading to more caddish behavior.

Unfortunately, a lot of women are sexual attracted to immature louts... and we have welfare to pay for the offspring.

Marriage rates between the upper and lower classes in the USA used to be quite similar... not any more.

[makattak]

I think the decay of sexual morality has been a contributor to this...

When women give romantic affection to rotten males, rather than responsible men, it reduces the rewards for being a responsible man... leading to more caddish behavior.

Unfortunately, a lot of women are sexual attracted to immature louts... and we have welfare to pay for the offspring.

Marriage rates between the upper and lower classes in the USA used to be quite similar... not any more.

Related, there is a reason parental consent was required for courting and marrying daughters: young people (men and women) are terrible judges of character.

Having to impress an older family member before they would allow you to court his or her daughter additionally helped encourage men to mature faster. Want a wife? (And, of course, sex.) Act like a man.

This is yet another of the traditions we have rejected because "it's oppressive!" "It's degrading to women!" etc... All because one generation (and succeeding ones) decided that everything that came before it was about oppression and didn't dig any deeper into the reasoning for the traditions. (I also fault the parents of that generation for failing to teach the reasoning.)

Yes, it's insulting, as a teenager, to be told that you are inexperienced and your opinions are ignorant and uninformed. It's also true for the VAST MAJORITY of teenagers. (I'm talking 95% majority.)

Was that tradition perfect and only resulted in happy marriages? Of course not. Humans are not perfect. I will opine that it is a great deal better than the current "tradition".

[roo_ster]

Related, there is a reason parental consent was required for courting and marrying daughters: young people (men and women) are terrible judges of character.

Having to impress an older family member before they would allow you to court his or her daughter additionally helped encourage men to mature faster. Want a wife? (And, of course, sex.) Act like a man.

This is yet another of the traditions we have rejected because "it's oppressive!" "It's degrading to women!" etc... All because one generation (and succeeding ones) decided that everything that came before it was about oppression and didn't dig any deeper into the reasoning for the traditions. (I also fault the parents of that generation for failing to teach the reasoning.)

Yes, it's insulting, as a teenager, to be told that you are inexperienced and your opinions are ignorant and uninformed. It's also true for the VAST MAJORITY of teenagers. (I'm talking 95% majority.)

Was that tradition perfect and only resulted in happy marriages? Of course not. Humans are not perfect. I will opine that it is a great deal better than the current "tradition".

This, plus eleventy.

My sister is and was exceptionally bright.  But intelligence is neither wisdom nor judgement.  Her taste in BFs during high school was just a cadvalcade of losers.  She eventually wised up.

[SADShooter]

This, plus eleventy.

My sister is and was exceptionally bright.  But intelligence is neither wisdom nor judgement.  Her taste in BFs during high school was just a cadvalcade[/b] of losers.  She eventually wised up.

Nicely done, sir.

[brimic]

So essentially the take-away here from the article is that: "ZOMG! White women in the bottom half of the economic ladder are now starting to have the same poor odds of finding/keeping a suitable male partner that black women have had starting with LBJ's 'Great Society' in 1964."

Did I get that right?

That's exactly what I got out of it.

[lee n. field]

Had a pagan men's weekend last year, where the question "What defines a man in our society?" was a common theme

And honestly, there was no good answer.

The sanest answer I've seen, from a non-pagan perspective: the Masculine Mandate.  An hour's audio, content begins 7 or 8 minutes in.

[grampster]

Cause and Effect:  The extremist end of the Women's Liberation Movement and the resulting collapse of a culture, the Pussification of boy children, the resulting assault on accepting a certain amount of hard physical contact games and how to respond to bullies, the treating men as dolts in TV ads and shows and the Government as a daddy/husband.