Author Topic: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there  (Read 11234 times)

Tallpine

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #25 on: August 21, 2013, 04:08:56 PM »
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The reason that train from San Francisco never meets the train from Chicago is more likely because of a failing rail infrastructure than because we still do not care whether they ever meet or not.

The trains will meet in the midde of the tunnel in Colorado  ;)
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

MrsSmith

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2013, 04:28:43 PM »
I had a college class called "applied math" or something like that which meant that it was all word problems   >:D

We were graded more on coming up with the right equation than on solving it.

Besides, doesn't everyone know that 3 * 4 = C   ???   :P

And then the devil said, "Let's put the alphabet in math!"
America is at that awkward stage; It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards. ~ Claire Wolfe

Tallpine

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2013, 05:09:34 PM »
And then the devil said, "Let's put the alphabet in math!"

11 * 100 = 1100   =D
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

AZRedhawk44

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2013, 05:26:06 PM »
11 * 100 = 1100   =D

Neat how it does that in binary, octal, decimal and hex systems. 
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #29 on: August 21, 2013, 06:38:53 PM »
Neat how it does that in binary, octal, decimal and hex systems. 


Yes, but how?  :P
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Tallpine

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #30 on: August 21, 2013, 07:51:51 PM »

Yes, but how?  :P

10 * 10 = 100  =)

also, 10 + 10 = 100  :facepalm:
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

vaskidmark

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #31 on: August 21, 2013, 10:50:14 PM »

Yes, but how?  :P

Spend yur days trying to figger that out, or get the bridge bilt.  Watt's the prioarety?

stay safe.
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

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They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #32 on: August 21, 2013, 11:19:23 PM »
Spend yur days trying to figger that out, or get the bridge bilt.  Watt's the prioarety?

stay safe.

Not spelling, apparently.
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Levant

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #33 on: August 21, 2013, 11:46:42 PM »
Common Core was actually a pretty good idea. I worked for a place that made math books. There's no real national standard when it comes to math education, so this would have been helpful for folks that write math books. Incidentally, our books were meant towards home school market.

Home school parents are...  interesting folks. There was a drastic hostility towards Common Core. More than a small number literally (I mean  "in the literal sense", not meaning "figuratively") believe that Common Core is demonic, unchristian, a form of slavery, etc. More than a few made it sound like they believed Common Core was written by Satan himself to lure good Christian children away from the Lord. I'm not kidding. It was kinda awkward.

But now it's become heavily politicized and ayep, Education derps like that lady are now involved. So, it'll either be binned or implemented horribly between sabotage from the Right and fruitcakes from the Left.

I don't home school but I think all of that.  Nothing in the Constitution allows the Federal government to be involved in education.  They control the states by offering money if the states adopt common core - money that they stole from the states in the first place.  At worst, education is a state issue.  At best, government stays out of it completely and it is a private issue.  In between is a school district with only the power to do what the parents in the district say and only with the budget the parents are willing to cough up.  All fee hikes would require a majority vote of all parents and then those parents who disagree could associate themselves with a district more to their liking.
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æg151337

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #34 on: August 22, 2013, 01:55:08 AM »
Common Core was actually a pretty good idea. I worked for a place that made math books. There's no real national standard when it comes to math education, so this would have been helpful for folks that write math books. Incidentally, our books were meant towards home school market.

Home school parents are...  interesting folks. There was a drastic hostility towards Common Core. More than a small number literally (I mean  "in the literal sense", not meaning "figuratively") believe that Common Core is demonic, unchristian, a form of slavery, etc. More than a few made it sound like they believed Common Core was written by Satan himself to lure good Christian children away from the Lord. I'm not kidding. It was kinda awkward.

But now it's become heavily politicized and ayep, Education derps like that lady are now involved. So, it'll either be binned or implemented horribly between sabotage from the Right and fruitcakes from the Left.

Could a common core have degrading effects on schools that already have a good well rounded cirriculum by forcing them to "dumb it down" to a more average ciriculum? I just don't know how they intend to go about it.
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Scout26

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #35 on: August 22, 2013, 01:52:52 PM »
One more reason why the fed.gov Dept of Education needs to be not reduced, but eliminated, along with several others.
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
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Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
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230RN

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2013, 12:19:38 PM »
I understand that one of the advantages of the one-room schoolhouse, where all levels and ages of students were intermixed, was that the older kids would teach the younger kids what they learned.

And there's no better way to thoroughly learn a subject than to have to teach it.
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MrsSmith

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #37 on: August 23, 2013, 08:50:27 PM »
I agree completely 230RN. I learned more teaching others than I did in class as a student with every single subject I've taught, from software to shooting to writing.
America is at that awkward stage; It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards. ~ Claire Wolfe

Hawkmoon

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2013, 04:23:02 PM »
Common Core was actually a pretty good idea. I worked for a place that made math books. There's no real national standard when it comes to math education, so this would have been helpful for folks that write math books. Incidentally, our books were meant towards home school market.

Home school parents are...  interesting folks. There was a drastic hostility towards Common Core. More than a small number literally (I mean  "in the literal sense", not meaning "figuratively") believe that Common Core is demonic, unchristian, a form of slavery, etc. More than a few made it sound like they believed Common Core was written by Satan himself to lure good Christian children away from the Lord. I'm not kidding. It was kinda awkward.

In my adopted daughter's one semester in public high school here in the U.S., math (Geometry, IIRC) was one of the classes she had the most trouble in. This despite the fact that she had always gotten very good grades in math in her native country, and that her previous math classes had already covered most of the material. Here, however, it just didn't make sense to her.

So the school decided she was a dumb kid, and moved her into a much lower "track" (all the while denying that they have any such thing as tracks). We protested, on several grounds, with the result being a big conference with both parents, the head of the math department, the school psychologist, and the principal. And, since my wife's native language (as well as our daughter's) is Spanish and my wife isn't fluent in English, they also brought in a Spanish teacher to act as translator.

Things went pretty steadily and rapidly from bad to worse as the head of the math department proceeded to defend (rather vehemently) his opinion that the poor kid was just too dumb to do math. (Tested for IQ in Spanish, she's at or near genius level.) Finally, the translator gal apparently had heard enough, and felt she had to step out of the translator role.

"You know, Jack," she said, "I taught math in my country before I came here. Aren't you aware that we teach math differently in South America than you do here? It doesn't surprise me at all that what you're teaching her doesn't make sense to her ... she came here from a completely different system of learning math."

And Mr. Math Department thereupon shut his pie hole like it had been zip tied and super glued.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #39 on: August 24, 2013, 04:32:16 PM »
Soooo, how do they math in South America?
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Tallpine

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #40 on: August 24, 2013, 07:48:20 PM »
Soooo, how do they math in South America?

Uno, dos, tres, etc  ....    ;)
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #41 on: August 24, 2013, 10:46:21 PM »
Uno, dos, tres, etc  ....    ;)

Except in Brazil where it's Um, dois, três...
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Tallpine

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #42 on: August 25, 2013, 10:47:35 AM »
Except in Brazil where it's Um, dois, três...

Lots of ex-pat Scots down there too, so it's Aon, Dha, Tri, ....
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

TechMan

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #43 on: August 25, 2013, 06:07:32 PM »
One more reason why the fed.gov Dept of Education needs to be not reduced, but eliminated, along with several others.

SWMBO read an article on the Common Core.  The fed.gov DOE didn't come up with Common Core, you can thank the National Governor's Association Center for Best Practices and the Council of Chief State School Officers, though the fed.gov DOE is using the stick and carrot method for its adoption.  The Bill and Melinda Gates foundation was main funder for the Common Core development.  48 states and DC were members of the CC initiative.  Texas and Alaska were not members of the initiative. Nebraska and Virginia are members but have chosen not to implement the standards.  Minnesota has only adopted the English language arts standards, but not the math standards.  Indiana is the first state the retreat from the standards and South Carolina is also retreating.

The article also stated some items of concern.

1. As part of the Common Core process, the states will create mass tracking systems via databases of very personal student and family information, which it can share with other federal and state agencies.  Overseen by the nonprofit, inBloom Inc., name, address, race, economic status, test scores, attendance, learning disabilities and hobbies are just some of the student data points stored on the system.  InBloom is largely funded by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.

2. Kids with disabilities and handicaps will be taught using the same standards.  Special Education teachers are told they need to use the standards that match the age and grade level of the child but NOT their functioning level.  Not all students are created equal, they have different learning styles - the Common Core standards do not take that into account.


You know you have an issue when the following happens:
In a May 2013 letter from 21 New York State principals to the New York Education Commissioner voicing concerns about the CC assessments that the state underwent last spring: "As it stands, we are concerned about the limiting and unbalanced structure of the test, the timing, format and length of the daily test sessions"..."many students spent much of their time reading, rereading and interpreting difficult and confusing questions about authors' choices around structure and craft in informational texts, a Common Core skill that is valuable, but far from worthy of the time and effort given by the test."..."When groups of parents, teachers and principals recently shared students' experiences in their schools, especially during the ELA exams with misjudged timing expectations, we learned that frustration, despondency and even crying were common reactions among students.  The extremes were unprecedented: vomiting, nosebleeds, suicidal ideation and even hospitalization."


http://issuu.com/daycom/docs/cf0813?e=1606645/4265869
Pages 6, 19 and 20
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 06:11:42 PM by adively »
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brimic

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #44 on: August 25, 2013, 08:23:44 PM »




"now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb" -Dark Helmet

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Barack Obama

Scout26

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #45 on: August 25, 2013, 08:41:45 PM »
Lots of ex-pat Scots down there too, so it's Aon, Dha, Tri, ....

Lots more former Germans....Eins, Zwei, Drei, Vier, ...   ;)
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
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Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
for the motherland.

Hawkmoon

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #46 on: August 25, 2013, 11:10:50 PM »
I understand that one of the advantages of the one-room schoolhouse, where all levels and ages of students were intermixed, was that the older kids would teach the younger kids what they learned.

And there's no better way to thoroughly learn a subject than to have to teach it.

Somewhere on the Internutz a few months ago I stumbled across a test that was from, IIRC, an eighth grade final exam dating to the late 19th century. To be honest, I didn't do all that well on it, and I doubt very much that most high school graduates or even college sophomores today would know many of the answers. And this was stuff that KIDS were expected to know and understand a bit over 100 years ago.

Found it: http://thinklab.typepad.com/think_lab/2006/03/8th_grade_exami.html

Interestingly, Snopes doesn't like it ... but they don't debunk it as false or incorrect, only "inapplicable to modern life."
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Northwoods

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #47 on: August 26, 2013, 12:34:19 AM »
On the math portion the reason it's not very applicable is the few people know, or have reason to know, about bushels, rods, and other units of measurement in that test.  If you know how much a bushel of wheat weighs it's trivial to answer the value of how much so many lbs of wheat is worth at 50cents per bushel.  Also the methods for computing interest on loans has changed.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #48 on: August 26, 2013, 01:24:29 AM »
Also the methods for computing interest on loans has changed.

So?

Kids today don't even understand what "interest" is. And not just kids today -- even people not too much younger than I am. I distinctly recall one evening when my parents were still alive, I was invited to dinner at their house along with my younger sister and her (now late) husband. Hubby was either a tech school graduate or (I believe) a tech school dropout. He was one of those people who never met a boss he could get along with for more than a month.

The topic of discussion came around (as it always did, since it was the only topic on which the BIL could or would converse) to cars. Specifically, his cars. He had a year-old Chevy that he was tired of, and he couldn't figure out why the amount he still owed was more than what the dealer was willing to give him on trade-in.

Then he couldn't understand why, if the car "happened" to get stolen and torched, he should still have to make payments on it. "Why should I? If it's been burned I don't have it any more. Why should I pay for something I don't have?"
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vaskidmark

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Re: Circling the drain - it's getting crowded around there
« Reply #49 on: August 26, 2013, 02:09:45 PM »
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

Hey you kids!! Get off my lawn!!!

They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.