Author Topic: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?  (Read 1849 times)

Ben

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BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« on: June 10, 2010, 09:59:05 AM »
This will be interesting in the courts.

I absolutely believe BP should pay all direct costs for response and mitigation for this spill, including post cleanup monitoring and restoration. And I think they are ready and expect to do so. I think they're also prepared to be hit with a lot of non-direct costs. I'm already shaking my head about some of the little cafe owners looking for BP to basically buy them out because of lost customers, when most likely many of them are getting increased business from the influx of 10,000 plus responders to the spill.

At some point though, I agree with their statement that a line has to be drawn. Paying for Federal policy implementation would be a good line. I haven't stayed at a Holiday Inn recently, but I simply don't see how this has legal legs to stand on. It would be like the .gov, after Toyota's recent problems, shutting down the entire auto industry while they re-evaluate safety, then holding Toyota responsible for paying all the displaced auto workers.


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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/06/10/bp-headed-showdown-spill-cleanup-costs/

U.S., BP Headed for Showdown Over Liability

The Obama Administration ratcheted up its demands on Wednesday that BP PLC cover all costs stemming from the Gulf of Mexico oil spill, including millions of dollars in salaries of oil-industry workers laid off because of the federal moratorium on deepwater drilling.
fox news

The Obama Administration ratcheted up its demands on Wednesday that BP PLC cover all costs stemming from the Gulf of Mexico oil spill, including millions of dollars in salaries of oil-industry workers laid off because of the federal moratorium on deepwater drilling.

The sudden increase in BP's potential liabilities—along with growing evidence that even more oil than expected is gushing from BP's crippled well—helped send BP's shares plummeting almost 16% in New York, to $29.20. The stock has lost close to half its value, more than $82 billion, in the seven weeks since the spill started.

"There is no objective justification for this share price movement. BP faces this situation as a strong company," said BP chief executive Tony Hayward in an interview at the company's Houston crisis center. "We have significant capacity and flexibility in dealing with the cost of responding to the incident, the environmental remediation and the payment of legitimate claims."

BP didn't comment directly on the latest demand from Washington. But it is expected to argue that under the Oil Pollution Act of 1990, BP is liable only for the direct costs of the clean-up and couldn't be held responsible for the lost wages of oil workers. "Somewhere a line has to be drawn," a company official said.

Several legal experts said they couldn't think of any law or precedent that would allow the U.S. to try to recover damages from BP on behalf of rig workers thrown out of work by a government moratorium on deep offshore drilling.

"I'm not aware of anything out there that would allow (President Obama) to latch onto a legal remedy on behalf of the out-of-work workers," said Benjamin A. Escobar Jr., a Houston-based labor and employment attorney for Beirne Maynard & Parsons. "I think he's in for a real court fight on these issues."

The White House has a different view. "The moratorium is a result of the accident that BP caused. It is an economic loss for those workers," Press Secretary Robert Gibbs said. "Those are claims that BP should pay."

The meltdown in BP's stock suggested investors are bracing for a worst-case scenario. BP says it has spent well over $1 billion on the spill response. The total clean-up and legal costs to BP could reach some $33 billion, though these might not fully materialize for a decade, say Goldman Sachs analysts.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

Monkeyleg

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2010, 11:22:35 AM »
Hmm. How many machinists lost jobs after the FOPA of '86 banned further manufacture of full-auto's? How many office personnel lost jobs when imports of black rifles were banned?

If someone somewhere is liable for job losses caused by government actions, there could be a whole new industry for attorneys.

makattak

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2010, 11:33:41 AM »
Democrats: "Hmmm... we're over-reacting and putting people out of jobs... who can we scapegoat for this!???

Whew, that's right, page one of our playbook, blame the free market! Big business!"

I mean, seriously? Government over-reacts and goes BEYOND what their own "panel of experts" suggests and now want to blame the company rather than admit they over-reacted.

When did we become Venezuela?

Nevermind: Jan 20, 2009.

Edit: FOREIGN big business. Yeah, we're Venezuela.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2010, 12:25:38 PM by makattak »
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

longeyes

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2010, 11:43:32 AM »
Quote
If someone somewhere is liable for job losses caused by government actions, there could be a whole new industry for attorneys.

I believe you have opened the door to the secret garden...
"Domari nolo."

Thug: What you lookin' at old man?
Walt Kowalski: Ever notice how you come across somebody once in a while you shouldn't have messed with? That's me.

Molon Labe.

Scout26

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2010, 02:43:35 PM »
The problem is that BP stood and said "Yep, our bad.  We'll pay to fix it."  This more then anything else enraged the lefties.  It's hard to beat upon and make a scapegoat out of someone who already had admitted fault and taken the blame.

Cover Clean-up costs, Yep.  BP has said they will.

Cover the costs of the Fed.Gov's overreation.  Hell No.


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for the motherland.

Ned Hamford

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2010, 02:58:19 PM »
I am pretty sure that we signed up for some international treaties capping the liability of companies for their oil spills.

I think we are just seeing politics and posturing.

BP is one of the biggest companies in the world with all the clout you'd expect for the role. 

End of the day, BP is going to do whatever it wants as our own politicians aren't going to stand up to them. 

All the lawsuits and threats, barred/capped by the treaty.  But the noise making does make people feel better. 

Politicians are free to make as much noise as they want, knowing their actions are impotent, having tied their own hands years ago.
Improbus a nullo flectitur obsequio.

Boomhauer

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2010, 04:58:26 PM »
Obama and Co. are looking to make an example out of an EEEEEVVVVVVVVIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLL OIL COMPANY. And Obama and Co. know that they can do just about anything they want to BP, since by and large the American public has an irrational hatred of Big Oil Companies.

Quote from: Ben
Holy hell. It's like giving a loaded gun to a chimpanzee...

Quote from: bluestarlizzard
the last thing you need is rabies. You're already angry enough as it is.

OTOH, there wouldn't be a tweeker left in Georgia...

Quote from: Balog
BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE! AND THROW SOME STEAK ON THE GRILL!

Ryan in Maine

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2010, 05:38:42 PM »
What are their total costs looking like right now?

So far:
- $1 billion on clean up
- $33 billion within a decade on clean up/follow up
- $82 billion in stocks in under two months
- $X for their attempts of stopping the leak
- $X for legitimate claims from local workers

And now:
- $X for unemployed oil workers facing Obama's moratorium

How much would expect to see paid in legitimate claims? And how much would you expect to see paid in claims if oil workers actually fell under a legitimate claim? Probably not happening, but just for the heck of it...

Aaannd how much did the procedures taken to stop the leak cost?

This is crazy. The thanks you get from the federal govt for standing up and taking responsibility for yourself. Sheesh.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2010, 05:54:09 PM by Ryan in Maine »

Sergeant Bob

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2010, 05:46:15 PM »
Yeah, maybe the government threats have no teeth right now but, they are setting the stage for what they would "like" to do. They figure if they can get enough purple shirts out there raising hell, they can slowly and incrementally change the nature of this country. It's all about who controls the message.
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
I meet lots of folks like this, claim to be anarchist but really they're just liberals with pierced genitals. - gunsmith

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longeyes

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2010, 11:45:39 PM »
What I don't see is corporate executives standing up to The Ogre.  What I see is big business--and the bigger the operation the more "governmental" its operations--throwing money at The Ogre, angling to take advantage of The Ogre's rages, and endeavoring to get on the Ogre's "good side."

BP gave money to Obama--why?--and lobbied, I'm hearing, for cap & trade, etc. 
"Domari nolo."

Thug: What you lookin' at old man?
Walt Kowalski: Ever notice how you come across somebody once in a while you shouldn't have messed with? That's me.

Molon Labe.

KD5NRH

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2010, 02:50:46 AM »
BP is one of the biggest companies in the world with all the clout you'd expect for the role.

Which is a very good thing in this case; had a smaller company done this, they simply wouldn't have the money to keep going on the shutdown efforts, cleanup, claims, etc.  The taxpayers would be on the hook for everything after about day two or three.

Insurance might have covered another day or two, but requiring insurance levels that would cover something like this would be like a state requiring that your auto liability insurance minimum be enough to cover you rear-ending a fuel tanker outside a school, incinerating a few busloads of kids, forcing evacuation and relocation of all the people within several blocks.


makattak

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2010, 08:48:37 AM »
What I don't see is corporate executives standing up to The Ogre.  What I see is big business--and the bigger the operation the more "governmental" its operations--throwing money at The Ogre, angling to take advantage of The Ogre's rages, and endeavoring to get on the Ogre's "good side."

BP gave money to Obama--why?--and lobbied, I'm hearing, for cap & trade, etc. 

Big government is good for big business.

It's the smaller competitors that will die when they realize they have to compete in the market AND in the political arena.

Quote from: Adam Smith link=http://www.adamsmith.org/adam-smith-quotes/ date=1776
The interest of the dealers, however, in any particular branch of trade or manufactures, is always in some respects different from, and even opposite to, that of the public. To widen the market, and to narrow the competition, is always the interest of the dealers. To widen the market may frequently be agreeable enough to the interest of the public; but to narrow the competition must always be against it, and can only serve to enable the dealers, by raising their profits above what they naturally would be, to levy, for their own benefit, an absurd tax upon the rest of their fellow-citizens. The proposal of any new law or regulation of commerce which comes from this order, ought always to be listened to with great precaution, and ought never to be adopted till after having been long and carefully examined, not only with the most scrupulous, but with the most suspicious attention. It comes from an order of men, whose interest is never exactly the same with that of the public, who have generally an interest to deceive and even to oppress the public, and who accordingly have, upon many occasions, both deceived and oppressed it.

This is nothing new, as you can see above.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

longeyes

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Re: BP to Cover Expenses for Fed.Gov Policies?
« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2010, 12:54:05 PM »
Exactly my point, thanks.

While a number of big businesses are beneficial in that they produce real products, real goods, unlike government, we should not deceive ourselves that they love competition as much as the consumer.  When they can eliminate competition, they do.
"Domari nolo."

Thug: What you lookin' at old man?
Walt Kowalski: Ever notice how you come across somebody once in a while you shouldn't have messed with? That's me.

Molon Labe.