Tucson wants to split away from AZ

[Perd Hapley]

I should post the recent research my University produced on the topic of social attitudes in the Muslim world.

A brief abstract would be interesting to see. Pwease.

[longeyes]

The birth rates may have declined, but, as I said, the zealotry quotient has not.

I too would like to see how social attitudes have supposedly changed in the Ummah.

[grampster]

Here in Michigan, we could be 3 states.  The State of Detroit, the YooPee would be Superior and we'd call the rest of Michigan Trollville as we are under The Bridge.

[MicroBalrog]

The birth rates may have declined, but, as I said, the zealotry quotient has not.

Given that the Eurabia myth is predicated on these individuals outbreeding us, the fall of birth rates is very relevant.

[longeyes]

The "Eurabia myth" is not JUST about demographics.  It is about pigheaded fanaticism and the complicit willingness of Eurocrats to cower before Islamic demands, to permit promiscuous immigration levels to keep the welfare states going, to blithely oversee the cultural destruction of their own nations.  Islam can go nowhere without the active aiding and abetting of the West, both at the governmental and corporate levels.

[roo_ster]

Given that the Eurabia myth is predicated on these individuals outbreeding us, the fall of birth rates is very relevant.

Your idea of the eurabia myth is a myth itself.  I'd call it a straw man, but straw men are more substantial.

The "Eurabia myth" is not JUST about demographics.  It is about pigheaded fanaticism and the complicit willingness of Eurocrats to cower before Islamic demands, to permit promiscuous immigration levels to keep the welfare states going, to blithely oversee the cultural destruction of their own nations.  Islam can go nowhere with the active aiding and abetting of the West, both at the governmental and corporate levels.

Ayup.  A weak hand beats no hand in any card game.

1. Falling birth rates in the Muslim countries does not necessarily mean the absolute numbers or rate of immigration into Europe will change.  The reasons for that immigration still exist, as the Muslim countries are still third-world cess pools overflowing with poverty, desperation, violence, and oppression.

2. While birth rates of current Muslim emigrant countries may be falling, they are still higher than native euro TFRs, as are the TFRs of Muslims already in Europe.  Even if it takes only 3 or 4 generations for Muslim immigrants to lower their TFR to native euro levels, that is long enough to produce a whole buncha new bouncing baby Mohammeds.

3. With Wacky Kadaffy no longer taking bribes to keep sub-Saharan black muslims from traipsing across Libya and across the Med to euro-land, the euros can expect many more of them.  And THEIR TFRs are still very high.


Oh, and my data on my last post was from CIA Factbook 2009, while the data you sorta cited was 2011.  I doubt very much that if one takes statistical confidence of both sets of data into account WRT Muslim countries, that one could say with statistical confidence that either data set is "better" or more accurate.  Muslim countries are not known for punctilious records-keeping.

[MicroBalrog]

Oh, and my data on my last post was from CIA Factbook 2009, while the data you sorta cited was 2011.  I doubt very much that if one takes statistical confidence of both sets of data into account WRT Muslim countries, that one could say with statistical confidence that either data set is "better" or more accurate.  Muslim countries are not known for punctilious records-keeping.

I would argue that we should assume that a reputable source is accurate (at least to the point of providing a reasonable statistical picture) unless we at least have a competing source and can explain how the official source's research methods are wrong.

Even if it takes only 3 or 4 generations for Muslim immigrants to lower their TFR to native euro levels, that is long enough to produce a whole buncha new bouncing baby Mohammeds.

It has taken only 30 years for EuroTurks to get from a TFR of 7.0 to less than native Euro levels. That's about the length of one generation. And the native baby Mohammed will be exposed to the most powerful weapon in our possession: Hollywood. And porn.

Do not discount American consumerism as a  devastating cultural weapon.

With Wacky Kadaffy no longer taking bribes to keep sub-Saharan black muslims from traipsing across Libya and across the Med to euro-land, the euros can expect many more of them.  And THEIR TFRs are still very high.

It remains to be seen what policy Ze New Libya will adapt.

[longeyes]

And the native baby Mohammed will be exposed to the most powerful weapon in our possession: Hollywood. And porn.

Do not discount American consumerism as a  devastating cultural weapon.

Perhaps you underestimate the ability of fanatics to combine fanaticism with hypocrisy.  In other words, you watch the porn and go to the strip clubs BEFORE you blow people up.  Allah makes allowances for faithful martyrs, after all.

So long as Muslims embrace unnatural "purity," denying their own humanity, they will be in the thrall of violence.  Indeed, life in the West may well aggravate that inclination to violence by overwhelming them with lubricious temptation.

[MicroBalrog]

I have no doubt that the sort of fanatic that straps himself with explosives will not be influenced by whatever amount of foreign cultures he is exposed to.

[SteveT]

Not terribly relevant. The nations of Europe were not formed by leftists seceding from larger nations. Also, it's not just a question of policy, but of people.  Left-wing zealots are not the sort of people that know how to keep the trains running, so to speak.

I'm pretty sure both Microsoft and Apple are run by liberals.   Along with every other Silicon Valley IT company.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

So long as Muslims embrace unnatural "purity," denying their own humanity, they will be in the thrall of violence


lol   how do you feel about catholics

[longeyes]

I tread carefully among them, especially my former Jesuit preceptors.  :)  I'm not privy to how many times a day they scrub, body or soul.

Are you laughing at purity or those who embrace it?

[SteveT]

The local Seattle media periodically does stories on the issue of eastern Washington splitting off pretty much right along the Cascades.  What has seemed to dampen enthusiasm for this was a cost/revenue analysis showing that the greater population in western Washington subsidizes eastern Washington pretty good from the standpoint of government services and infrastructure.  As an example, on a proportionate basis, more of my gas taxes go to pay for road work in eastern Washington than here.  Some of the sales tax collected in Snohomish county goes to fund government programs in eastern Washington.  If eastern Washington split off, western Washington would actually save money.  It is kind of like how West Germany had to increase taxes and spending to bring East Germany up to par when they reunified. 

This has caused some of the Rugged Individualists in eastern Washington no little gnashing of teeth to realize that their roads, counties and rural way of life is in part subsidized by tree-hugging hipsters in Seattle driving Priuses and buying MacBooks.

I think I recall reading that the same sort of argument can be made about many of the rural Western states: that they incur more Federal dollars of benefit than they pay Federal taxes. 

This can be seen even on a county by county basic throughout the USA.  The higher the use of federal/state monies the greater that county votes GOP. 

I don't think (for instance) many Hollywood celebrities are on food stamps.