Venezuela, Again, Still

[Hawkmoon]

I was just about to post about GM. I was genuinely surprised that they still had a plant in Venezuela. I thought all the smart big US money pulled out after Chavez confiscated 100s of millions in oil production infrastructure.

Any other big US corporation still have a Venezuelan presence?

You're probably not alone. From the article:

Shares of General Motors Co. rose slightly in premarket trading.

It's rather instructive when your entire operation is stolen but your stock goes UP as a result ...

[AmbulanceDriver]

If they were smart, everything more networkable than a stapler could be rendered useless from anywhere in the world.

For some reason this kicked my gigglebox right off the cliff.  And yet....   Someone somewhere has networked a stapler.  You just know it's happened.

[RoadKingLarry]

How much of the automated equipment is dependent on code stored on GM servers outside Venezuela?

If they were smart, everything more networkable than a stapler could be rendered useless from anywhere in the world.

While I tend to agree with the philosophy, the big problem with that is that if they can do it from "corporate" a hacker can do it from bumfukistan.

[Hawkmoon]

While I tend to agree with the philosophy, the big problem with that is that if they can do it from "corporate" a hacker can do it from bumfukistan.

Which is why I like driving older vehicles that don't have On-Star and can't be remotely disabled by much less than a .357 magnum through the engine block from a hovering helicopter.

[HankB]

From what I've read, this GM plant hasn't actually produced a car since 2015. GM still has dealers or garages there that employ about 3900 people - since GM is "leaving" Venezuela, my guess is those people are (or soon will be) unemployed.

Kimberly-Clarke lost a plant to Venezuelan confiscation a while back - but it was out of production anyway since raw materials were unavailable. No word on what happened to it or the employees after the plant was seized.

Seems that small businesses haven't been immune either - read a week or two back that bakeries were being seized if they were making too many biscuits and croissants and not enough bread . . . in the eyes of the bureaucrats.

No word on whether or not they're making bread or continuing to employ the bakers now that the government "owns" them.

Ah, the glory of Socialism, which replaces Capitalism's income inequality with a more widespread distribution of misery . . .

[Regolith]

For some reason this kicked my gigglebox right off the cliff.  And yet....   Someone somewhere has networked a stapler.  You just know it's happened.

Don't some of the fancier photocopiers have automatic stapling functions? Those are probably networked...

[Scout26]

From what I've read, this GM plant hasn't actually produced a car since 2015. GM still has dealers or garages there that employ about 3900 people - since GM is "leaving" Venezuela, my guess is those people are (or soon will be) unemployed.

Kimberly-Clarke lost a plant to Venezuelan confiscation a while back - but it was out of production anyway since raw materials were unavailable. No word on what happened to it or the employees after the plant was seized.

Seems that small businesses haven't been immune either - read a week or two back that bakeries were being seized if they were making too many biscuits and croissants and not enough bread . . . in the eyes of the bureaucrats.

No word on whether or not they're making bread or continuing to employ the bakers now that the government "owns" them.

Ah, the glory of Socialism, which replaces Capitalism's income inequality with a more widespread distribution of misery . . .

I thought that Maduro confiscated all the bakeries because they weren't producing enough bread, or giving it all away for free, or charging too much or somesuch that displeased the powers that be in the name of the people.

Ahh... I stand corrected.  They haven't seized all the bakeries.....yet.
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/americas/venezuela/article138964428.html

[Angel Eyes]

Ahh... I stand corrected.  They haven't seized all the bakeries.....yet.
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/americas/venezuela/article138964428.html

The government said bakeries are only allowed to produce French bread and white loaves, or pan canilla, with government-imported flour.

What?  No gay wedding cakes?

[K Frame]

How much of the automated equipment is dependent on code stored on GM servers outside Venezuela?

If they were smart, everything more networkable than a stapler could be rendered useless from anywhere in the world.

Probably most, if not all of it.

And, I heard the other day that, while GM is protesting Maduro's action strongly, they realistically probably don't give a crap because the Venezuelan plan has been losing money for years, so the Venezuelans were basically seizing a worthless asset and losing what little income was actually being derived from it.

[K Frame]

Looks like GM has more compassion for their Venezuelan employees than Maduro has...

GM fired them, but paid them severance.

http://www.mlive.com/news/us-world/index.ssf/2017/04/gm_fires_2700_venezuela-based.html

[Scout26]

I wonder if it was enough to buy a loaf of bread.....

[K Frame]

I wonder if it was enough to buy a loaf of bread.....

Apparently not. They were being paid a pittance because the company wasn't able to produce anything because of, well, Socialism.

[TechMan]

Yea, Socialism.

GM hadn't made a car at the plant in Valencia, Venezuela since 2015, and automakers only made 2,849 cars in the country in 2016 altogether, a drastic drop from the 172,218 made in 2007.

[KD5NRH]

While I tend to agree with the philosophy, the big problem with that is that if they can do it from "corporate" a hacker can do it from bumfukistan.

Not necessarily; just need to make it so that it requires some sort of "we are happy" signal, and/or regular updates.  If done right, that could even be in the form of a mailed flash drive if the network is gone.  Make them one-shot 14 day codes, and you'll always have time to FedEx another reactivation in time if needed, while also being sure the seizing government has nothing but a pile of scrap within a month.

Maybe not a bad idea on any such equipment that's kept in or transported through places where there's a high risk of it being stolen, anyway; if no other potential buyer can use it, then the only possibly profitable option is selling it back to you, which is high risk compared to finding an unreputable buyer.

[RevDisk]

While I tend to agree with the philosophy, the big problem with that is that if they can do it from "corporate" a hacker can do it from bumfukistan.

Eh. Yes, but in practice it's fairly common. Most things in the corporate world with a password is centrally managed. If a company is using Windows, it's called Active Directory. You can just right click on any PC or account and hit "disable". If it's not hooked up to the network, it won't receive that command. But if it is, and it usually is except for remote users, instant disables. Kerberus (the under the hood part of AD) is pretty secure, as it's essentially the holy grail of things you would want to hack. There's been exploits in the past, but if you keep up on your patching, it's good enough security when balanced against operational requirements.

Way it works in practice is that each sub-entity gets its own domain. The Venezelian sysadmins can do stuff on that domain. But they can't do anything to the forest that has control over it. You can have multiple layers. Typically there's only a couple of forest (top level) sysadmins that specifically control it.

[Scout26]

All way too much work.  Unless you have skilled operators of said equipment, they'll either break on the first attempt to operate it, or it will eventually succumb to lack of maintenance/replacement parts.   It's not like it's been used any way, which it makes it all the more likely to fail they first time they try to use it.

[RevDisk]

All way too much work.  Unless you have skilled operators of said equipment, they'll either break on the first attempt to operate it, or it will eventually succumb to lack of maintenance/replacement parts.   It's not like it's been used any way, which it makes it all the more likely to fail they first time they try to use it.

http://www.thedrive.com/news/9642/gm-fires-2700-employees-by-text-message-after-venezuelan-plant-seizure

They fired everyone via bulk SMS texts, sent electronic payments, disabled all accounts and the executives left the country. Clorox did the same in 2014. The VZ government will have to crack the local servers and whatnot to get the machinery up and running. It's not impossible to do, just very very complicated.

It's not WW2, most high end equipment is on the network and part of an organized workflow.

President of Venezuela Nicolás Maduro says the seizure is not permanent and is urging GM to come back. Labor Minister Francisco Torrealba added, "To the current General Motors president of Venezuela, Jose Cavaileri: You come here, show your face and share with us the options to restore normality."

Without the White House pressuring GM, I sincerely doubt that will happen.


I've written up those kinds of plans before. At previous companies, we had operations in sketchy countries. Favorite one was where we had a satellite modem hooked up to the network in case the locals cut internet/phone line to send the AD sync to disable everything. Maybe wipe the data, maybe not.

[Ben]

President of Venezuela Nicolás Maduro says the seizure is not permanent and is urging GM to come back. Labor Minister Francisco Torrealba added, "To the current General Motors president of Venezuela, Jose Cavaileri: You come here, show your face and share with us the options to restore normality."

"Come back and play ball with us Mr Reardon, and do as we say, and there will be no more problems."

[RevDisk]

"Come back and play ball with us Mr Reardon, and do as we say, and there will be no more problems."

I always hated Atlas Shrugged on literary grounds. It was overly long, the characters were one dimensional (not just the villains either), it assigned too competency to too few people, etc. With some ruthless editing and a bit more character development, it had potential to be a great book.

But ye fluffy gods, the VZ are acting like it is an instruction manual.

[makattak]

I always hated Atlas Shrugged on literary grounds. It was overly long, the characters were one dimensional (not just the villains either), it assigned too competency to too few people, etc. With some ruthless editing and a bit more character development, it had potential to be a great book.

But ye fluffy gods, the VZ are acting like it is an instruction manual.

I just wanted to highlight your most correct point. I always tell people to feel free to skip 20 or more pages anytime a main character starts speechifying.

As an author, Ms. Rand was not all that great. As a prophet/judge of her enemies... she's frighteningly competent.

[Marnoot]

I always tell people to feel free to skip 20 or more pages anytime a main character starts speechifying.

That's the only way I made it through the book. Otherwise I'd read a page, fall asleep for 20 minutes, repeat.

[Scout26]

In Ms. Rand's defense , she was a playwright moreso than an author.  Hence the excess verbiage as she was giving directorial instructions, in addition to writing a story.

[AJ Dual]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3547050/posts

Looks like the vz.gov is making noises about trucking the population out to the farms to grow and harvest food.

They look about to go "full-Nork" and nobody told them "You never go full-Nork".

[Scout26]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3547050/posts

Looks like the vz.gov is making noises about trucking the population out to the farms to grow and harvest food.

They look about to go "full-Nork" and nobody told them "You never go full-Nork".

Democratic Socialism.   They voted for it.  They deserve to get it good and hard. 

The only problem is that no one is learning from their example, except people who already knew this would be the outcome.

[Viking]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3547050/posts

Looks like the vz.gov is making noises about trucking the population out to the farms to grow and harvest food.

They look about to go "full-Nork" and nobody told them "You never go full-Nork".

I'm thinking more along the lines of Cambodia. How long until they shoot everyone with a university degree?