Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: AZRedhawk44 on December 21, 2009, 11:05:15 AM
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I'm contemplating a micro-compact or mouse gun as a backup gun or minimalist light carry gun.
If I'm wearing dockers or pants that are as tactical as fistful's, I can carry my 642 I currently have in my front pocket. But, with jeans, I can't do that and comfortably/easily get to the snub to draw it, and it's uncomfortable to sit down.
I hear people using back pocket for a carry method, with the slim autos.
Doesn't this have the possibility of bending/cracking the slide of the pocket gun? Or the inserted magazine? Can it crack the polymer frame? I don't even store my big gun magazines in my back pocket because I'm afraid of bending/breaking them.
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Hmm. Speaking as a Big Fat Guy, I don't see it. I don't normally do back pocket carry, but I have a Kahr PM9 that fits back there nicely. I've carried back there as part of a demonstration once. Sitting didn't seem to cause any problems, and checking right now, (not carrying at work *grump*) my back pocket doesn't seem to be in a spot where it would take a lot of stress.
You could always get an appropriately sized blue gun and carry it back there for a while, and try to pay attention to where your weight is sitting.
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LOL...
Even the worst/cheapest of Saturday Night Special guns is a lot tougher than a wallet which is just leather and a stack of credit cards.
You'd have to weigh 200lbs, have buttocks of pure muscle (tensed for impact) and fall on a pointy rock just right to hurt a compact auto of any common make like that.
Oh, and the polymer would probably have to be at a fair amount below freezing to get that brittle as well.
Sorry for the imagery. :lol:
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Back before the ATF ruled them illegal, I had a leather wallet holster for my AMT DAO Backup in .380. It is made of stainless steel and built like a tank. It fit very nicely into a back pocket of my jeans and did not cause undue distress upon sitting, once I shifted it into a comfortable position.
After the ATF ruling, I cut up and threw out the leather wallet holsters, and have not carried it in my back pocket since.
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Back before the ATF ruled them illegal, I had a leather wallet holster for my AMT DAO Backup in .380. It is made of stainless steel and built like a tank. It fit very nicely into a back pocket of my jeans and did not cause undue distress upon sitting, once I shifted it into a comfortable position.
After the ATF ruling, I cut up and threw out the leather wallet holsters, and have not carried it in my back pocket since.
IIRC, they were ruled illegal because you could fire the pistol without removing it from the "wallet", correct?
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Back before the ATF ruled them illegal, I had a leather wallet holster for my AMT DAO Backup in .380. It is made of stainless steel and built like a tank. It fit very nicely into a back pocket of my jeans and did not cause undue distress upon sitting, once I shifted it into a comfortable position.
After the ATF ruling, I cut up and threw out the leather wallet holsters, and have not carried it in my back pocket since.
wtf? Please explain.
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Ditto. Wasn't aware the ATF had jurisdiction over holsters or methods of concealment.
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Ditto. Wasn't aware the ATF had jurisdiction over holsters or methods of concealment.
Using them together meant that you had something that didn't look like a gun but still functioned like a gun making it an AOW. Das F-Troopen are very jealous of their tax stamp revenue.
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All $5 of it... ;/ Although an appropriately licensed SOT would have to pay the $200 "making" tax, which would get passed along to you anyway.
Although there are still wallet holsters and other silhouette-concealing devices that the ATF has approved for pocket autos as being non-AOW's.
Just to be clear, the "wallet holster" had to demonstrably NOT look like a gun, and still be attached to the firearm AND allow firing. Generally these are square designs with nothing visible but a hole for the trigger.
The ATF gives it's blessing to designs that do not conceal the slide of an auto-pistol. Such as this one here: http://rdpersonalprotection.com/kel-tec_accessories If it wrapped around the top and covered the slide it would then be an AOW if a suitable pistol were inserted into it.
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wtf? Please explain.
It was a leather wallet holster that allowed firing while still in the holster. It had a cutout for the trigger and the slide. The ATF ruled that the combination was an AOW, and mere possession of the holster was a felony, if I recall correctly. I had two of the holsters, made long prior to the ATF ruling, and I literally chopped them up into small pieces and threw them away.
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Also, the holster in of itself is not an AOW, and completely unrestricted to sell, so there are some designs out there being sold by unscrupulous dealers. It's only an AOW when combined with a pistol that fits it.
So if you do go that route, I'd be sure to buy from one that clearly states they have followed the law to ensure it's not an AOW.
And of course, any wallet-like holster that does not have a hole for the trigger or the muzzle is not regulated at all.
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If your butt is big enough to crack/bend the slide of a pistol, you have a much more serious problem to deal with..............chris3
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Also, the holster in of itself is not an AOW, and completely unrestricted to sell, so there are some designs out there being sold by unscrupulous dealers. It's only an AOW when combined with a pistol that fits it.
Maybe that was it. Or was it that mere ownership of the holster and a pistol that fit it was the felony, and the pistol did not have to actually be in the holster to constitute a felony. I thought I recalled reading some guidance that this was the ATF approach on enforcement, and this is what caused me to destroy the holsters. It has been so many years that I have forgotten the details, and I haven't the slightest idea as to the current state of the law.
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The term they like to use is "constructive possession"
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Sounds like a literal PITA to me ;)
Only time I ever did back pocket carry was if I was just sticking a gun back there to go check something out. Definitely not "concealed" but a back jeans pocket makes a passable temporary holster for a 4" DA revolver.
These days, if I'm wearing jeans then I'm wearing an OWB holster and gun, so it doesn't matter.
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The term they like to use is "constructive possession"
a.k.a. "Thoughtcrime". =|
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The term they like to use is "constructive possession"
In the same way that owning steel tubing and fender washers is the same as making unregistered suppressors.
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Or a pocket-holster and scissors? [tinfoil]
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Consider that if you are on your back in a fight, you're going to have a damn hard time getting at it back there. Better than nothing, but I'd seriously consider going the traditional strong side IWB.
Thats where I carry my P3AT, so I do have a vested interest in being right... :-*