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Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: K Frame on December 12, 2007, 07:21:26 AM

Title: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: K Frame on December 12, 2007, 07:21:26 AM
the City Council believes you need extra special protections...

In a unanimous vote, the Seattle City Council on Monday passed a measure that makes harassing a homeless person a hate crime.

Under a law sponsored by council president Nick Licata, homeless people are now among those protected by the city's hate crime law prohibiting malicious harassment. The law already bars malicious harassment based upon gender identity, marital status, political ideology, age and parental status.

The law also makes it illegal to damage the belongings of a homeless person.

The move was considered largely symbolic because the city rarely charges people with malicious harassment. If a case is serious enough, it is typically forwarded to the King County Prosecutor's Office for possible charges under the state's law on malicious harassment.

Still, the proposal enjoyed the support of the full council, City Attorney Tom Carr, Mayor Greg Nickels and advocates for the homeless.
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: Manedwolf on December 12, 2007, 07:39:50 AM
So if a bunch of them decide to build a box town on the sidewalk outside your business, if you try to move the boxes, would that be a hate crime? Huh?

Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: MillCreek on December 12, 2007, 10:38:00 AM
Actually, I can speak to this a little bit from following it in the local media.  I worked in downtown Seattle for 24 years, and in recent years, the homeless population has greatly increased.  There were some well-publicized cases in the past few years of violent assaults against homeless individuals by virtue of their status of being homeless.  For example, a couple of homeless individuals were severely burned when a group of local youths poured gasoline on them and lit it as they slept.  Another transient was stabbed to death by another group of local youths.  This has led to calls for tougher laws protecting the homeless from harassment and assault.

By giving hate crime protection to the status of being homeless, the city can impose tougher criminal penalties to those persons harassing the homeless.  Because I have not read up on it,  I don't know the demarcation line between harassment and assault.  Certainly, serious offenses are prosecuted at the King County level, and not at the Seattle Municipal Court level, where the malicious harassment law applies.
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: HankB on December 12, 2007, 11:01:19 AM
. . . a couple of homeless individuals were severely burned when a group of local youths poured gasoline on them and lit it as they slept.  Another transient was stabbed to death by another group of local youths.  This has led to calls for tougher laws protecting the homeless from harassment and assault.
I thought we already had laws against arson, attempted murder, aggravated assault, and murder? Some would-be murderer is going to think twice and say to himself "Ooooh . . . this guy is homeless . . . better find someone else to kill."

This "hate crime" drivel is just a way of saying some people are worth more than YOU are.  angry
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: Manedwolf on December 12, 2007, 11:34:04 AM
Quote
By giving hate crime protection to the status of being homeless, the city can impose tougher criminal penalties to those persons harassing the homeless.

So pouring gasoline on someone didn't already have a serious penalty?

Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: Jamisjockey on December 12, 2007, 12:29:21 PM
Exactly.  If mtnbkr's daughter decides to light Mike Irwin on fire, its no less vicious than if some youth sets a homeless person/homosexual/minority on fire.  (like how I found a chance to remind everyone Irwin is constantly bested by a 4year old?  laugh).
the life of a homeless person is worth no more and no less than that of a white middle class suburbanite, a klansman, a liberal, a conservative, a homosexual, a minority, or even a terror suspect. 
Hate Crime = Thought Crime.
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: charby on December 12, 2007, 12:34:22 PM
So if a bunch of them decide to build a box town on the sidewalk outside your business, if you try to move the boxes, would that be a hate crime? Huh?



casually drop a cigarette butt on one of the boxes.. 
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: Scout26 on December 12, 2007, 02:53:05 PM
So is saying "Get a Job" malicious harrassment ??  How about handing them job applications ??

Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: Standing Wolf on December 12, 2007, 04:26:40 PM
Quote
This "hate crime" drivel is just a way of saying some people are worth more than YOU are.

They vote for representatives of the Democratic (sic) party. You probably had more sense.
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: MillCreek on December 13, 2007, 04:56:32 AM
I looked up the definition of malicious harassment in the Seattle Municipal Code.  Here it is, but note that the homeless status has not yet been added:

SMC 12A.06.115  Malicious harassment.

A. A person is guilty of malicious harassment if he or she maliciously and intentionally commits one (1) of the following acts because of his or her perception of another person's gender identity, marital status, political ideology, age, or parental status:

1. Causes physical injury to another person; or

2. By threat places another person in reasonable fear of harm to his or her person or property or harm to the person or property of a third person; provided however, that it shall not constitute malicious harassment for a person to speak or act in a critical, insulting, or deprecatory way so long as his or her words or conduct do not constitute a threat of harm to the person or property of another person; or

3. Causes physical damage to or the destruction of the property of another person.

B. "Threat" means to communicate, directly or indirectly, the intent to:

1. Cause bodily injury to another; or

2. Cause damage to the property of another; or

3. Subject another person to physical confinement or restraint.

C. "Gender identity" means a person's identity, expression, or physical characteristics, whether or not traditionally associated with one's biological sex or one's sex at birth, including transsexual, transvestite, and transgendered, and including a person's attitudes, preferences, beliefs, and practices pertaining thereto.

D. Every person who, in the commission of malicious harassment, shall commit any other crime, may be punished therefor as well as for the malicious harassment, and may be prosecuted for each crime separately.

(Ord. 120132 Section 1, 2000.)

I wonder what 'parental status' means.  That the victim is or is not a parent? 
Title: Re: If you want to be homeless, be homeless in Seattle...
Post by: Sawdust on December 13, 2007, 06:56:04 AM
Quote
I wonder what 'parental status' means.  That the victim is or is not a parent?   

My take is that you can't call the 'victim' a bastidge...

Sawdust