Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Desertdog on March 19, 2009, 10:31:17 PM
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What in the hell is a "Volunteer Service" when you are required to serve? Sounds more like forced servatude to me.
Amendment XIII. fn5 [ Annotations ]
Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Section 2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
House adopts plan for 'volunteer' corps
Also requires new evaluationof 'mandatory' service for all
By Bob Unruh
The U.S. House of Representatives has approved a plan to set up a new "volunteer corps" and consider whether "a workable, fair, and reasonable mandatory service requirement for all able young people" should be developed.
The legislation also refers to "uniforms" that would be worn by the "volunteers" and the "need" for a "public service academy, a 4-year institution" to "focus on training" future "public sector leaders." The training, apparently, would occur at "campuses."
The vote yesterday came on H.R. 1388, which reauthorizes through 2014 the National and Community Service Act of 1990 and the Domestic Volunteer Service Act of 1973, acts that originally, among other programs, funded the AmeriCorps and the National Senior Service Corps.
It not only reauthorizes the programs, but also includes "new programs and studies" and is expected to be funded with an allocation of $6 billion over the next five years, according to the Congressional Budget Office.
Many, however, are raising concerns that the program, which is intended to include 250,000 "volunteers," is the beginning of what President Obama called his "National Civilian Security Force" in a a speech last year in which he urged creating an organization as big and well-funded as the U.S. military. He has declined since then to elaborate.
WND reported when a copy of the speech provided online apparently was edited to exclude Obama's specific references to the new force.
The new bill specifically references the possibilities "if all individuals in the United States were expected to perform national service or were required to perform a certain amount of national service."
Such new requirements perhaps, the legislation notes, "would strengthen the social fabric of the Nation and overcome civic challenges by bringing together people from diverse economic, ethnic, and educational backgrounds."
No one, apparently with the exception of infants, would be excluded:
(Story continues below)
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=92288
The video of his statements is posted here: http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=92288
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I'll be keeping an eye on what comes out of this. But the article is a bit long on hysteria and a bit short on actual facts. Much as I hate Obama and what Congress is doing, I want more details. And not WND details. Yes, I am very suspicious as to what exactly the Obama administration or Congress will do to establish a mandatory volunteer or security service, but I do not want to go off half cocked.
Here's the bill at Thomas.gov
http://www.thomas.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:h.r.01388: (http://www.thomas.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:h.r.01388:)
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The U.S. House of Representatives has approved a plan to set up a new "volunteer corps" and consider whether "a workable, fair, and reasonable mandatory service requirement for all able young people" should be developed.
Well, Miniplenty has done a really good job this year.....Anyone got any razor blades ??
:| :mad:
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I'm going to be really, really pissed if they do come up with mandatory service. And then I get to practice civil disobedience.
Should be fun.
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There will be nothing civil about my disobedience seeing as how I didn't bring two children into this world to be slaves for Unkie Sam (should be called Uncle Sham or Uncle Shame nowadays) and I have a major problem with authority.
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Okay, been reading more up on this bill.
This is not good. Not good at all.
Why is it that every day, nay, every hour, that this administration or the Congress does something to greatly piss me off? Can't I have a little time without my blood boiling?
And why the hell did we not hear about this bill before it passed the House? (Not that it matters, but still...)
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If it's a spiffy uniform, I'll consider it. :laugh:
Speaking of spiffy(ish) uniforms, the French Foreign Legion pays almost exactly what the US military does. And they give you a FAMAS, too. :laugh:
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I tried reading the Thomas link, and I can't get it to work. Can a legal minded person spell this out for us? Is it really the Obama Brownshirts Program WND is making it out to be?
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Why is it that every day, nay, every hour, that this administration or the Congress does something to greatly piss me off? Can't I have a little time without my blood boiling?
We are being subjected to this in the hopes that they can kill us without have a show of blood on their hands.
I really wonder how many people are going to die from heart attacks in these next four years. I know my blood pressure has been up and I haven't felt as well as I think I should (considering that I am only 33) for several months.
Can I sue the Feds for attempted murder?
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And why the hell did we not hear about this bill before it passed the House? (Not that it matters, but still...)
Smoke and mirrors, my friend. See, Obama and Dodd have been busily stirring the pot over AIG. The press was busy covering that, while the house snuck this one by us. They are hitting us from all fronts.
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Those treasonous cowards in the media had damn well better cover this. :mad:
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I read a story about this on Fox or Drudge a few days ago. In the story was a quote from one of its august sponsors about how money was included for studying the feasibility of mandatory public service by all young Americans. He was of the opinion that all young Americans should be required to serve in some capacity.
I wish I could find the bloody story.
ETA: Found it. Not a quote from one of the sponsors, but a statement of intent nonetheless.
But the bill's opponents -- and there are only a few in Congress -- say it could cram ideology down the throats of young "volunteers," many of whom could be forced into service since the bill creates a "Congressional Commission on Civic Service."
The bipartisan commission will be tasked with exploring a number of topics, including "whether a workable, fair and reasonable mandatory service requirement for all able young people could be developed and how such a requirement could be implemented in a manner that would strengthen the social fabric of the nation."
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/18/house-readies-passage-volunteerism-critics-pricey-forced-service/ (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/18/house-readies-passage-volunteerism-critics-pricey-forced-service/)
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"But the article is a bit long on hysteria and a bit short on actual facts."
Yes, yes it is. As are quite a few of the comments here.
Over at TFL we had some jackass start screaming about the "Indentured Servitude Act of 2009" and how this was slavery, and claiming that EVERY American was going to have to put in up to 500 hours of service. EVERY American? Even those who are being served by others?
How would Carla Crack Whore serve? Giving away 500 free tricks to Billy Bob Rum Bum?
How about Bill Bob Rum Bum? Wash 1,000 windshields free? But that wouldn't be serving those who need to be served, right? They have cars, Billy Bob Rum Bum doesn't have a car.
What the House of Representatives passed is actually out there for everyone to review. If you've NOT read the bill, if you're relying on WND, the Onion, or Nicky the Oh Noes It's Armageddon doomsayer for your "facts," DON'T.
Any further hysterical bleating in this thread will be summarily deal with, as will the bleater.
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If it's a spiffy uniform, I'll consider it.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.xscapesprops.com%2Fstar%2520trek%2520props%2Ftng_voyager_era_uniforms%2FTNG_Uniform_Mens.jpg&hash=7fb898f84468e8ba9ffe376d0f608711dc35a6ff)
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I'm worried, about waste, and there's more than enough of that to go around.
I'm sure we all see the disturbing parallels to all the other societies who had a bad habit of putting everyone in a uniform of some sort. I'm not worried-worried about that... yet, because at the end of the day even if it's evil, fascisim takes work and sacrifice. Liberals don't like work.
It'll be some horrendus bureaucracy of 10,000 people in Washington, so college-age kids can play Peace Corps in the ghetto.
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Idealism is a dangerous thing.
The people this bill purports to help already receive massive government subsidies from the American taxpayer.
Maybe it is time for them to help us, not the other way around? Maybe the gang members who get "programs" need to be asked to do something for the rest of the community rather than expecting middle-class kids with skills to do a secularized version of the "imitation of Christ" by reaching out, yet again, to the "disadvantaged?"
The issue is this: in the end Americans are entitled to be individualists and to be "selfish." We do not have to live for others, much less for the State. This nation was founded on independence, not on collective harmony. And it is more than a bit ironic that a blatant narcissist like Barack Obama should be promoting service to others. What great service to others has he rendered in his life? Spending monies he never earned to help people he favors?
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It'll be some horrendus bureaucracy of 10,000 people in Washington, so college-age kids can play Peace Corps in the ghetto.
^^^ This.
I read a fox news article on this where the proponents crowed about the financial windfall all this good will work will provide. That the spending of $1 had a net "profit" return of $4 in areas served by volunteerism.
My initial thought was... "okay the college kids work for free. But who gets the fancy offices and bureaucratic titles so that they can organize all this crap?"
There's the $1 getting eaten. Not on transportation for the volunteers, or ingredients for the soup kitchen, or books for new libraries. It's for the GS-10 through GS-15 positions that will be created and filled by liberal bureaucracy lifers. And the graft and bribes that can be organized around suppliers for the volunteer projects.
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Idealism is a dangerous thing.
The people this bill purports to help already receive massive government subsidies from the American taxpayer.
The issue is this: in the end Americans are entitled to be individualists and to be "selfish." We do not have to live for others, much less for the State. This nation was founded on independence, not on collective harmony. And it is more than a bit ironic that a blatant narcissist like Barack Obama should be promoting service to others. What great service to others has he rendered in his life? Spending monies he never earned to help people he favors?
I utterly agree with everything quoted.
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here's the real uniform
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.discounts4dance.com%2Fimages%2FBal-Togs-Mens-Pants.gif&hash=f27178be24660fe11f749a4b6e53686d1ea95c2d) (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.discounts4dance.com/images/Bal-Togs-Mens-Pants.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.discounts4dance.com/index.php%3FcPath%3D57&usg=__EsexG_qA4drFd8Va7n9UGkwOfoU=&h=420&w=300&sz=45&hl=en&start=4&sig2=L90IJWYVgQ52jzEshmLE4Q&um=1&tbnid=1EOL5H_TID0BSM:&tbnh=125&tbnw=89&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dballet%2Bmens%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1&ei=M2jESeDuGZ2mtgeNgIXOCg)
:laugh:
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I'm not sure, but I guess what this is about is what they are calling the "Give Act"???
A shortcut to the text is here:
http://www.rules.house.gov/111/LegTe...hr1388_txt.pdf
A summary is here:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...88&tab=summary
The following summary was written by the Congressional Research Service, a nonpartisan arm of the Library of Congress.
3/9/2009--Introduced.
Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education Act or the GIVE Act - Amends the National and Community Service Act of 1990 (NSCA) and the Domestic Volunteer Service Act of 1973 (DVSA) to revise the programs under such Acts and reauthorize appropriations for such programs through FY2014.
Revises under NSCA: (1) the School-Based and Community-Based Service-Learning programs and Higher Education Innovative Programs for Community Service (Learn and Serve programs); (2) National Service Trust programs (AmeriCorps); (3) the National Civilian Community Corps (NCCC); and (4) the Investment for Quality and Innovation program.
Eliminates the current Community-Based Learn and Serve programs.
Establishes two new Learn and Serve programs: (1) Campuses of Service, which provides funds to institutions of higher education to develop or disseminate exemplary service-learning programs that assist their students' pursuit of public service careers; and (2) Innovative Service-Learning Programs and Research, which funds community service-learning opportunities for elementary and secondary, college, and graduate students as well as research into service-learning.
Includes among eligible AmeriCorps programs: (1) an Education Corps to address unmet educational needs; (2) a Healthy Futures Corps to address unmet health needs; (3) a Clean Energy Corps to address unmet environmental needs; and (4) a Veterans Corps to address the unmet needs of veterans and their families.
Creates AmeriCorps Opportunity Corps programs that include certain existing programs and new programs to: (1) increase community access to technology; (2) engage citizens in public safety, health, and emergency preparedness services; (3) mentor youth; (4) reduce recidivism by re-engaging court-involved youth; and (5) support the needs of veterans or active duty service members and their families.
Establishes an Education Awards Only program authorizing the Corporation for National and Community Service (Corporation) to provide fixed-amount grants to programs that have approved national service positions, but no AmeriCorps funding.
Sets the National Service educational awards for full-time AmeriCorps, NCCC, and Volunteers in Service to America (VISTA) participants at a level equal to the maximum available Pell Grant available to students under the Higher Education Act of 1965.
Includes among needs to be met under the NCCC program, disaster relief, infrastructure improvement, environmental and energy conservation, and urban and rural development.
Requires states to develop comprehensive plans for volunteer and paid service by Baby Boomers and older adults.
Directs the Corporation to plan pilot programs to: (1) better target and serve displaced workers; and (2) establish a centralized electronic citizenship verification system which would allow the Corporation to share employment eligibility information with the Department of Education.
Authorizes the Corporation to treat September 11th annually as a National Day of Service and Remembrance.
Establishes within the Investment for Quality and Innovation program: (1) a ServeAmerica Fellowships program providing fellowships to individuals chosen by states to participate in service projects addressing certain areas of national need; (2) a Silver Scholarship Grant Program providing scholarships to individuals age 55 or older who complete at least 500 hours of service in a year in an area of national need; and (3) an Encore Fellowships program providing one-year fellowships to individuals age 55 or older who serve in areas of national need and receive training to transition to public service employment. Makes ServeAmerica fellows eligible for national service educational awards.
Authorizes the Corporation to provide grants to innovative and model service programs, including those for disadvantaged youth, youth under age 17, and potential recidivists.
Eliminates federal funding for the Points of Light Foundation.
Revises under DVSA: (1) the VISTA program; and (2) the Senior Corps, including the Retired and Senior Volunteer program (RSVP), the Foster Grandparent program, and the Senior Companion program.
Gives priority in VISTA participant selection to disadvantaged youth and retired adults of any profession.
Authorizes new VISTA grant programs of national significance that provide poor and rural communities with: (1) services reintegrating formerly incarcerated individuals into society; (2) financial literacy and planning; (3) before-school and after-school services; (4) community economic development initiatives; (5) assistance to veterans and their families; and (6) health and wellness services. Eliminates the VISTA Literacy Corps, University Year for VISTA, and Literacy Challenge Grant programs.
Raises the minimum and maximum stipend provided to VISTA participants.
Prioritizes RSVP projects in specified areas.
Makes anyone 55 years of age or older eligible as Senior Corps volunteers.
Provides, under the Senior Corps demonstration program, incentive matching grants to Senior Corps programs that exceed specified performance measures, enroll most of their volunteers in outcome-based service programs, and increase their enrollment of Baby Boomer volunteers.
Expresses the sense of the Congress that the number of AmeriCorps, VISTA, and NCCC participants should reach 250,000 by 2014.
Congressional Commission on Civic Service Act - Establishes a Congressional Commission on Civic Service to provide recommendations to Congress on improving opportunities for individuals to volunteer or perform national service.
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AAhh, an "Obama Youth" program. How original.
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I got this elsewhere and wondered about its authenticity pdf's don't work on my laptop
by NoSocialism4USA
Mar 20 2009
11:43 AM
Wondering why nobody is talking about The US President's update of 1404.10 effective immediately on Jan 23 2009.
Read it yourself @ link below:
<www.dtic.mil/.../140410p.pdf>
Department of Defense
DIRECTIVE
NUMBER 1404.10
23 January 2009
USD(P&R)
SUBJECT: DoD Civilian Expeditionary Workforce
References: See Enclosure 1
1. PURPOSE. This Directive:
a. Reissues DoD Directive (DoDD) 1404.10 (Reference (a)) under a new title to establish the
policy through which an appropriately sized subset of the DoD civilian workforce is preidentified
to be organized, trained, and equipped in a manner that facilitates the use of their
capabilities for operational requirements. These requirements are typically away from the
normal work locations of DoD civilians, or in situations where other civilians may be evacuated
to assist military forces where the use of DoD civilians is appropriate. These employees shall be
collectively known as the DoD Civilian Expeditionary Workforce. Members of the DoD
Civilian Expeditionary Workforce shall be organized, trained, cleared, equipped, and ready to
deploy in support of combat operations by the military; contingencies; emergency operations;
humanitarian missions; disaster relief; restoration of order; drug interdiction; and stability
operations of the Department of Defense in accordance with DoDD 3000.05 (Reference (b)).
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AAhh, an "Obama Youth" program. How original.
Do they give out nifty souvenirs like knives?
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The legislation also refers to "uniforms"
Wouldn't happen to look like this would they?
Pathetic, idiotic photo reference to Nazi Germany deleted. See my message above about hysterical bleating.
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Actually, the uniforms would look something like this....
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ericles.com%2Fimages%2Fthx1138.jpg&hash=d05fd362c6d73bd0bbfc9b7f74246ae27d328ceb)
http://www.ericles.com/images/thx1138.jpg (http://www.ericles.com/images/thx1138.jpg)
=D
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Ah, THX 1138, one of my favorites. :)
One of those films with long eyes...
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Actually, the uniforms would look something like this....
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ericles.com%2Fimages%2Fthx1138.jpg&hash=d05fd362c6d73bd0bbfc9b7f74246ae27d328ceb)
Is that a mandarin collar? On the Star Trek picture as well?
Screw it. I'm joining the Foreign Legion. :laugh:
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I got this elsewhere and wondered about its authenticity pdf's don't work on my laptop
by NoSocialism4USA
Mar 20 2009
11:43 AM
Wondering why nobody is talking about The US President's update of 1404.10 effective immediately on Jan 23 2009.
Read it yourself @ link below:
<www.dtic.mil/.../140410p.pdf>
Department of Defense
DIRECTIVE
NUMBER 1404.10
23 January 2009
USD(P&R)
SUBJECT: DoD Civilian Expeditionary Workforce
References: See Enclosure 1
1. PURPOSE. This Directive:
a. Reissues DoD Directive (DoDD) 1404.10 (Reference (a)) under a new title to establish the
policy through which an appropriately sized subset of the DoD civilian workforce is preidentified
to be organized, trained, and equipped in a manner that facilitates the use of their
capabilities for operational requirements. These requirements are typically away from the
normal work locations of DoD civilians, or in situations where other civilians may be evacuated
to assist military forces where the use of DoD civilians is appropriate. These employees shall be
collectively known as the DoD Civilian Expeditionary Workforce. Members of the DoD
Civilian Expeditionary Workforce shall be organized, trained, cleared, equipped, and ready to
deploy in support of combat operations by the military; contingencies; emergency operations;
humanitarian missions; disaster relief; restoration of order; drug interdiction; and stability
operations of the Department of Defense in accordance with DoDD 3000.05 (Reference (b)).
Not a big deal I think. Much of our military equipment requires civilian techs and operators employed by DOD. This appears to simply clarify taking some necessary employees along when the force deploys. There's nothing in there about forcing non-current DOD civie employees to do anything.
The bit about "when other civilians evacuate" would cover bringing in, for example, civilian DOD commissary or mess hall workers to a large forward operating base since local hire civilians wouldn't be available and using troops in that sort of situation would be a waste of their training.