Quarter-life crisis?

[SpookyPistolero]

Hi gang!

This is probably the same kind of thing that everyone else here has been through so I thought I'd ask for some advice. I'm a senior in college, biology major, but still have another semester after the summer. But I still don't know what to do in life. I had been aiming for medical school, but having had a doctor for a dad, I'm not sure I want to do that to my life. Or lack of a life more precisely.

I have been working in a research lab for about 1.3 years and definitely now know that I don't want to do research. Lots of crazy people and all you do is chase grant money. The people in this lab are just not good people, lots of backstabbing and making mountains out of molehills, etc. But I haven't left because it's good experience and a job.

So I have now started thinking about trying pharmacy school. A few more years and then I could make a good living straight out of school. Sounds good. I have to go check more out, but I'm not entirely certain I could stomach the work. Just dishing out pills all day might drive me nuts. I can't decide if it's worth it to have something to live well off of and pay the ammo bills, or if I should just take time off to try and find something I actually like and can BE EXCITED ABOUT.  It just seems like everything I do is something I try to stomach for the time being, not anything I enjoy in any way.

My family has always said do what you love, but I really can't think of anything I love. All these aspects of acadamia have really turned me off of everything. I'd rather be off in the sandbox shootin' at badguys than sitting here trying to write neuro papers and learning organic chemistry.

I want to be a happy person, and I want to be one now, not someone who dreads waking up every morning to start another day of their personal hell. Life is too short. And I know these problems I describe sound like the ramblings of a spoiled person with too many options in life but I can't help but feel like I'm left with no recourse. How do you find what you love to do?? Or do you just get a job you can stomach that supports a lifestyle that you can enjoy? Like affording our costly hobby, and a family, etc.

Problem two, to whine a bit more, is that I need a summer job and could work in this research lab full time at $8. But these people are miserable and I'm not sure I could stand it much longer. I do hate change a lot  though, and switching jobs is quite an ordeal when you've got nothing else lined up. Ah!

Sorry to throw out a 'woe is me' post but this stuff just wont leave me alone and is weighing heavy on my heart. I don't even sleep anymore because I can't stop trying to figure out what to do in the future, be it this summer or this decade. I'm going absolutely nuts. Any help from the brethren?

[Phantom Warrior]

Heh.  I was in your shoes about a year ago.  I was pretty sure I was going to graduate with my B.S. in Computer Science and my B.S. in Mathematics and work at McDonalds.  But things worked out.  I'm not sure if you are Christian or not, but I'm increasingly convinced that God shows us what we need to know, when we need to know it.  For the first three years of school I had no long-term plans.  I had no idea what to do.  And I didn't need to, yet.  But in the last year I've felt God calling me towards serving in the military for a few years, with a career as a lawyer after that.  Which I had no inkling of for the first 20 years of my life.  But God led me to that when I needed it, not when I wanted to know.  If you aren't religious, things have a way of working out.  Maybe not how you planned, but they do work out.

A practical suggestion.  Join the military.  "I'd rather be off in the sandbox shootin' at badguys than sitting here trying to write neuro papers and learning organic chemistry."  So do it.  I'm graduating w/ two Bachelor's degrees, planning to attend law school in a few years, and I'm shipping out for four years with the Army this June.  It's a great way to take a break from academics, while serving your country and earning a nice chunk of change.  Ever hear of the GI Bill?  That would be great for helping to pay with pharmacy school.  Or any other continuing education.  And you would have the pride of having served your country.

Also, for a summer job, look around.  $8/hour isn't that much.  You could easily find a different job.  If you live in a big city you could even grab the lawnmower and charge $10-$15 an hour to mow lawns.  Easy work, good exercise, fresh air, good money.  Don't hesitate to try something new.  Just don't get discouraged if you first ideas don't work out.  Keep trying.

Relax, be calm.  Life works out.  What's the worst that can happen?  No one is forcing you to lock yourself in a career.  If you don't like it, try something else.  My grandpa was a pastor, found out it wasn't for him, went back to get his Master's at 49, and did something else for the next 15 years.

[HForrest]

Well, in regards to Pharmacy School, my mom is a pharmacist and she absolutely hates her job. Of course, pharmacists make very good money- There's sign-on bonuses, high wages, and there's a tons of companies almost begging for you to come work for them. It's high-stress, though, at least with what my mom's been doing most of her career. 12 hour days and seven-day stretches of standing on your feet the entire time. It's almost impossible to take your 30 minute lunch break when customers are complaining to you because they switched insurance providers but want their Clarinex NOW. My mom's been with 3 major companies and they're all bad- RiteAid being the worst. Either poor management or understaffing is always a problem. Then again, if you want the money pharmacy isn't a bad choice. There's a high demand for pharmacists which means it's easy to land a job with great pay and benefits.

[Guest]

My mom has been a pharmacist for 20 years and she loves it. The thing to remember about pharmacy is that despite the fact that it is science oriented it is primarily a customer service field. Yes, your a "medical" person but you work in a drug store and you do jockey a cash register. Your going to be dealing with people, many of them pissed off and/or crazy as well as their insurance companies and physicians who may be in the same state of mind. How happy a person is in the field pretty much depends on how well they tollerate people. Depending on where you are the schools can be outrageously difficult to get into. And there is a problem right now with persons who are "science oriented" (academics) getting out of school and discovering that they are unprepared to be glorified clerks. There is a high turnover among recent graduates of pharmacy school. If you have the right kind of mind it can be an excellent job and there is a huge demand for qualified pharacists right now. But if your ill suited to the work you will be miserable.

A lot of people overthink what they are going to do for a living and end up bouncing between ideas and getting nowhere. Whether a person ends up being happy in a job or not really comes down to their own state of mind. Pick something that seems interesting that pays reasonably well and if you approach it the right way you will end up being happy with it.

[Sindawe]

I'm a senior in college, biology major, but still have another semester after the summer. But I still don't know what to do in life.

Ahhhh...the sweet scent of the angst of youth. Well, I think the Gods have already told you what THEY think you should be doing now (remember your comment about the sandbox?), so *I* think you should follow your instinct.  Many times over the years I've lived so far, I've seen, both in my own life and in that of others, following the instinct is usually the best course of action (tempered by reason of course).  

... is that I need a summer job and could work in this research lab full time at $8. But these people are miserable and I'm not sure I could stand it much longer.

The $8/hr is not great, even for a Lab Slave washing dishes and counting buttons. Ya sure you can't do better with a temp agency?  Maybe work on Scientific endeavors that are NOT research oriented? Although a sad fact of life is that almost anywhere you work, you're gonna run into folks who are crazy and/or miserable.  IMAO the trick there is to feed off of their madness/misery.  

If you don't like it, try something else.

Yeppers. Examples:  I personally know four folks who majored in the BioSciences in college.  Three of us now push bits and bytes for a living, while the fourth makes bread as a vocation(after pushing bits/bytes for a time and finding it did not suit him).

[RevDisk]

You're probably within a year or two of me.  I'm more or less at the same point.  I have six months left on my Army contract, then I'm out.   Paid my dues, and now want to get on with my life.  I've fit in college classes whenever I could.  Working on a Computer Science degree, but I'm thinking of changing that.  After learning how real world bit-pushers operate for nearly six years, college CS is driving me insane.

In six months, I will have to make a choice of my civilian career path.  I'm interviewing mainly with defense contractors as a information security guy.  I like the work, I generally like my coworkers in the field, and it involves plenty of travel.    I think I found my niche.  I like working with technology, but I don't have the patience to be chained to a desk being a code monkey.  This allows me to work with different kinds of technology, and combine many of my personal interests with a decent paycheck.



Counting pills isn't the most exciting job in the world.  But you would be doing your part to help many many people, saving countless lives.  Besides, what you do for the paycheck does not necessarily define you as a person.  You don't have to stay in one career for your entire life.


As for joining the military...  I'm not going to encourage or discourage you.  Make sure everything is in writing if you join.  If it's not on paper, it never existed.  Have a former or current service person you trust with your life go with you to talk to the recruiter and look over all paperwork.   If he or she makes any comments, listen to them.  Don't join the military on a spur-of-the-moment decission, think it over.  There are good and bad things to the military.   There are things worse than death.  Volunteer at a VA hospital before you join.  You'll learn real quick.  There are also many good things that can never verbally be described.  There are many ways to serve your country.  Military is only one of them.  If you want to talk more about it, PM/email me.  I can hook you up with folks in whatever career branch you are interested in.


Best of luck with the lab monkey, err assistant job.  I did my time as an IT geek in a lab.   No one on this planet is more egotistical than a brand-new PhD looking to harass someone that actually knows what they are doing.  $8/hr isn't great, but it is likely good experience.  You could try your hand as a temp, or look around for other employment.

[jamz]

Why not become a Radiologist?  That way, you can get your MD, got to radiology school, then you get to work bamker's hours, and almost never have to speak with patients.  The downside is you are in a dark room all day talking into a recording device.  But for a half million a year....


Love, James

[TarpleyG]

My wife was a biology major too.  Why?  I have no idea.  Anyway, she is now a middle school (8th grade right now) science teacher and is looking to maybe teach biology in high school later on.  I know teaching seems like it doesn't pay that much but if you consider the perks, it's a good deal.  She works just over half a year, 200 or so days.  That's a lot of vacation.  She has a retirement plan that will pay a significant percentage of her highest 5 years of salaries after 30 years.  No contribution on her part either.  Health insurance is really good and costs way less that what I pay (family plans are NOT a good deal--very expensive to put spouses and children on).  If you consider all teaching offers, it pays comparable to other jobs regardless of what you always hear about underpaid teachers.

Greg

[Holly76201]

I'm just going to echo some of the above, with a few cautions. If you want to go play in the sandbox, go do it. BUT, get a guaranteed job contract. That way if your MOS is not available, then you get an Honorable. Also, if you decide on a career in a medical field, they will pay for it, you serve a given # of years, and you get Officer pay. Or the Reserves of any of the branches of the Military offer similar programs.
I don't know about other states, but TX is starving for Science and Math teachers.
TX is also begging for Nurses. You would have the option of RN, Nurse Practioner, Nurse Anesthesist, and if you agree to work in an underserved area, there is a forgivess program for student loans.
So you've got a LOT of options, just have to decide which one you want, and you've got plenty of time to find a Vocation, not just a job.
Good Luck

[SpookyPistolero]

Thanks for all the advice thus far, truly.

Phantom,

I spent most of my teens and early college period in church. I was the one writing sermons and leading small groups in my home, volunteer work, bla bla. But in all that time I never felt like I had a single prayer answered. I worked earnestly and patiently but not help or answers ever came. That's not to say I don't believe in a God now, he just works in some screwed up ways if nothing else. But since he never showed me what I needed to know before and it's alwasy been me helping me (nothing novel) how could I expect any answers for something this important to me, whether it be in "God's time" or my own?

A lot of folks also underlined my worries about pharmacy. I can handle people well, but only so much. I think that much contact with stoopid people would kill me.  

If I were to join up for the fight, who's to say I'd be any happier, and at four years? That's a long time as this horrible university has taught me. (PS - Never send your kids to the University of Kentucky) At least I think it would be harder to have a bad time. Who wouldn't enjoy having a rifle strapped to their chest all day fighting the good fight?

It's so hard to just relax and not worry about things. It's still the morning of today and tomorrow's all I've got on my mind. That's no way to live.

[Waitone]

Been down that road and headed back down the same road.  

People, me included, tend to get cross threaded in developing career paths when they look at one aspect of their being and ignored other aspects.  Good example is my daughter.  She loved the idea of being an attorney.  The intellectual challenge was what appealed to her.  I knew it would never happen because she is a kenetic kinda kid.  Always in motion.  Can't spend enough time sitting still to eat a meal.  So she wanted to enter a profession where she would be required to sit still hour on end.  My mistake was entering a profession where I'd be indoors when I'd be much happier outdoors.

My suggestion is to find a competent counselor // therapist who has access to myriad tests which can sort out your interests.  It may cost you a few bucks but the information you gather is beyond value.

Good luc.

[Wingshooter]

You could also be a Pharmacist in a hospital.  A few of the bigger hospitals in this area have Pharmacist on hand in places like the ER and ICU and you respond to codes, major traumas, etc... not so much in the capacity to dispense drugs, more along the lines of being an instant pharmacopoeia.  A bit more pressure at times, but the ones I've seen seem to enjoy the job.  Not only can you do that, but in a teaching hospital the residents come to you for advice on what drugs to prescribe, compatibility with other drugs, interactions, etc...  Might be an option for you, could bridge both worlds.  Plus you only work 3 days a week 12 hour shifts in most of them.  These are the big hospitals that are either Trauma centers or Heart/Surgical centers.  The smaller hospitals would probably have you dispensing prescriptions and such.  I can't say because I've only interacted with the ones at bigger hospitals.

Food for thought.

[peteinct]

spooky P, I hate to break it to you but I'm 38 and still don't know what to do with my life. I think that when you stop thinking about it you are in trouble. You will probably change careers several times during your lifetime. Life may take you down many strange pathways until your final destination.

   The things I didn't do bug me more than what stupid things I did do so don't lock yourself into a certain path that may not have to be locked. If you want to join the army go for it. I'm  just a civilian but I'm sure there is more to it than running around in the sand playing soldier.  Maybe a private contractor needs someone with your skill set to work for a year. Your school must have some sort of placement help use it. you aren't alone and they must have a whole network to help

pete

[yesterdaysyouth]

The people in this lab are just not good people, lots of backstabbing and making mountains out of molehills, etc.

get used to this, i don't care what you do in life everyone is looking out for #1...  biggest problem with all jobs out there are the people you work with...  i'd be happy doing just about anything if i worked by myself and got paid for the work that I did...  but enter the union, the company, and .gov...  

just remember...
life is much more important than any amount of money, but you can't have a life without money.. it's up to you to decide where to draw the line...

[GigaBuist]

Not all code monkey jobs are the same.  I'll be turning 25 in just a few days here and I've had more than my fair share of experiences thus far, as I dropped out of school at 20. First company was run by a shyster that went bankrupt in 1.5 years or so from my date of hire.  We did some good work, but he went over the top after a while... I met some good people while I was there too.  Small company, 20-30 people.

I was unemployed for a few months.. then I found another small company, again 20ish people.  I worked there for about a year, but I felt like I got lowballed on my salary, so when I got an offer elsewhere, closer to home, I took it.  THAT job offer came from a guy from the 1st company... and it was brought up in a pub of all places.

So, I went to work for the largest employer in my city at the time (about 1,500 across town) and part of a multi-national company.  That's a bit different.. and I wasn't even a code monkey any more.  I was "tech support" I guess for lack of a better term.  I had no job description, my boss had no idea what I was supposed to do when I got hired on, but there was this idea that I should just be there.  It worked out well... and when I left (again, after just shy of a year) my boss had no idea how to write my job description.  I tired to make things not break, and when they did break I figure out who broke it and how to fix it.  That was about it... very interesting!

But.. I bounced out of there at the request of a buddy that needed a contractor to fill a spot at another company... and we knew of the opening because ANOTHER guy from the 1st company I (and he) worked for let us know of it.. and that I was going to be a good fit.  So, I took the contracting job, and my buddy made a BUNCH of money off my work there.  Hard feelings between me and my buddy?  Nope, not at all.  When I signed on I made sure I got the same salary as I had before... he wanted to pay me more.  I said no... he RELUCTANTLY agreed.

Eventually they hired me full-time... buddy lost some money on that one.  Then again, he DEMANDED that I leave.  Threatened physical force if I didn't take the full-time job, actually.  Considering at the time I was his #1 source of income... yup, that's what good friends are for.

So, I've been doing this same gig for about a year and a half now... working with a small group again.  I play with jukebox systems actually.  Yeah, its work, but it feels more like 'play' some days.

I also did a small stint as a contractor for a wireless ISP that has sprung up in the area, also run by a high school buddy.  We crossed paths at a party with a bunch of mutual friends, and knowing I'm a geek he asked if I knew about this "Linux" thingy and I did a few weeks work with him getting him bootstrapped.  He's something like 22 now (this is 2 years ago that he started) and now he's an independant business owner.. runs it with his dad, shares an office with my OTHER techy buddy.  Small world.

What's my point?

If you had told me  years ago what would have happened to me when I just said "screw it" and took that 1st job as a college drop out I'd have said you're INSANE.  I never saw it coming.  Nobody did.  Nobody could have predicted this.  Not me, not my wireless ISP buddy's lot in life, not my buddy that runs his own company (who also dropped out of college w/ me to work at the same company) etc.

You're what? 22?  Make a grab at something, try it out, run with it, see how it fits, stay there, move on?  Who cares?  if you think you can make something of it just grab it and beat the task at hand into the ground.  Repeat as often as necessary.

Oh, and somewhere in that midst I spent about 2 years part-time trying to get a  company off the ground with my aforementioned buddy from college and 3 other guys.  It didn't work out... but we gave it a good run.

If it looks good.. GO FOR IT!  What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger, and all that.

Regarding military experience... some of the BEST people I've worked with were those that were in the Marines or Army. I've NEVER seen a guy from the services come across as a slacker.  Not once.

You've got to stop hedging your bets and trying to find the safest, most fullfilling postion out there.  It doesn't matter much what the stats say, or what the percentages are, it matters only in what you do.  YOU control what happens to you, regardless of what pile of crap you step into.  Make the best of it.  Sieze the day.

If you want stories of people stepping into the unkown and making something unexpected of it... let me know.  I got some good ones.

[nico]

You might want to look into dentistry.  My dad is a dentist and I'm starting dental school in the fall.  School is about the same level of difficulty as med school, with the first two years being almost identical.  No residency is required for dentistry though.  If you don't want to specialize, general dentistry is much more hands on than the typical family medical practice, which is one of the main reasons I chose it.  The pay is also very good; in my area a dentist in the upper half of their class can make $100k straight out of school if they really want to and, depending on your aspirations, half a million a year or more isn't unreasonable if you own your own practice and do well.  Most general dentists work 4 days a week for 8 or 9 hours a day, depending on how much they want to make.  It's very possible to have a life outside your job as a dentist.

[HForrest]

"My mom has been a pharmacist for 20 years and she loves it."

Yeah, well my mom's been doing it for 25 years. Count 'em, 5 more than your mom. My post is more valid than yours. :p

[Old Fud]

It's like that "Brick wall" at the 18th mile of a marathon.
You've been dealing with an aggressive tough college program continuously for 3 1/2 years and can't see the light at the end of the tunnel.  Physically, you are as worn down as you will ever be in your lifetime, and you are emotionally drained.

You need a change of pace, as an absolute minimum.
But in your current state, I would recommend against making a career change.  You are too tired to really think it through.

Can you delay a real commitment until after summer break?
Do NOT take the lab summer job --- to ANYTHING ELSE instead.
   
As everybody else has already said, you won't have any trouble finding one that pays the same.  I'd suggest something in construction if you can get it -- 14 hours a day hauling lumber at a home-building site -- great outdoors work with wholesome cussin' spittin' drinkin' brawlin' rednecks -- Yee-HAH!!!!

Then decide.

Good luck.
Fud

P.S.  I forgot to check if you are a him or a her.  Wouldn't change the advice any, in case you're wondering.

[SpookyPistolero]

Talk about hitting the nail on the head, Old Fud.

I am going to take my time on decisions for careers. I have another semester to go, and not that many programs get started during the spring.  So a least a year.

I have to decide quickly, but I think you and my family are right in saying I shouldn't take the lab job. If the coworkers there were even mildly relaxed I would, but people are just wound too tightly.

I guess not knowing where to work is what gets me, but I'd rather just learn to deal with that. I need to just learn to deal with that.

Again, thanks so much to everyone for sharing your thoughts and experiences with me. You all make APS/THR a good place to call 'home'.

-Spooky

PS - I'm a he

[Chris]

Spooky,

Sorry to get here late.  Hopefully not too late.  Did you take your MCAT's?

I have a thought that might interest you.  Law School.  Don't laugh.  I knew several fellow law students that were using law school as a delay between school and the real world.  A law degree doesn't mean you have to be a practicing lawyer, and is highly marketable.  With a background in science, you could even pursue the patent bar, where people really get rich.  Or, you could be like my wofe, working office hours for an insurance company reviewing claims for liability/negligence issues.  Or, you could do an internship along the way, and find out htat being a prosecuting attorney (DA), is a great deal of fun, despite high pressure and low pay, plus you can carry a gun!

Just another thought for your alrady crowded mind.

[SpookyPistolero]

Didn't take the MCATs, but studied like hell for them for quite a while. Indecisiveness coupled with a small bank account meant I didn't think it would be worth the money to take them at this point.

Also an interesting point about law school. I am not really sure about it as I haven't talked to too many people who have gone through it. I am also not sure that necessary aspects of the job would be something that would mesh well with my personality.


I did decide (I think...) to not stay at the lab this summer. I am going to tell her I am burnt out and need a break. If she offers me a few dollars more per hour, however, I'd stay. But I'm not asking for it.

That just leaves figuring out where to work for the summer and then where to work for the rest of my life.... all small stufff.  Oh wait, not small, massive... (AH!)

I think I really need to get back to the woods and go backpacking. I used to do it a lot, very rough style, and it was good for the soul. I haven't gotten to do so in quite some time though.

Onward and upward-

[bratch]

I'm a junior and will graduate next May.
Not sure what kind of jobs you can get with your bachelors but my current plan is as follows.

Graduate start working (shouldnt be hard the department has 100% placement).  Most oil companies will pay for your continuing education so I'll probably pursue a MBA possibly a law degree while working.  This has quuite a few benefits: a double bonus for me financially, I am working and not having to pay for school, and I am getting a good experience with my company and profession to make sure it will fit.

It could be something to look into if you could find a company that would pick up your tab for graduate work.