Author Topic: Help. Omnivore Lab puppy! (Read 2859 times)

Leatherneck · « **on:** November 11, 2009, 06:39:56 PM »

Help, we have never had a pup do this before. Libby the eight month old Lab has just started chewing on the leather steering wheel, gear shift, door panel, etc. of Leatherness's car then today when I had her on a trip she did the same thing while I made a twenty minute stop at Home Depot. She knows she is doing wrong. I have to say this is the worst chewing problem we have had with her. Leatherness suggests crating her which I am not in favor of but I am thinking muzzle which is another thing we have never had to do. Any suggestions?

Jamisjockey · « **Reply #1 on:** November 11, 2009, 06:56:23 PM »

Crating.

AZRedhawk44 · « **Reply #2 on:** November 11, 2009, 07:03:07 PM »

Another +1 on crating.

My beast would chew whenever he got nervous or had separation anxiety.

Crating developed confidence in being left alone in a secure environment, and the chewing eventually went away as I left him alone for any amount of time from "checking the mail" to 10 hour days at work.

lupinus · « **Reply #3 on:** November 11, 2009, 07:17:23 PM »

Crate is the way to go with a dog, especially one with separation issues.

It may also help if you to strengthen your position as leader of the family pack. Sometimes a dog gets separation anxiety because it see's itself above you in the pack order. The alpha dogs can come and go as they please and lower members of the pack instinctively know this. If your dog sees itself above you in pack order the separation of a missing member can lead to such issues, depending on the level of confusion/anxiety.

drewtam · « **Reply #4 on:** November 11, 2009, 07:19:37 PM »

Quote from: lupinus on November 11, 2009, 07:17:23 PM

Crate is the way to go with a dog, especially one with separation issues.

It may also help if you to strengthen your position as leader of the family pack. Sometimes a dog gets separation anxiety because it see's itself above you in the pack order. The alpha dogs can come and go as they please and lower members of the pack instinctively know this. If your dog sees itself above you in pack order the separation of a missing member can lead to such issues, depending on the level of confusion/anxiety.

This.

Plus, labs have a reputation for destructive behavior to include chewing, digging, scratching, and escaping. They are also known as compulsive eaters and are often overweight because of it.

Waitone · « **Reply #5 on:** November 11, 2009, 07:24:53 PM »

Crating is not cruel. It merely makes use of a dog's natural tendencies for your benefit.

BridgeRunner · « **Reply #6 on:** November 11, 2009, 07:31:53 PM »

Quote from: Waitone on November 11, 2009, 07:24:53 PM

Crating is not cruel. It merely makes use of a dog's natural tendencies for your benefit.

+1

Crates are for dogs what Laz-e-Boys are for men.

Perfectly comfortable, keeps anxieties at bay, and allows the owner of the critter to get on with life without having deal with as many of the destructive tendencies and annoying habits of the roaming beastie.

Matthew Carberry · « **Reply #7 on:** November 11, 2009, 07:50:08 PM »

Quote from: BridgeWalker on November 11, 2009, 07:31:53 PM

+1

Crates are for dogs what Laz-e-Boys are for men.

Perfectly comfortable, keeps anxieties at bay, and allows the owner of the critter to get on with life without having deal with as many of the destructive tendencies and annoying habits of the roaming beastie.

I'm sure there's something in there that should offend me but I think I'll just put my feet up instead...

markallen · « **Reply #8 on:** November 11, 2009, 08:43:14 PM »

Don't use leather belts, or old shoes as toys. Don't use leather gloves to wrestle with. Don't give them raw hide chews strips.
A dog can't tell the difference between leather he can play with , and leather he can't.
Same goes for toys that imitate household items if you buy them rubber toys that look like everyday items, they think anything that looks like it is a toy.
Buy toys that they can play with, like tennis balls, or Kong Balls. Play with them with the toys, but when you are done, put the toys away. Don't let them chew on them unsupervised.
If you want to give them chews, give them Nylabones. Don't give them raw bones they splinter. You can give them sterilized or boiled bones, they turn to dust, and won't splinter, but don't let them chew them extensively the boiled bones are abrasive to their teeth, too much and it cam prematurely wear their teeth.
And crating is the best way to go. The crate should only be big enough for the dog to stand up in, and turn around. A dog will not potty where it sleeps, unless it is sick, so this helps them learn to hold their bladders.
Don't put food or water, or TOYS in the crate with them. Just a blanket that they can roll into a nest. To save money when buying a crate for a dog, buy one big enough for when the dog is full grown, but make partitions inside to limit the space until they grow into it.
Once they are full grown, and house trained they will still use the crate, if you leave it up, and leave the door open. It becomes a safe haven for them, and they will use it.

vaskidmark · « **Reply #9 on:** November 11, 2009, 09:24:10 PM »

As has been said by others, crating is your #1 move. You do not indicate she's shewing at home, so there's no need to bring up bitter apple (ask for it at Tractor Supply or your vet).

Question - is she in urgent need of peeing/pooping when you get back? Chewing might be her way of dealing with that anxiety. Does she normally get pee/poop breaks on short trips? If not, try giving her a break and see if she just sniffs and wonders why you are not going for more ride, or seems to know there was a need for the break.

Muzzling is going to send strange & confusing signals to her, as she can get to things but can't get her mounth on/around them. If she just flat out can't get to them they will cease to exist while a muzzle will frustrate her and make her figure out how to display that frustration.

Explain this:

Quote

She knows she is doing wrong.

What makes you think this? What's she doing? Might be the obvious clue you need.

stay safe.

skidmark

Antibubba · « **Reply #10 on:** November 11, 2009, 09:52:02 PM »

Quote

Crates are for dogs what Laz-e-Boys are for men.

Perfectly comfortable, keeps anxieties at bay, and allows the owner of the critter to get on with life without having deal with as many of the destructive tendencies and annoying habits of the roaming beastie.

There's a sig in there somewhere.

Harold Tuttle · « **Reply #11 on:** November 11, 2009, 10:23:13 PM »

Steering wheels, Gear shifts and door handles all smell like mommy...

Leatherneck · « **Reply #12 on:** November 12, 2009, 04:44:53 AM »

Thanks for the advice. Frankly, I'm a bit surprised at the unanimity of opinion in favor of crating and against temporary muzzling. To be clear, Liberty has for some time chewed on Leatherness's steering wheel unless it was covered up with a shirt or jacket while she was doing errands. Yesterday was a much looked forward to trip to the river while I stopped for about 20 minutes at HD. And when I got back, she knew she had done something wrong before I even spotted the damage because she shied away in the far corner of the back seat. Normally, she can't wait to slurp my face any chance she can get.

Crating in wife's Expedition would be possible although there's limited room when transporting "stuff " as well as three dogs. In the pickup with a second-row half-seat, it would be near impossible.

I may take her with me to Lowes this morning and specifically cover the wheel and console and see if she remembers getting in trouble yesterday and avoids chewing. It won't be much of a fun ride because of the steady rain and winds we're getting here on the coast. Although she seems to actually enjoy the bad weather outside more than I do.

Thanks for the insights.

TC

280plus · « **Reply #13 on:** November 12, 2009, 10:06:52 AM »

FWIW, our dog, a black lab, felt most secure in his crate to the point where for a while he would only eat if he was locked in the crate with his food. Beleive it or not I think you were the one who told me this would work. He wouldn't eat and you recommended putting his food where he felt most secure. That was the crate. So the crate is not necessarily that bad as far as the dog is concerned. It may hurt you more than the dog.

lupinus · « **Reply #14 on:** November 12, 2009, 02:13:55 PM »

Quote

And when I got back, she knew she had done something wrong before I even spotted the damage because she shied away in the far corner of the back seat. Normally, she can't wait to slurp my face any chance she can get.

Let me ask, have you come back to the car before and scolded her for the damage? And was it while she was actively chewing or was she not chewing when she was busted and you scolded her for what she had done?

Let me use an even more common example, house breaking. Many people will find the dog has used the floor for the toilet, yank the dog over to it, and scold the dog. This does not tell the dog that using the floor as a toilet is bad, it tells that dog that pee or poop on the floor is bad. So the dog thinks nothing of continuing to use the floor as it's toilet only to get confused, scared, and anxious when it then sees the pee or poop on the floor. This is then misinterpreted as "guilt" and that the dog "knew it did wrong" when in reality it is only confused and scared of the poop/pee on the floor. Dogs a horrible at math and can not work out the 2+2 most humans easily reason out here.

Transferring that common example to your steering wheel, if you are scolding the dog for something she has done but is not actively doing, she is simply getting confused. So when you come back to the car and find a chewed up steering wheel and scold her you are telling her that a chewed up steering wheel is a bad thing, but she has no idea that chewing it in the first place is the bad thing. So that "guilt" is likely fear and confusion over something she knows to be bad, the chewed steering wheel. Also it sounds like her reaction to stress is chewing. So if she continues to get further stressed the problem is likely to only get worse, not better.

To really show her that chewing the wheel is bad she needs to be caught in the act of doing it and corrected while she is actually chewing the steering wheel. So first part of my plan is simple, if you come back to the car to find damage but she isn't actively chewing do nothing. Ignore it and ignore her. This will help relieve fear in a chewed steering wheel and as she learns chewing the wheel is bad teach her being good and not chewing gets a warm greeting and chewing gets her ignored.

Second part is controlled training sessions. In order to truly train her to not chew, you have to catch her chewing so she can be corrected immediately so that she learns that the act of chewing is bad. The simplest way to do this is the same as any other training, recreate the situation in a controlled environment. In this case I'd figure a way to get her in the car, make her think I wasn't there, and correct her when she started chewing. Perhaps put her in the car in the drive way and walk away, take a few minutes to circle around the house, and stand behind the car or something so she doesn't know you are watching. Wait for her to chew, approach from a blind spot, and tap the glass to catch her attention while giving a firm NO. Once she stops and settles, simply rinse and repeat. Also note how long it normally takes her to start chewing. If she's normally chewing in, say, 2-3 minutes give it about double that time and if she doesn't chew come back and reward her with a warm greeting and a small treat for being a good girl. Depending on her attention span keep training sessions fairly short, about 15-20 minutes each so the training itself doesn't tire or stress her.

Chrissy · « **Reply #15 on:** November 12, 2009, 03:44:38 PM »

I take care of animals for a living and I can tell you that crating the dog during non-active times is NOT cruel. If you do it correctly and only crate the dog at night or for short periods of time, they even learn to love their crate and consider it a comfort. As the dog gets older and finishes the chewing stages, you can even leave the crate open and you will see the dog will probably go in there on its own to sleep/rest. BUT....if you're using it as a punishment or the dog is in there constantly, this IS cruel. Nothing wrong with crating a dog overnight or for a few hours while you have to run to a store. They use that time to sleep anyway. Depending on the dog, you can put a few items in there that it can chew on, but I caution you to know your dog - if the items you put in there can be swallowed or she chews too fast and can get the pieces lodged in her throat, then don't put anything in the crate. Same with bedding. If she destroys the bedding, don't put it in there and leave the tray bare. Most dogs chew out of boredom because they aren't exercised enough. The more you play with the dog and tire her out, the more she'll sleep when you have to crate her.

As far as the dog chewing the steering wheel, I was wondering why you take the dog to the store and leave it in the car anyway. Why not just leave the dog at home if its going to destroy your car? Puppies chew. Some more than others. If you see your dog is a huge chewer, then get her lots of dog toys to chew on, praise her when she's chewing on her own toys, and replace them when she destroys them. Eventually she should grow out of this stage. If you must take the dog to the store and leave her in the car, how about bringing a nice big bone to keep her busy while she's waiting? Or crate the dog in your car so she can't chew anything. The trick to outsmarting a dog is you have to be smarter than the dog and beat her at her own game.

If she does "this," then you do "that" to counteract what she does.

this"

Leatherneck · « **Reply #16 on:** November 13, 2009, 07:14:31 AM »

Thanks for the deeper insights, Chrissy and Lupinus--very thought-provoking.

Quote

I was wondering why you take the dog to the store and leave it in the car anyway. Why not just leave the dog at home if its going to destroy your car?

Not an option. We were on a much looked-forward two-hour trip to the river house for a long weekend. The dogs know and anticipate "Going to the beach" for days in advance. I simply had to pick up some building material for the weekend.

As far as associating my scolding with the act of chewing, they were proximate: the spit was still warm on the steering wheel and it was a cold rainy day. But your caution is noted, and it's something I learned a while ago. Dogs are the original short-attention span theater.

TC

Ex-MA Hole · « **Reply #17 on:** November 13, 2009, 07:35:40 AM »

In case no one has mentioned it, I'd try a crate.

Monkeyleg · « **Reply #18 on:** November 13, 2009, 09:54:07 AM »

We had a problem with our first fox terrier (this was 28 years ago). She ate or chewed everything: the oak baseboards, oak door frame molding, my wife's pantyhose, plastic toys, a very expensive steak, even a complete .357 cartridge that dropped out of my reloading press. My wife was carrying the steak in a "doggie" bag, and the dog flew through the air, snatched the bag and disappeared under the bed. As for the .357 round, we just waited for nature to take its course.

Crating helped for the chewing problem, although the dog hated it, as she seemed to regard it as punishment. The other problems went away with time. Much time.

BlueStarLizzard · « **Reply #19 on:** November 13, 2009, 06:49:51 PM »

the other dog proffessional says get a crate already.

trust me, a crate trained dog makes life easier in so many ways...

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Author Topic: Help. Omnivore Lab puppy! (Read 2859 times)