Software advice - database and custom forms

[Brad Johnson]

I'm trying to help out a local non-profit and need some help.  I need to set up a client tracking database that will cover, oh..., probably 25-30 data points.  That's not a problem, I could do that in Excel.  However, they also need to be able to generate forms from the data - custom forms set up in specific formats for state-required recordkeeping and reporting.  Finally, the interface MUST be very intuitive, user friendly, and massively idiot-proof.  The staff at this place, while extremely nice, is very technologically challenged and has been known to delete entire databases without understanding what they've done.

Is there a product out there that will allow for name-customized data fields, for scanning a document in with the intent of setting it up for automated population of the text fields, and is able to do so with information from the database?  It will also need a fair amount of flexibility for sorting data.  Think something on the order of an attorneys office for the clients, but with form-specific reporting like you'd have with some kind of government office.

Thanks in advance!
Brad

[Thor]

MS Access creates customizable fields and, don't hold me to this, but will work with some forms. I'm not an Access person, but as I recall, it was pretty flexible. It works right well with Excel.

[Paddy]

Take a look at the Quickbooks lineup, Brad.  There should be something there that will work very well for your application.

[Hawkmoon]

Alpha 5

[RevDisk]

I'm trying to help out a local non-profit and need some help.  I need to set up a client tracking database that will cover, oh..., probably 25-30 data points.  That's not a problem, I could do that in Excel.  However, they also need to be able to generate forms from the data - custom forms set up in specific formats for state-required recordkeeping and reporting.  Finally, the interface MUST be very intuitive, user friendly, and massively idiot-proof.  The staff at this place, while extremely nice, is very technologically challenged and has been known to delete entire databases without understanding what they've done.

Is there a product out there that will allow for name-customized data fields, for scanning a document in with the intent of setting it up for automated population of the text fields, and is able to do so with information from the database?  It will also need a fair amount of flexibility for sorting data.  Think something on the order of an attorneys office for the clients, but with form-specific reporting like you'd have with some kind of government office.

Thanks in advance!
Brad

MS Access may fit the bill.  Ideally, I'd recommend SQL.  But you're probably going to need to hire a programmer to set it up.  You'll need someone to set up the software, set up the input mechanisms, some backup/grooming setup and then form generation stuff.  You could try to do it, but seriously if there are legal ramifications, hire a professional.


Sorry, pet peeve. Excel is not a database program.  I cringe any time I see a department using it like it was.  Sigh.  It should be hardcoded to smack you if you use more than 300 rows or columns. 

[Paddy]

MS Access may fit the bill.  Ideally, I'd recommend SQL.  But you're probably going to need to hire a programmer to set it up.  You'll need someone to set up the software, set up the input mechanisms, some backup/grooming setup and then form generation stuff.  You could try to do it, but seriously if there are legal ramifications, hire a professional.

It's a freaking non-profit.  They don't have the money for that.

Sheesh. 

[RevDisk]

It's a freaking non-profit.  They don't have the money for that.

Sheesh. 

He specificed "state-required record keeping and reporting".  I'm guessing it's manditory forms required by law in order to keep their tax free exemption and prove they're not violating laws on how they spend their bucks.  While I realize most non-profits are under tight money, they'd be under even more of a handicap if they lost their tax exemption because of losing their records or whatnot. 

I've worked with a lot of small companies and non-prof's that have gotten themselves in a lot of trouble because they went DIY and then lost all their data because of lacking backups, computer crashes or whatnot.  IRS was less than pleased in most of the cases.  A lot of professionals will do the work for reduced rates (or free under some circumstances) for non-profits.  It wouldn't hurt to ask around rather than dismiss it out of hand, Riley.

[Paddy]

Quite obviously, RevDisk, you are neither an Accountant, nor up to speed on current Accounting software.   I am both.

http://quickbooks.intuit.com/product/accounting-software/nonprofit-accounting-software/?lid=site_sub_header

[RevDisk]

Quite obviously, RevDisk, you are neither an Accountant, nor up to speed on current Accounting software.   I am both.

Fair enough.  I'm not a beancounter, I'm just a network/systems/server geek for an aerospace corporation.  And I have donated time to small nonprofits setting up their systems. 

[Paddy]

I'm sorry for shouting.  I know you mean well, but it doesn't help to steer folks like this into some obscure piece(s) of software that require an IT person to set up and run, and has no real documentation or support.

The software I linked to is widely used, supported, and understood. It is industry specific, and more likely than anything else available to be compliant with reporting/tax law.  The company, Intuit, is the single largest provider of tax software, Lacerte, so they know what they're doing.  The initial cost will undoubtedly be much lower than trying to cobble something together that may or may not work.

Again, I apologize for my kneejerk reaction. I've spent too much corporate time trying to deal with IT people. 

[Brad Johnson]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

Quickbooks would be great.  If they were reporting for financial reasons.  Unfortunately, they are reporting on client interests. 

This is for a battered women's shelter.  Internally they have to keep very detailed records on their clients.  That's the user-friendly data entry and idiot-proof maintenance I was talking about.  Then they have reporting, which is a massive headache.  And it's not financial reporting, either.  That would be relatively easy.  It's things like number of admissions, client services, counseling, follow-up, etc..  In addition to the public and private philanthropic groups there are the local, state and federal agencies, each of which requires slightly different data on an agency-specific form.  Everyone wants to know what their donations and grants are doing.

They see an average of 300 clients a month with an average daily occupancy of around 150.  Each one of those clients currently generates a handwritten contact page.  Every contact for that client generates another entry on that page.  Each entry has between 7 and 20 categories that are scored or tracked.  From these entries the shelter has weekly, bi-weekly, monthly, quarterly, and on-demand reports they have to generate.  They have a staff of volunteers that do nothing but shuffle paper, tallying entries and generating the reports.  We are trying to automate that so they can track, sort, and report using a single database.  Oh, almost forgot to say, the reporting requirements change.  A lot.  The software needs to be flexible enough that you can custom design output based on combinations of data points.

Think something on the order of a client tracking and billing package for an attorney's office, but customizeable for data labels and field descriptions, with the ability to sort nine ways from Thursday, and able to handle custom field positions or to scan forms and designate custom fields for printing reports.

Brad

[Hawkmoon]

Alpha 5 is the easiest to use, programmable, relational database program available. It costs a lot less than Access, it's easier (MUCH easier!) to use, and it's just as powerful. And it may already include a "canned" database that you can use for your purposes with minor tweaking.

Alpha 5 also has a very loyal group of developers using it who have a network, and who would probably be willing to help you get something up and running for a non-profit organization if you can't handle it.

[Thor]

No offense intended, as i am merely relaying information. Not ever hearing of Alpha5, I did a Google search on it. The first thing that popped up was; "Alpha 5, Don't Bother" and a link to another database program.
http://www.caspio.com/l/cbo/default01008876tS.asp

Not know either one of them, I can't honestly judge them.  Access is ok, but it IS a PITA to set up.

[Hawkmoon]

No offense intended, as i am merely relaying information. Not ever hearing of Alpha5, I did a Google search on it. The first thing that popped up was; "Alpha 5, Don't Bother" and a link to another database program.
http://www.caspio.com/l/cbo/default01008876tS.asp

Not know either one of them, I can't honestly judge them.  Access is ok, but it IS a PITA to set up.

Did you happen to notice that the Caspio link is a SPONSORED link? Best recommendation is when the competition calls you out and wants to be compared to you.

Alpha 5 is the way to go.

http://www.alphasoftware.com/

[Waitone]

If you've people who can drive Word and Excel you've got the makin's of a reporting system.  Regardless of the system you use, the organizaton will need some level of computer smarts.  Absent that, you're talking yourself into another job.  Been there and done that.

[Paddy]

Quickbooks would be great.  If they were reporting for financial reasons.  Unfortunately, they are reporting on client interests.

Ask the government agencies what the other women's shelters use to meet the reporting requirements.  Why try to re-invent the wheel? 

[RevDisk]

I'm sorry for shouting.  I know you mean well, but it doesn't help to steer folks like this into some obscure piece(s) of software that require an IT person to set up and run, and has no real documentation or support.

The software I linked to is widely used, supported, and understood. It is industry specific, and more likely than anything else available to be compliant with reporting/tax law.  The company, Intuit, is the single largest provider of tax software, Lacerte, so they know what they're doing.  The initial cost will undoubtedly be much lower than trying to cobble something together that may or may not work.

Again, I apologize for my kneejerk reaction. I've spent too much corporate time trying to deal with IT people. 

Ask the government agencies what the other women's shelters use to meet the reporting requirements.  Why try to re-invent the wheel?

 

Tis ok, I get kneejerk reactions from spending too much time with the users.   


I'd argue with ya over the obscure portion, as neither Access nor SQL based databases are rare.  I'm somewhat familiar with Intuit as my mom uses it as a tax accountant, but unfortunately not the technical nature of how their software works.  I'd just make sure that there is some way of verifying that the data is being backed up on a regular basis and the information can be relatively quickly restored if anything bad happens.     

But I do strongly second the notion of asking the other shelters in the area what they use.

[Tallpine]

FWIW, many years ago back in Neanderthall times, I wrote a DOS based application for this very purpose.  Designed and coded an entry page with reverse color entry fields and everything (this was without object oriented code).  It just had a single report format but others could have been added.

I can't see how an acct s/w could be of any use for this purpose, unless somehow you could coerce the "job" or "cost center" type features into storing and reporting the client information.  (Anyway, real NPO s/w runs into the 4 digit$.)  And I have a 4-yr acct degree (graduated top of my class) but I shucked all that for software development. 

Something like MS Access would work of course, but the trick is knowing how to set it up.  First you have to know what you want to do and how to do it, and then know how the software works.  Me, I think I could write a C++ windows application from scratch faster than using Access.

[Paddy]

I think the last two posts demonstrate what the hell I'm talking about.  Most of us just want a tool to do a specific job as a means to an end.  You computer/geek/IT/programming people think the software is the end, no matter how many bugs it has or how long it takes.

For example, you're cruising along, preparing financial reports, or account analysis or whatever you're doing.  The system freezes up, locks up, or crashes completely. You may or may not lose your work. You call IT.  They start with the 'try this' 'try that' 'try the other thing'  They're totally mystified, but at the same time convinced it's MY fault.  They want to know what I did. They want to know the exact sequence of keystrokes leading up to the crash.  How the hell do I know?  I'm concentrating on the job I'm doing.

Just fix the frickin' tool so that it works for me.  You're 'support' personnel. So support.

[Brad Johnson]

Quickbooks would be great.  If they were reporting for financial reasons.  Unfortunately, they are reporting on client interests.

Ask the government agencies what the other women's shelters use to meet the reporting requirements.  Why try to re-invent the wheel? 

Unfortunately, these folks are kind of a leader in the industry.  There are few, very few, independent shelters this size anywhere.  Most of those have an in-house IT person.  The ones who do use a commercially available software package commonly use Access with a LOT of tweaking.  I was trying very hard not to have to do that since I will be the one they call for changes and database maintenance.  It would be so very much simpler if I could find a product already available (and that had an 800 number for support if there was an issue, which there will be).

Brad

[grislyatoms]

As a twinkie-munching, full-size pickup driving, fatass IT nerd, I can help you with Access, if you like, Brad. I am not an expert with it but we use a couple Access db 's I created here at work on a daily basis. My direct supervisor is an expert with it.

Lemme know.

[Brad Johnson]

Thanks for the offer, Gris.  Much appreciated.  Still mulling the possibilities...

Brad

[Tallpine]

Most of us just want a tool to do a specific job as a means to an end.  You computer/geek/IT/programming people think the software is the end, no matter how many bugs it has or how long it takes.

Well, then - go write your own **** software 

[Racehorse]

Either Excel or Access will work well for what you're talking about. I've created some pretty idiot-proof spreadsheets and databases using both. Excel has userforms you can program in VBA and then you can lock down the spreadsheet to keep them from screwing it up. Access is designed for almost exactly the kind of small database you're describing and is better in terms of security and controlling who has rights to do what. I'd be happy to help out with either one.

[Paddy]

Sounds like you're going to need somebody to design a set of templates for Access. Fortunately, that should be a one time job, not an ongoing mother hen nightmare.

Hard to believe the state would place such onerous reporting requirements on a women's shelter.