Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Ben on August 31, 2019, 08:53:44 AM
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Okay, I know I just made a crack about asking for opinions at APS, but here I am asking for another: Nail guns.
I know nothing about them, but think I need/want one. Years ago, I switched from a hammer and nails to a drill driver and construction screws, but after just finishing up my new reloading room, I think I'm sick of screws for that kind of project. Too often, I have to drill pilot "starter" holes for the screws, and it all just takes a lot of time.
What I think I would want one for is basic framing plus stuff like plywood sheathing. Maybe also hanging lighter paneling type material for walls. Can the same gun be used for framing and finishing, or would I need a finishing nailer for the lighter stuff? I think 80% of what I would use one for would be the framing/plywood, for constructing small outbuildings for example. I have no needs for heavy use of a nailer - maybe a few projects/repairs throughout the year.
Would a Harbor Freight one do as an occasional use tool?
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My limited experience says you would need one for framing and one for finishing.
I don't have a framing nailer but I do have a finish nailer and a stapler. I think they are both Hitachi.
I had a Campbell Hausfeld brad nailer but after a few years it gunked up inside from sitting too long and became a paper weight.
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My limited experience says you would need one for framing and one for finishing.
I don't have a framing nailer but I do have a finish nailer and a stapler. I think they are both Hitachi.
I had a Campbell Hausfeld brad nailer but after a few years it gunked up inside from sitting too long and became a paper weight.
Would things like plywood sheathing be considered framing or finishing for a nailer? If one gun could handle 2x4 frames + plywood, I'd be happy with that to start and then possibly look at a finishing nailer down the road. Or maybe adequate finishing nailers aren't as expensive as framing nailers?
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I have a Porter Cable framing nailer that I bought online, refurbished. Haven't used it in a few years so I don't remember if it uses clipped-head nails or full-round heads. (some local building codes don't like clipped, so I probably have the round ones) It works good. I agree with getting a separate finish nailer.
Harbor Freight has some framing nailers that look good for less than $100 when they have a coupon. Don't know if they are any good or not. Might be worth a $79 or whatever it is gamble.
Would things like plywood sheathing be considered framing or finishing for a nailer? If one gun could handle 2x4 frames + plywood, I'd be happy with that to start and then possibly look at a finishing nailer down the road. Or maybe adequate finishing nailers aren't as expensive as framing nailers?
I think a framing nailer would do that. You'll just use 2 different size nails.
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No. You want different guns for framing and finishing, if by finishing you mean trim, door casings, etc.
Instead of getting a nail gun if you don't have all that much use for it, consider a palm nailer.
They're cheaper and, unless you're building something, I find them to be a lot more useful.
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Instead of getting a nail gun if you don't have all that much use for it, consider a palm nailer.
They're cheaper and, unless you're building something, I find them to be a lot more useful.
Never heard of one, but will check the interwebz. :)
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As was said, different guns. I have a HF stapler/finish nailer and it'a a POS. Under powered and proprietary metric weird staples that can only be had at HF. I still have it only because I wouldn't wish it on anyone trying to complete a job, but I bought a Hitachi to replace it.
I've used crap framing nailers and they also sucked. Wouldn't consistently sink the nails flush, double tapping, and in one case the safety wasn't actually working. (That'll wake you right up with poor trigger discipline. My framing nailer is an ancient Paslode I was given as payment for helping a buddy build a garage. It's heavy, but great. Pull the trigger, one nail in flush. Every time.
This is one of the tools I'd buy a good one. Either hit pawn shops looking for pro nailers meth heads stole and pawned, or get the best one at the box store. Whichever one you get, make sure you can get nails for it easily. They aren't universal. Nail strips are surprisingly pricey if you're used to just grabbing 1 lb boxes of nails.
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https://www.cpooutlets.com/factory-reconditioned-porter-cable-fr350br-22-degree-3-1-2-in--full-round-head-framing-nailer-kit/pcbrfr350br,default,pd.html
https://www.cpooutlets.com/factory-reconditioned-hitachi-nr90ads1-hitachi-nr90ads1-3-1-2-in--paper-collated-framing-nailer/hitrnr90ads1,default,pd.html#xsell=hitrnr90ads1--2
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:Sigh:
Another reminder of how old I am. I saw the title of this thread and my immediate thought was "Ramset" (powder-actuated fastener). I was well through reading Ben's opening post before I realized he was asking about air nailers, not powder actuated nailers.
I still do a modest amount of carpentry around the homestead. The house is almost 70 years old -- it's to be expected. As and architect and building inspector I see air nailers all the time. It has never occurred to me to buy one. Don't like 'em, don't want anything to do with 'em.
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With my current remodel project, I am screw gunning my framing, I have a couple DeWalt 20v drills, with the right screws and driver head, I find it easier than using a hammer and nails. Granted all I am doing is stick building inside framing non load bearing walls as I finish my basement. If I was going to actually build something I would step up to a framing air nail gun.
I do have this finish air nail gun and I have ran over 2000 finish nail through it without any problems. https://www.amazon.com/BOSTITCH-SB-2IN1-Narrow-Stapler-18-gauge/dp/B00005JRLV
I wanted to be able to staple if I ever needed to do it. Haven't needed it yet.
I also have this air compressor in my basement to run it, very quiet.
https://www.amazon.com/California-Air-Tools-8010-Compressor/dp/B00WM1VPKE/ref=sr_1_3?gclid=CjwKCAjwtajrBRBVEiwA8w2Q8HR9nt03dv6VhVS0oh6kGUyl002m6ARXts_sgM8KO1Q9gvfwYcjFVRoCDRcQAvD_BwE&hvadid=177772145654&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9017973&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t1&hvqmt=e&hvrand=12677108875404737703&hvtargid=kwd-50509556507&hydadcr=1669_9901583&keywords=california+air+tools+compressor&qid=1567282777&s=gateway&sr=8-3
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Ben , I have done some remodeling so I am not a pro but I have 3 different air nailers and find them useful. I have a porter cable framing nailer that does 2x4's and plywood but not paneling. You can look and see what range of nail sizes the tool uses. I have a finish nailer for thin panelling and for trim work. I finally bought a roofing nailer which was a godsend. You need to have the compressor and hoses for the set up to work so you have to figure the cost of those in to your final costs. . There are ones that use butane? or batteries? and you don't need the hoses. The tools make framing/roofing faster and easier on your body. You can do more with 1 person because you can hold the work in 1 hand and the tool in the other. Ive done 2 roofs, resided my house built a shed and a garage and recommend air nailers especially if you have a lot of remodeling in your future plans. . Pete
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So from input so far, it sounds like one thing I need to decide is if I will have enough projects, and big enough projects in my future to make it worthwhile?
To what Pete and Charby said, ease of work is certainly a big factor. I went from hammer and nails to screws and a driver because I found it way less tiring than swinging a hammer, plus easier when I'm lining stuff up. I was thinking a nailer would make it easier yet. Plus make the work go faster. Again, no experience, just guessing.
Also I wanted to get the nickname "Ben the Nailer" (for the Stephen Hunter fans). :laugh:
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Actually that palm nailer Mike spoke of looks interesting. Next time I'm at Home Despot, I'm gonna check those out too.
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So from input so far, it sounds like one thing I need to decide is if I will have enough projects, and big enough projects in my future to make it worthwhile?
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OR...
Do you have enough money, or lack of patience, to say, "F it" I'm buying it anyway.
If you have the means, then do it. No point in dying with a fat savings account.
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Well, after watching some videos, I'm getting a Ridgid palm nailer for sure. I'm always running into tight spots when fixing stuff, so that's gonna be useful no matter what. Kinda wish I would have known about those a few years ago.
I'm still going to consider a nail gun, because one thing I noticed when building my reloading room is that my shoulder and elbow on my drill arm were really starting to bother me towards the end. I haven't really had that in the past. I'm thinking a nail gun will be faster, plus allow me to use my right arm for support, vs holding a screw or nail, and it might make things easier on my old guy body.
But the palm nailer first. I'm gonna buy it next week to play with.
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If you think your drill bothers you, be sure to test the heft of an air nailer at the store before you buy. And don't forget to factor in the weight of a coil of nails, plus a few feet of air hose. If I were a production carpenter on a commercial framing crew, I would want an air nailer for the speed. As a weekend warrior, I don't want anything to do with them.
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If your projects might be infrequent check the manufacturer of your cordless drill to see if they have nail guns that would work for you.
I’m knee deep in the Ryobi 18+ already. If I ever need a frame nailer they make one for the battery pack.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I don't know squat about nail guns, but it made me think of The Wire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDpvkwBBu6U
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... and now Ben starts looking up full-auto powder-activated nail guns online.
(like a mother *expletive deleted*er)
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Only framing nailer that I’m familiar with are the Paslodes.
Pros: you don’t need an electrical+compressed or source since they run on gas combustion
They have good consistent power.
Cons: they are a bit slow to use
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Yes paslode are the nailers that don't need an air hose. I have the same nailer that cxzvbob posted but I bought it new. I whole heartedly recommend them especially at 139$ how can you go wrong? I can get people saying hammers are the way to go as I own 2 1911s but my elbows cant tolerate days of hitting nails. For framing and plywood the bigger one works great. Pete
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If you have to do a lot of hammering, I HIGHLY recommend one of the Stanley Fatmax Anti-Vibe hammers.
It uses some sort of tuning fork in the hammer body to reduce vibration shockwaves that would travel up your arm.
I thought they were a gimmick until I used one I bought on Woot to nail fence boards for a day and a half. It made a HUGE difference.
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Only framing nailer that I’m familiar with are the Paslodes.
Pros: you don’t need an electrical+compressed or source since they run on gas combustion
They have good consistent power.
Cons: they are a bit slow to use
Paslode is a brand, they have several styles of cordless, and corded/hosed nailer. Mine uses an air line from my compressor.
I haven't actually seen a combustion nailer in the store for a while. They might have moved on in favor of Lion cordless models.
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I don't know squat about nail guns, but it made me think of The Wire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDpvkwBBu6U
Why didn't Snoop just keep a Dewalt battery plugged into a charger in the car?
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If you use a nail gun, be sure to use adequate hearing protection.
Some are loud enough to cause ear damage.
I know a man who got hyperacusis from a nail gun noise.
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Well, I bought the Ridgid palm nailer yesterday, and have been using it this morning on a few of the final things on the reloading room, mostly 2x4s plus 1/2" plywood for various shelving.
I like it. I think it's much easier than a drill driver and screws. I did some practicing with scrap wood first, and had a bit of a learning curve. 16D and 8D nails are no problem. Using 6D nails however, I'm still mangling them 50% of the time on their way in. I don't know if that's all me, or if the palm nailer is designed for heavier nails.
Regardless, sure wish I'd purchased one of these earlier. It's making me think I might want the nail gun too.
Side note: Harbor Freight air hose accessories suck. I bought (forget the brand) a variety pack of airhose accessories when I bought my new compressor a few months ago. They were the more expensive ones at the store. They are leaky and I find the quick connects somewhat unreliable. I'm gonna have to buy some brand name accessories.
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I have the Paslode Fuel nailer that I bought in the 90s. Good solid nailgun. When the framers were building the new house, they used palm nailers on the hurricane clips. Those have short, fat nails.
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You're welcome.
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A framing nailer will shoot 16's, (3 1/4") down to 6's (2") good for general construction, 2x, sheathing, pallets , etc. 16 gauge nailers shoot 2 1/2" finish nails, but do leave a pretty big hole- OK for tract houses. 18 gauge brad nailers shoot -2" finish nails,then you go to the fine finish guns- for furniture. The 23 gauge are real treat-with stainless steel headless pins it is astounding what a guy can nail without splitting- tiny little work.
In a wood shop, one of the unsung used of a nailer or stapler is to make rapid , one time use jigs and fixtures.
A framing nailer is heavy, it has too be or the recoil would break you. The nice thing is there is little shock- framers elbow in painful and takes a long time to recover from.
And ditto the ear and eye protection- those nails can come out at strange angles- do not hold near where you are nailing- they can bend into a U and come out next to where they went in.
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"Using 6D nails however, I'm still mangling them 50% of the time on their way in. I don't know if that's all me, or if the palm nailer is designed for heavier nails."
Some palm nailers can be "powered down" for use with smaller nails. Not all, though.
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Side note: Harbor Freight air hose accessories suck. I bought (forget the brand) a variety pack of airhose accessories when I bought my new compressor a few months ago. They were the more expensive ones at the store. They are leaky and I find the quick connects somewhat unreliable. I'm gonna have to buy some brand name accessories.
I made that mistake, too. Ended up getting a full spate of Milton products and threw the HF junk in the scrap metal bin.
An associated, musing... My brother has converted all his stuff to high-flow fittings. Amazing the difference it makes in air-hungry tools like impact wrenches.
Brad