COVID-19/corona virus mega thread/prepping thread

[Perd Hapley]

 In the end, we have only the rights we are willing to die, and kill, for.
 That is the only thing that stops the expansion of power. 
 All the rest, the law, the courts, is all window dressing.

How so? The courts have been used countless times to secure rights people hadn't been able to exercise before. You're saying those people were all willing to shed blood or be killed for those rights? How do you know that?

[Angel Eyes]

CBS's lazy journalism doesn't change anything. 

It isn't merely lazy.  It is deliberately dishonest.

Ditto for using Knob Creek footage and claiming it was shot in Syria or rigging a pickup truck with incendiaries.

[bedlamite]

https://idahonews.com/news/coronavirus/93-year-old-woman-using-powers-of-the-internet-to-keep-beer-stocked-during-pandemic

[tokugawa]

How so? The courts have been used countless times to secure rights people hadn't been able to exercise before. You're saying those people were all willing to shed blood or be killed for those rights? How do you know that?

 History shows it clearly. IN the end, they have to be willing. They may not have been willing, and got a favorable ruling. But eventually, courts are corrupted by the powers to their own ends.  They may be a stop gap measure, AS long as the law is respected. Power respects power- nothing else.

[RoadKingLarry]

How so? The courts have been used countless times to secure rights people hadn't been able to exercise before. You're saying those people were all willing to shed blood or be killed for those rights? How do you know that?

We have a number of "boxes" we use to protect and defend our rights.

The soap box
The ballot box
The jury box
And in the end, as a means of last resort if all of the above fail:
The ammo box.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants” - Thomas Jefferson.

[Perd Hapley]

Alan Gura, inter alia, forced the state of Illinois to recognize the right to carry a gun - not in the ideal, permitless, Constitutional carry style, but people in Illinois can now exercise a right they previously could not.

Were Alan Gura and associates willing to die for that? Were they willing to kill? How would we know?

We could do this with plenty of other cases. Hobby Lobby, Citizens United, etc.

[RocketMan]

 In the end, we have only the rights we are willing to die, and kill, for.
 That is the only thing that stops the expansion of power.  
 All the rest, the law, the courts, is all window dressing.

Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of folks around willing to water the tree of liberty.  Most people have been beguiled by promises of free stuff and false security.

[ConstitutionCowboy]

We have a number of "boxes" we use to protect and defend our rights.

The soap box
The ballot box
The jury box
And in the end, as a means of last resort if all of the above fail:
The ammo box.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants” - Thomas Jefferson.

We need ammo boxes in the beginning, too. The soap box, ballot box and jury box are all built out of empty ammo boxes.

Woody

[tokugawa]

Alan Gura, inter alia, forced the state of Illinois to recognize the right to carry a gun - not in the ideal, permitless, Constitutional carry style, but people in Illinois can now exercise a right they previously could not.

Were Alan Gura and associates willing to die for that? Were they willing to kill? How would we know?

We could do this with plenty of other cases. Hobby Lobby, Citizens United, etc.

 I cannot speculate on their commitment.  The courts conceded.
 What you seem unwilling to contemplate is the courts, and all the organs of the state, refusing to recognize "rights".
 As a primer, I would suggest "One day in the life of Ivan Densisovich", and "the gulag archipelago".
 
 I did not say we are there yet- but IN THE END , rights are obtained not by courts, but by men and women who are willing to die for them.

[Angel Eyes]

[Andiron]

Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of folks around willing to water the tree of liberty.  Most people have been beguiled by promises of free stuff and false security.

The worse thing is all of the Karens willing to dime out any business they claim isn't necessary.  We don't need a Gestapo,  we've got the bones of one via facebook.  Willing participants.

[Ron]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says?fbclid=IwAR1UAp4wMrlTpi0gVE0uZ4m6zOfwHBOGJcqwj_b9D9NOrr-pr8ZRMW6GV-o


Very few healthy people die from the China Virus.

[Jamisjockey]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says?fbclid=IwAR1UAp4wMrlTpi0gVE0uZ4m6zOfwHBOGJcqwj_b9D9NOrr-pr8ZRMW6GV-o


Very few healthy people die from the China Virus.

Serves Americans right for being so unhealthy then?  Obesity alone has been identified as a comorbidity factor, and almost 40% of Americans are considered obese.

[Perd Hapley]

I cannot speculate on their commitment.  The courts conceded.
 What you seem unwilling to contemplate is the courts, and all the organs of the state, refusing to recognize "rights".
 As a primer, I would suggest "One day in the life of Ivan Densisovich", and "the gulag archipelago".
 
 I did not say we are there yet- but IN THE END , rights are obtained not by courts, but by men and women who are willing to die for them.

So you:

1. admit you were wrong, and I was right
2. make up some baseless nonsense about me
3. give me homework, as if I didn't just school you

How about no?

[dogmush]

Serves Americans right for being so unhealthy then?  Obesity alone has been identified as a comorbidity factor, and almost 40% of Americans are considered obese.

I mean....Kinda?

I'm all for personal freedom, and if people want to be (and can afford to be) land whales then rock on with your bad self.  But that choice comes with consequences, one of which is being more susceptible to diseases and overall less lifespan. 

The choice to live healthy has consequences as well, but different ones.  Each person makes their own choice, and deals with the fall out as best they can.

[Ben]

So you:

1. admit you were wrong, and I was right
2. make up some baseless nonsense about me
3. give me homework, as if I didn't just school you

How about no?

I think you might be over-reacting a bit in your response. Rereading the sub-thread, to me at least (i.e., IMO), Tokugawa was not talking about now, but stating worst case scenario responses that may have to be made to a completely corrupt government. We're not there (yet). People don't have to resort to pulling their pistols. Courts mostly work, and where they don't, as a society, we're at a point where we don't care enough, or it's not important enough to us, to respond with violence to protect our rights.

We always talk about lines in the sand here, where everyone has their own about when to get sporty. People are fat and happy and chillin' with Netflix, so as a society we're a long way from "Unintended Consequences". If someday, under President Cortez, our courts start to turn into University sexual assault tribunals, either laying low and staying under the radar, or taking up arms for our rights and freedoms, may be the choices. Or just going along with the new status quo, which plenty of other societies have done.

Courts and (US) government work to protect our constitutional rights until they don't. Then we can appeal and win, or appeal and lose. Then we can accept that result or not. However, as the very last resort, when everything else has failed, how else to protect your unalienable rights (besides flying under the radar) other than with a fight?

[DittoHead]

For the purpose of creating conflict and confusion, some in the Fake News Media are saying that it is the Governors decision to open up the states, not that of the President of the United States & the Federal Government. Let it be fully understood that this is incorrect. It is the decision of the President, and for many good reasons. With that being said, the Administration and I are working closely with the Governors, and this will continue. A decision by me, in conjunction with the Governors and input from others, will be made shortly!

I'm curios what he thinks he can do to "open up the states", especially if governors are opposed to it.

[tokugawa]

So you:

1. admit you were wrong, and I was right
2. make up some baseless nonsense about me
3. give me homework, as if I didn't just school you

How about no?

 Actually, no, I do not admit you were right. You are being obtuse, and refusing to recognize where freedom comes from. As additional reading I suggest the Declaration of Independence.
 
 Every tyranny has the Rule of Law. Every Jew was killed under the Law of the Reich. All the prisoners in the Gulags there under the Law and the Courts.   All of us , are always, one law from being criminals.
 
 It's not like this is a weird concept  I just came up with.  Well, it is if you have modern American teachers, maybe, but though out the world, and throughout history, it has been widely accepted.
 
 In fact, it is the sole reason we have a Second Amendment. To enforce liberty, by killing tyrants.
 
 There is lot's of mumbo -jumbo about this, it's not "nice", not PC, offends the sensitive, but it is the truth.

 


 
  

[MechAg94]

I'm curios what he thinks he can do to "open up the states", especially if governors are opposed to it.

I think if the FedGov issues recommendations to reopen things, State Governors will be under a lot of pressure to do in their state unless they are having particularly serious issues with the virus.  I don't think the Feds should or need to force anything. 

[Jamisjockey]

I'm curios what he thinks he can do to "open up the states", especially if governors are opposed to it.

Taking away the disaster declaration would take away access to federal funding.  The smart thing to do would be to roll it into state by state declarations in talks with the governors and health departments of those states. 

[Perd Hapley]

You are being obtuse, and refusing to recognize where freedom comes from.

Refusing to recognize what now? Based on what that I said, exactly? I'll expect an answer on that about the same time you tell me how I'm "unwilling to contemplate" that the courts don't always get it right. I tried being civil with you, but all I got for it was you making up stupid things about me. Keep your absurd straw men at least six feet away from me, please.

As for the rest of your blather, I already told you to quit giving me homework. Here's something for you to work on.

Actually, no, I do not admit you were right.  

Then why, in response to a few obvious examples that contradicted your overblown rhetoric, did you go from this:

In the end, we have only the rights we are willing to die, and kill, for.
 That is the only thing that stops the expansion of power.  
 All the rest, the law, the courts, is all window dressing.

to this?

I cannot speculate on their commitment. The courts conceded.

You admitted that the courts are not "all window dressing," and that the stuff about being willing to kill or be killed is just, well, window dressing.

Now leave me alone.

[RoadKingLarry]

Refusing to recognize what now? Based on what that I said, exactly? I'll expect an answer on that about the same time you tell me how I'm "unwilling to contemplate" that the courts don't always get it right. I tried being civil with you, but all I got for it was you making up stupid things about me. Keep your absurd straw men at least six feet away from me, please.

As for the rest of your blather, I already told you to quit giving me homework. Here's something for you to work on.


Then why, in response to a few obvious examples that contradicted your overblown rhetoric, did you go from this:

to this?

You admitted that the courts are not "all window dressing," and that the stuff about being willing to kill or be killed is just, well, window dressing.

Now leave me alone.

I refer.you to my signature. You're illustrating it well.

[Larry Ashcraft]

My younger brother from Q-Town said last night that the NM governor has ordered liquor stores closed.  That's not going to end well.

Unless, the ones on the reservations are not affected.

[Ben]

My younger brother from Q-Town said last night that the NM governor has ordered liquor stores closed.  That's not going to end well.

Unless, the ones on the reservations are not affected.

They left them open here as "essential" specifically because they are state liquor stores, bringing in state revenue. Apparently several other states with state stores did the same thing.

[RocketMan]

They left them open here as "essential" specifically because they are state liquor stores, bringing in state revenue. Apparently several other states with state stores did the same thing.

NC did the same thing.  And yes, we've gallantly contributed to the state's income during this trying time.