Bush equates Iraq with Vietnam

[Perd Hapley]

Now the military actions in Iraq and Afghanistan are red tape and bureaucracy?  Don't drink and post. 

Red-tape and bureaucracy has its place.  But it can't do the job all by itself.  Which is pretty much what you suggested. 

[Paddy]

Now the military actions in Iraq and Afghanistan are red tape and bureaucracy?

Yikes, I feel like I'm in a parallel reality. You referred to my 'plan' to beef up borders and monitor communications as:

Riley, I already agreed with you that the borders should get more enforcement (which will use up some body-bags, mind you).  But think about what you're saying.  You're content to let red tape and bureaucratic mumbo-jumbo keep al-Qaeda out of the country?

which completely excluded military action in Iraq.  That's what I've been objecting to for umpteen pages, military action in Iraq.

Red-tape and bureaucracy has its place.  But it can't do the job all by itself.  Which is pretty much what you suggested.

For starters, that's what I said.  I ain't done yet.

Have you had your tap water checked lately?

[Perd Hapley]

No sir.  I referred to, uh, just what I referred to. 

When I spoke of dealing with terrorism 'over there,' I referred to all our pro-active anti-terror programs occurring outside CONUS.  From Afghanistan to Iraq to Pakistan to the Philippines, and everywhere else our military, intelligence, diplomats and bureaucrats are dealing with terrorist threats.

As you can clearly see, my comment excluded anything going on in the U.S. 

Now, let's see how you can totally misconstrue this post.  Have fun.   

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

Yawn...

[Paddy]

I referred to, uh, just what I referred to.

Your communications are as nonsensical as those coming from the Whitehouse.  Look, I understand you'll continue to support this misadventure in Iraq until the bitter end. Unfortunately, it appears that outcome will be much like Vietnam, only more dangerous for us.  The notion that we can somehow settle 1200 years of murderous bad blood (and that's just between the Sunnis and Shia, there are other factions at work in Iraq, dontcha know) and bring a western style democracy to a tribal Asian country is, well, deluded.  Most of us out here in the real world understand that and have given Mr. Bush more than ample opportunity, and money, and lives and blood to fulfill his dream.  Unfortunately for all of us, it ain't gonna happen. So when the whole stinking mess collapses in utter chaos and genocide, all you sycophants can blame the rest of us, just like y'all did over the U.S. defeat in Vietnam.

Bush is gonna walk away from all this at noon on January 20, 2009 and leave it for someone else to clean up. Thanks.

[Perd Hapley]

Snarky comeback deleted.

How about we just save it for the next Iraq thread, Riley? 

[The Rabbi]

Aw geez.  Not this *expletive deleted*it again....

[Perd Hapley]

Due to lack of an ignore feature, I'm going to try and do it manually. 

[Monkeyleg]

Keep it civil, please.

[Ezekiel]

Keep it civil, please.

I've seen no significant uncivility.  Did I miss something?  (Beyond attempts to justify our failed policy.)

Heck, even THOSE arguments were offered with a modicum of taste...

[Paddy]

How about we just save it for the next Iraq thread, Riley?

I'm good with that

 

[Monkeyleg]

Ezekiel, a couple of comments bordered on personal attacks. I know that this is a divisive subject, and that emotions run high. So far, though, APS members have, for the most part, been polite.

My comment was intended to keep the debate polite.

Now, though, I see that Riley has interjected something new.

[CAnnoneer]

The parallels between Iraq and VietNam are the shenanigans in Congress. The Iraq war has never been a military war. Like VietNam, it's been a political war, with one party using the troops to gain momentum for the next presidential election.

That pretty much sums it up.

The same people that voted for the war and embraced it as a chance to show spine and would have thumped their chests and taken credit if things had gone well immediately, are the same people that have spent the past several years criticizing the administration and undermining the military in an effort to be proven right in their pessimism. Political games at the expense of national interests. Any sane self-respecting electorate would have gotten rid of such human pollution a long time ago. Instead, the trash gets reelected.