Author Topic: No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?  (Read 2491 times)

Ben

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« on: May 17, 2006, 06:24:57 PM »
This kinda blew me away because until I read the article, I had no idea there were places, let alone whole states, where you're not allowed to pump your own gas. I guess I could expect it for NJ, just like I wouldn't be surprised if they passed a law here in CA (there are some self / full stations, few and far between). But Oregon? I thought you guys were more self sufficient up there. I can't imagine making someone pump my gas for me (though I can see it for elderly, handicapped, etc.). In fact wth self serve at the Albertsons, Walmart, Home Depot, and bank,  I'm loving being able to self serve most aspects of my life.

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http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/20060517/ts_usatoday/njjustsaysnotopumpinggas

Wed May 17, 7:01 AM ET

It's a rainy morning at the Thomas A. Edison Service Area on the New Jersey Turnpike. Lines of idling cars and trucks stretch through a Sunoco station. But for Ardis De Los Santos, there's at least one thing to smile about - she doesn't have to pump her own gas.
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She used to live in New York, where she had no choice. But a move across the Hudson River to Englewood, N.J., freed her from the hassle. She likes it that way. "It's not my cup of tea," she says of filling her tank. "It's the smell."

In New Jersey, motorists who need to fill 'er up haven't pumped their own gas in 57 years. But in the face of soaring gas prices, Gov. Jon Corzine came up with a novel plan last month to try to ease the pain: allow self-service at some stations along the New Jersey Turnpike and see if prices dip. He believed prices could drop 5 to 7 cents a gallon.

Corzine retreated after about 1,400 e-mails and calls poured in from a mostly outraged public. Concern about other state issues paled in comparison. A proposal to raise the sales tax by one cent, for example, received about 200 responses from the public, says Brendan Gilfillan, a spokesman for the governor.

So Corzine isn't going to push it. "He still thinks it's a worthy idea," Gilfillan says. "But with our budget, property taxes and ethics, there are just a number of things that are a bigger priority."

By now, full-serve is as ingrained in New Jersey's culture as the subway is in neighboring New York - though it seldom includes the oil checks and windshield washing of yesteryear.

Oregon is the only other state to bar self-service stations, and there are no plans for change. "The governor has concluded that there's no evidence that throwing thousands of people out of work would have any effect on gasoline prices," says Lonn Hoklin, spokesman for Gov. Ted Kulongoski. "Oregonians just seem to like the way it is now."

As do many lawmakers, station owners and motorists in New Jersey. Critics of a shift to self-service say pumping their own gas would be especially hard on the elderly, could create a safety hazard as inexperienced motorists try to fill their tanks and cost many station attendants their jobs while doing nothing to lower prices.

Assemblyman Francis Bodine, a Republican, says that after stopping at self-service stations in the South recently, he found that gas in New Jersey was the same price or slightly cheaper. "So I don't see any economic savings to having to pump your own gas," he says. "The flip side of it is ... there'd be some job losses." Besides, he says, "If I'm in a tux going to a black tie (event), I don't want to stop and handle a gas pump."

Bill Dressler, executive director of the New Jersey Gasoline Retailers Association and Allied Trades, says there are safety concerns. While attendants are trained, many motorists would be novices. "It could be put in the wrong container," says Dressler, whose group represents about 2,200 of the state's 3,800 gas stations. There could be "somebody getting out and smoking and they didn't turn the engine off."

Dressler says that prices also would not drop. "The dealers are not making that much money," he says. "What would happen is the self-service price would reflect what's full-service today, and full-service would escalate 10 to 15 cents a gallon."

Not so, says Jim Benton, executive director of the New Jersey Petroleum Council, which represents the state's major energy suppliers.

"New Jersey has the third-lowest motor fuel tax in the nation," he says. "People don't realize that while New Jersey gasoline is typically cheap, it's not because of a full-service requirement, but because of our low motor-fuel tax. There's no reason to suggest that prices would not be in fact even cheaper" at self-service pumps.

One morning this week, the price for regular at the Sunoco Station at the Thomas A. Edison Service Area, was $2.87 a gallon. Even so, Amanda Darian, 18, didn't think it would be worth pumping her own gas, even if it saved her 5 cents a gallon.

"A nickel? Nah," says Darian, a student at Monmouth University in West Long Branch.

Even though she's going to have to work more this summer to pay her gas tab, she says, "I just don't want to get out" of the car. She has been to other states, and when it came time to fill up, "I didn't even know how."

Louis Rivera, 29, an attendant who has worked at the Sunoco station for three years, says self-service could put "a lot of people ... out of jobs."

Others don't get all the fuss. "Even some men don't want to get that smell on their clothes," says Angela Fields, buying gas at a Delta station in Bloomfield, N.J. "But if it's going to save you a quarter, yeah, I'll pump my own gas."
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Standing Wolf

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2006, 06:39:15 PM »
The trouble with self-service filling stations is that the pump jockey often does a mediocre job on the windows.
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jefnvk

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2006, 06:52:54 PM »
Quote
Even though she's going to have to work more this summer to pay her gas tab, she says, "I just don't want to get out" of the car. She has been to other states, and when it came time to fill up, "I didn't even know how."
Ranks right up there with the girls that don't know how to unlock a door with anything but the remote.

There are still full service around here.  I can only think of one off hand that is only full service, though.  Can't really stand the thought of someone else pumping my gas, I have a hard enough time letting someone else change my oil or work on my car.
I still say 'Give Detroit to Canada'

grampster

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2006, 07:07:33 PM »
Swmbo does not pump gas!  She does not return bottles as well.

  She is the brightest, most perceptive person I have ever encountered and...she can smell Cognac in a sealed bottle wrapped tightly in a brown paper bag!  I watched her chase a can across the back yard with a Beretta Minx, afterwhich she said with a wink, "You mean like this?"  Let's not even discuss cooking, child raising, orderliness, perceptiveness, good taste, a vast emotional encyclopedia of every thing that is pleasing to man, the ability to spend money, and a heart given over to prayer.

Jefnvk, you gotta quit pigeonholing women.  Otherwise you'll miss the best of the bunch.  Listen to me.
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chaim

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2006, 07:27:03 PM »
I've been in NJ and had to get gas, no self service.  At first it seemed nice, a throwback to another decade (when I was a kid) and most gas stations were full-serve.  Well, after a few times of them topping off the gas tank after it stopped automatically (even though EVERY car owners manual says not to) I no longer like it.  It seems that the excess gas causes trouble with a part of the emissions control system (at least in my Hyundai) and since the owners manual specifically says not to do it this can cause your warranty to become voided.  The dealer claimed to be able to tell if this is the reason the part failed because the gas has nowhere to go and the part will have a lot of gas in it.  Lucky for me, when the part failed I had only gassed up in NJ a few times, the dealer asked me if I ever topped off (I said I didn't, because I never did), and they didn't see any gas in the part, so it was covered.  However, the knowlege that this can cause damage, and even if it doesn't it can cause there to be gas in a part that gas can damage, and it will void the warranty, has greatly soured me on full-service gas stations.

Anyway, as for the "why"...I'm guessing it has something to do with forcing gas stations to provide more menial jobs for low/no skill workers.
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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2006, 07:36:54 PM »
Quote
Oregon is the only other state to bar self-service stations, and there are no plans for change. "The governor has concluded that there's no evidence that throwing thousands of people out of work would have any effect on gasoline prices,"
I guess "the obvious" doesnt count as evidence. If you dont have to pay people to pump gas then you have less overhead. Some amount of that savings would be returned to the consumer due to competition.

I always hate driving through Oregon because the system there somehow makes full service more of a hassle than self service.

K Frame

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2006, 08:37:48 PM »
"It seems that the excess gas causes trouble with a part of the emissions control system (at least in my Hyundai)."

Probably the absorption canister. You flood it (it's designed to deal with fumes that otherwise would escape into the atmosphere) and it's an expensive fix.


Interestingly enough, whenever I was traveling in New Jersey, it always seemed to have gas that was a bit less expensive than PA, VA, or MD, even with the no self serve.

I remember pulling into a station years ago and hopping out and starting to pump my own gas. Guy walked up and said "Let me guess, you're not from New Jersey..."
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

Vodka7

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2006, 10:21:53 PM »
"Bill Dressler, executive director of the New Jersey Gasoline Retailers Association and Allied Trades, says there are safety concerns. While attendants are trained, many motorists would be novices. "

Oh, come ON.  I don't care if you never seen a gas station, a pump, or even a car.  If you can manage to read any of the two dozen stickers on every gas pump on the country I'm sure you can figure this one out.  The thing goes into the other thing.  Then you hold down the other other thing until it stops.  Then you pay.  Sometimes you pay first, but it will tell you if you have to.

Full service only gas stations are the only thing that make me more uncomfortable than a bathroom with an attendant.  Whose idea was it to hire a man whose only goal in life is to make eye contact and conversation in the men's room?  (Please, no pump or hose jokes. Thank you.)


Edited to add: right after making this post I remembered the woman who, just about a month ago, called me over to the next pump while I was filling up to ask me a question.  I get over, and she's got the diesel pump, which was covered in another dozen stickers, flopping around in her gas tank and wanted to know why it didn't fit right.

280plus

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2006, 12:34:33 AM »
Well, the funny part on all this is that when I was visiting NJ regularly even though they were pumping my gas it was still CHEAPER than it was in CT. I don't know if this is still true.
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CatsDieNow

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2006, 03:56:09 AM »
Quote
Ranks right up there with the girls that don't know how to unlock a door with anything but the remote.
Reminds me of the time I locked my brother inside my convertable.  The remote locks my doors and disables the power rocker lock switch (in case the top is down).  He gives me all kinds of grief because it was a hot day and he thought he would have to break a window to get out.

So I show him the little manual switch and explained, in the most condecending manner possible, how the little red square means that the door is not locked anymore.

TarpleyG

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2006, 04:18:42 AM »
Quote from: CatsDieNow
Quote
Ranks right up there with the girls that don't know how to unlock a door with anything but the remote.
Reminds me of the time I locked my brother inside my convertable.  The remote locks my doors and disables the power rocker lock switch (in case the top is down).  He gives me all kinds of grief because it was a hot day and he thought he would have to break a window to get out.

So I show him the little manual switch and explained, in the most condecending manner possible, how the little red square means that the door is not locked anymore.
BMW by chance?  That was one thing I thought was sorta cool/odd about it.  If I got out and locked the door from the outside with the key (I didn't have keyless entry), the button on the inside wouldn't open the locks.  That's good and bad I suppose.  You could lock your kids in the car and they couldn't get out.  What if it were by accident that you did this or what if the car caught fire?

Greg

CatsDieNow

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2006, 08:33:48 AM »
It's a Camaro, which is a 2-door.   Maybe yours has child locks in the backseat?

Mine has both the rocker power switch on the armrest, and a manual sliding lock by the door handle.  He apparently forgot about the sliding switch.  The power locks are the disabled ones - the sliders always work.

USP45usp

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2006, 12:52:52 PM »
Well, I wondered about that myself and here is what I was told:  About 8 or so years ago, when this law went into effect, it was taunted as a "safety" issue.  But if you dig down you will find that once again, government was behind it.

You see, the governor then had made a promise, that promise was to "create" jobs.  Well, he did (I think it was a he), he had the legislature pass this law so that wala, more jobs so he can say that he had "kept" his promise.

So, about .10 on the gas prices that we pay per gallon is going to help pay the attendants.  Hence why we have more expensive gas than allot of other states.

Once again, it was government that shafted the tax payer.

Wayne

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2006, 04:19:05 PM »
I'm in Minot, ND.  There's at least one station with full service, the price is 10 cents more/gallon.

BUT, if you have any claim to being handicapped at all, you pull into any manned station and honk your horn and they'll come out and provide service at no extra charge.

For those who claim there'll be all these problems:
A: Not all stations will transition overnight
B: The other 46-48 states don't have enough problems to make it matter.

Oh, and I remember reading that one state with this touts it as a safety matter, as gasoline is hazardous.

Yet, gas station operaters are neither specially trained nor certified.  Nor are they issued any PPE(personal protective equipment).  I mean, your average consumer pumping their own gas will be in the hazard, what 10 minutes twice a week, at most?   The attendents will be in that enviroment for 8+ hours a day, five days a week.

jefnvk

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2006, 06:21:07 PM »
Quote
Jefnvk, you gotta quit pigeonholing women.  Otherwise you'll miss the best of the bunch.  Listen to me.
There is a lot I gotta quit doing.  I do believe I was just told getting rid of the beard would go a long ways too, but I just can't quit having fun.

Ah, I'm sure tehre are dumb guys out there too.  Heck, I can name a half dozen that are as dumb.
I still say 'Give Detroit to Canada'

Sindawe

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2006, 07:07:13 PM »
Quote
I get over, and she's got the diesel pump, which was covered in another dozen stickers, flopping around in her gas tank and wanted to know why it didn't fit right.
Was she by chance a blonde? Wink

Would that the bright green diesel nozzle have not fit the time I tried to feed diesel fuel to one of my motorcycles!  DOH!  Fortunately this was at a fuel station right by my home, so I had just enough gasoline left in the bowls of the carbs to get home.  It took a tow to the shop later that week and a full day of work before anybody figured out what was amiss and why the bike would not start.
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elkhunter

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No Self-Serve Allowed? Who'd a Thunk it?
« Reply #16 on: May 19, 2006, 07:14:13 PM »
Hey- Meth addicts need jobs too don't ya know.

I lived in Oregon for about six years and for a while it did feel really weird letting some one else pump my gas.  What was even worse was when I would travel out of state, pull up to the pump and wait for 20-30 seconds for somebody to come over.  Then feel really stupid once I remembered that other states don't assume that the average consumer is too stupid to operate that nozzle thingy with the handle.

Quote
Yet, gas station operaters are neither specially trained nor certified.  Nor are they issued any PPE(personal protective equipment).  I mean, your average consumer pumping their own gas will be in the hazard, what 10 minutes twice a week, at most?   The attendents will be in that enviroment for 8+ hours a day, five days a week
That's always gotten me too.  Seem's that there were always jokes about how you could always tell someone who had been an attendant for awhile.  Had the appearance of being  a few crayons short of a box. Or maybe it was just the type of people that worked there anyway.