Author Topic: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy  (Read 6639 times)

brimic

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2015, 05:06:23 PM »
If you pump significantly more than it replaces, the ground compacts and can't retain as much water.

 

Worse, If I remember my soils class correctly- (Charby would be more up to date on this), if you pump aquifers dry, the bound up heavy metals also dry out and oxidize or otherwise leach into the water once those aquifers replenish, leaving you with contaminated water.
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Ben

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2015, 06:48:11 PM »
and I believe agriculture is above 80% of the water usage. At the moment, they're supplementing their water needs by pumping their aquifers dry. That's going to have some very serious long term consequences. If you pump significantly more than it replaces, the ground compacts and can't retain as much water.

Actual agriculture is maybe 60% of the 80%. When the .gov does the figuring, they include golf courses, local, state, and fed parks, and environmental applications as part of "agriculture". So all the water wasted on the Delta Smelt for instance, is considered "agricultural use".

As to sinking lands, there's a good recently released NASA report on it (I would have linked directly to the paper, but the stupid JPL site is not responding right now):

http://www.livescience.com/51943-california-sinking-faster-than-thought.html

Ag of course isn't the only problem in CA. When you have hoards of people migrating in, especially to the areas of the state that end up having to pump groundwater, and tons of new housing going up, you're not exactly helping the problem. Though again, a few strategically placed dams would have eliminated most of the kerfuffle. CA still needs to come up with some water use regs. We're the only state in the West that doesn't have them. Of course when CA regulators end up introducing them, they'll end up being 1000% more stringent than they need to be and probably kill farming in the state.
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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2015, 06:53:30 PM »
Do we really miss the benefits of the dodo bird and the carrier pigeon?  Did the ecology fail to recover from this deletion?

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RocketMan

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2015, 06:55:32 PM »
The three reservoirs they were talking about,  I think 30 years ago now,  had pretty extensive EIS research done.  They were good locations.  Certainly you don't want to put a dam any old place,  or divert surface water haphazardly. Something like diverting delta smelt water to humans would be a good cost / benefit though.

The delta smelt taste pretty crappy, so I say let the suckers die out.
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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2015, 07:08:24 PM »
The delta smelt taste pretty crappy, so I say let the suckers die out.

Plus there's only like less than ten left. They might as well catch them and breed them to larger numbers if they want to replenish the species.
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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #30 on: September 23, 2015, 07:15:26 PM »
Worse, If I remember my soils class correctly- (Charby would be more up to date on this), if you pump aquifers dry, the bound up heavy metals also dry out and oxidize or otherwise leach into the water once those aquifers replenish, leaving you with contaminated water.

And salts.
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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #31 on: September 23, 2015, 07:17:21 PM »
I read somewhere it wasn't so much the almond trees, but other agricultural crops that require a lot of water, such as alfalfa, cotton, citrus, corn, etc.

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Ben

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #32 on: September 23, 2015, 07:19:20 PM »
Citrus is drip irrigated.

Alfalfa and corn take a lot, since in most of CA, row crops are flood irrigated versus wheel lines, etc.
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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #33 on: September 23, 2015, 07:21:52 PM »
Citrus is drip irrigated.

Alfalfa and corn take a lot, since in most of CA, row crops are flood irrigated versus wheel lines, etc.

It isn't the method but the volume of water used.
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Ben

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #34 on: September 23, 2015, 07:36:26 PM »
The citrus guys didn't switch from flood to drip to use more water.
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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #35 on: September 23, 2015, 07:44:32 PM »
The citrus guys didn't switch from flood to drip to use more water.

Did the number of acres of citrus increase?
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Ben

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #36 on: September 23, 2015, 07:54:32 PM »
Did the number of acres of citrus increase?

How's that relevant to an individual farmer?
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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #37 on: September 23, 2015, 08:36:36 PM »
How's that relevant to an individual farmer?

Increase in planted acreage means increase in overall water consumption, whether it be one farmer or 100 farmers.
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Ben

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #38 on: September 23, 2015, 09:28:01 PM »
Increase in planted acreage means increase in overall water consumption, whether it be one farmer or 100 farmers.

And when they switch to drip systems, not only do their costs go down, but they use less water. Plus in the areas in CA we're talking about, an increase in trees = a decrease in cotton, corn, alfalfa, which is what fully 80% of current land planted in trees here used to be.
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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #39 on: September 23, 2015, 11:01:00 PM »
And when they switch to drip systems, not only do their costs go down, but they use less water. Plus in the areas in CA we're talking about, an increase in trees = a decrease in cotton, corn, alfalfa, which is what fully 80% of current land planted in trees here used to be.

How much of California Ag is reliant on irrigation? How much doesn't need any at all?
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MechAg94

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #40 on: September 23, 2015, 11:24:51 PM »
Maybe the Govt needs to start adding some additional chemicals to encourage crops that use less water.
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lupinus

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #41 on: September 24, 2015, 12:18:23 AM »
Or they could have actually planned for this and told the enviroweeinies to stfu and eat their tofu.


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mtnbkr

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #42 on: September 24, 2015, 06:35:24 AM »
Maybe the Govt needs to start adding some additional chemicals to encourage crops that use less water.

Like electrolytes?

Chris

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #43 on: September 24, 2015, 08:24:20 AM »
Maybe the Govt needs to start adding some additional chemicals to encourage crops that use less water.

Dow, Monsanto, DuPont and BASF are already ahead of the government.
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Sawdust

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #44 on: September 24, 2015, 10:26:36 AM »
Perhaps if people would change their landscaping to fit the climate of California and get rid of backyard pools?

The hell you say!

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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #45 on: September 24, 2015, 10:32:56 AM »
The hell you say!

From my cold, dead hands...

Ok, how about a big surge in property taxes because you have a pool?
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MechAg94

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #46 on: September 24, 2015, 10:36:42 AM »
Like electrolytes?

Chris
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never_retreat

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #47 on: September 24, 2015, 06:34:16 PM »
The hell you say!

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Sawdust

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #48 on: September 25, 2015, 10:21:23 AM »
Ok, how about a big surge in property taxes because you have a pool?

When the county deems the drought to be so bad that they cease to approve new water meter hook-ups, then we'll talk.

Besides, the pool uses less water than an equivalent amount (surface area) of lawn.

The rest of my property is being converted to drought-tolerant landscape as we speak.
Retain what's coming in; send off what is retreating.

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charby

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Re: Growing Number Believe California’s Drought Is A Government Conspiracy
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2015, 10:44:23 AM »
When the county deems the drought to be so bad that they cease to approve new water meter hook-ups, then we'll talk.

Besides, the pool uses less water than an equivalent amount (surface area) of lawn.

The rest of my property is being converted to drought-tolerant landscape as we speak.

How many gallons of water do you lose in the pool each day from evaporation? I live in a climate where a pool makes little sense since we really only have a 100 day window of use, so I don't know much about them.
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