Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Ben on November 21, 2017, 08:31:05 PM
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Well, okay then...
https://www.sciencealert.com/man-launch-himself-in-homemade-rocket-to-prove-earth-is-flat
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- 1800 feet? He could get higher with a Piper Cub.
- It's fairly simple to figure out that the same equations used to navigate on Earth will give much better results on a basketball than on a flat disc. Literally, not rocket science.
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$20 says he goes full lawn dart out in the desert.
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If he doesn't bring back turtle pics then we know it's not flat...
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Where do I put my $20 on the Lawn Dart?
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He built his first manned rocket in 2014, the Associated Press reported, and managed to fly a quarter-mile (0.4 km) over Winkelman, Ariz.
As seen in a YouTube video, the flight ended with Hughes being dragged, moaning from the remains of the rocket. The injuries he suffered put him in a walker for two weeks, he said.
And the 2014 flight was only a quarter of the distance of Saturday's mile-long (1.6 km-long) attempt.
And it was based on round-Earth technology.
I think Lawn Dart is the safe bet.
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If he doesn't bring back turtle pics then we know it's not flat...
[attachment deleted by admin]
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The optimist in me is hoping that he's just a guy who's really into rockets and trolling flat-earthers.
The cynic in me is expecting him to go all Kerbal Space Program and is getting some popcorn ready just in case. [popcorn]
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"atmosflat"
Cute.
<shakes head>
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$20 says he goes full lawn dart out in the desert.
Which will be PROOF that the government/illuminate/reptiles peoples are keeping it all a secret!
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Must be flat 'cause anywhere on earth that you drop something, it falls in the same direction.
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I wonder if this video is of his manned test flight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fp2q_dKuc-c
Nothing like betting your life on a surplus parachute that's full of holes. It's a miracle that chute held together long enough for the rocket to land.
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My $20 is on his pressure vessel failing before launch.
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You know, maybe I'm CRAZY here, but wouldn't a digital camera, locator beacon, and a weather balloon be a lot cheaper and SAFER for this purpose?
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You know, maybe I'm CRAZY here, but wouldn't a digital camera, locator beacon, and a weather balloon be a lot cheaper and SAFER for this purpose?
Somebody here posted a video a couple (or more?) years ago of a father/son project doing that with an iPhone. Super cool project and video, and as I recall, it got high enough that you could see curvature.
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Not sure steam would be my first choice for propulsion. Lots of ways that can go painfully bad. At least if solid fuel goes bad odds are high it won't hurt for very long.
My $20 is on his pressure vessel failing before launch.
One of the videos has him saying that launch pressure is 420psi, so not super crazy to get a vessel that holds it.
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I love that his rocket is steam powered. Gives it that Rube Goldberg flavor.
Anyway, it appears his goal is to take pictures miles above the flat disk we call home. Besides the balloons already mention, the manned and unmanned rockets that have already done this, wouldn't it be cheaper and safer (as if that's a concern) to just buy a ticket for a commercial flight and take pictures out the window at 40,000 feet?
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Oh man, PLEASE tell me that he hires out for kiddy parties!
"$20 says he goes full lawn dart out in the desert."
Nope. Not taking that action, but truth be told, I'm expecting him to blow up on the pad.
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Somebody here posted a video a couple (or more?) years ago of a father/son project doing that with an iPhone. Super cool project and video, and as I recall, it got high enough that you could see curvature.
And some other idiot strapped a gazillion supermarket helium balloons to a lawn chair and took a video of himself riding it to an altitude of a lot higher than I ever want to go in a lawn chair.
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I see it all as a valid path to the California Democratic governorship. A commenter mentioned that as one of his goals. And at the risk of characterizing groups of people, well... umm.... crazy California, you know.
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I've seen it stated that he doesn't believe in science. Well, a lot of science may be coming at you real fast guy.
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Looking at some of the pictures of that thing he calls a rocket, well, it's going to be a short flight ending in a big mess.
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Reminds me of the flap over the Phlogiston Theory of burning. There were some pretty avid devotees of that theory for a lot longer than you'd expect, given the overwhelming incoming tide of contrary evidence.
Experienced chemists who supported [the] phlogiston theory attempted to respond to the challenges suggested by Lavoisier and the newer chemists. In doing so, phlogiston theory became more complicated and assumed too much, contributing to the overall demise of the theory.[16] Many people tried to remodel their theories on phlogiston in order to have the theory work with what Lavoisier was doing in his experiments. Pierre Macquer reworded his theory many times, and even though he is said to have thought the theory of phlogiston was doomed, he stood by phlogiston and tried to make the theory work.[19]
Come to think of it, it also reminds me of certain Leftists. But that's another story of mental constipation.
Terry, 230RN
REF:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phlogiston_theory#Challenge_and_demise
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The Feds just suck the fun out of everything:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-flat-earthers-plan-to-launch-himself-in-a-homemade-rocket-just-hit-a-speed-bump/ar-BBFBwAe?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=TSHDHP
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A sort of "The Theory of Theories" video. Long, but interesting in terms of the fact-fitting structure of knowledge in general.
https://youtu.be/VNqNnUJVcVs (10:30)
I liked the crossword puzzle example, 8:20 ff.
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Phlogiston is one of the great words of all-time. Lousy theory, great word.
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Well, I like any word with a ph in it... like electrophoresis. Too bad they changed the official spelling of sulphur to sulfur. Drat.
Phosphorescence is especially nice since it has that silent c as well.
However, it seems like almost any time someone objects to an aspect of the flat earth theory, they come up with some kind of an explanation. Kinda fun, you ask me. Not that you're askin' me.
Terry
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Phosphorescence is good. One of my favorites is emerald. It might be because I love the color as well. So sound and color combine to make for a great word for me.
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Well, I like any word with a ph in it... like electrophoresis. Too bad they changed the official spelling of sulphur to sulfur. Drat.
Phosphorescence is especially nice since it has that silent c as well.
However, it seems like almost any time someone objects to an aspect of the flat earth theory, they come up with some kind of an explanation. Kinda fun, you ask me. Not that you're askin' me.
Terry
Whenever some place asks for my name (like a fast-food or the like), I tell them "Phred". Then spell it for them. Just to watch the vapor lock...
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Our old cat was named "Phredd" (Fred).
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The Feds just suck the fun out of everything:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-flat-earthers-plan-to-launch-himself-in-a-homemade-rocket-just-hit-a-speed-bump/ar-BBFBwAe?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=TSHDHP
They're just trying to keep us from learning the truth.
[tinfoil]
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Well since we're on lingo instead of Wunderkinder proving the earth is flat, I might mention that I love pronouncing anything to do with pneumatics as if the p were actually pronounced. (Fun in Harbor Freight, eh?) I also like to change the accenting on words. I pronounce "remote" as REM oh tay.
I used to have fun with Baseline Road up in Boulder, pronouncing it as "bahz-el-EEN-ee ro-AD."
Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm just a jerk. Waddaya gonna do?
Terry
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For a fun time, the next time you order fajitas pronounce them fah-jai-tas. I made an intensely religious man at my table choke on his ice water when I did that.
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Well since we're on lingo instead of Wunderkinder proving the earth is flat, I might mention that I love pronouncing anything to do with pneumatics as if the p were actually pronounced. (Fun in Harbor Freight, eh?) I also like to change the accenting on words. I pronounce "remote" as REM oh tay.
I used to have fun with Baseline Road up in Boulder, pronouncing it as "bahz-el-EEN-ee ro-AD."
Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm just a jerk. Waddaya gonna do?
Terry
If you ever go through Refugio, TX you might upset the locals.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poO2BsVGdIU
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Speaking of words....
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/3e/36/39/3e3639610e42fa867a21282210ec577d.jpg)
Pozzle winj konklemerg valecone bonferf.
Terry, 230RN
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Whenever some place asks for my name (like a fast-food or the like), I tell them "Phred". Then spell it for them. Just to watch the vapor lock...
(https://i.imgur.com/M2MBGOu.jpg)
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Well since we're on lingo instead of Wunderkinder proving the earth is flat, I might mention that I love pronouncing anything to do with pneumatics as if the p were actually pronounced. (Fun in Harbor Freight, eh?) I also like to change the accenting on words. I pronounce "remote" as REM oh tay.
I used to have fun with Baseline Road up in Boulder, pronouncing it as "bahz-el-EEN-ee ro-AD."
Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm just a jerk. Waddaya gonna do?
Terry
My-croff-o-knee for microphone is a favorite of mine. I use it at work now and again when I am fixing one of our radios.
I guess I'm a jerk, too. >:D =D
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My mom: "Dis coth que" for Discotheque
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So she's Spanish and not French?
The "que" would be pronounced in Spanish, but not in French.
A lot of things are silent in French, n'est-ce pas? Like in horse de overs, hors d'oeuvres ("or derv").
Que pasa with that?
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Grotesque = Graht'-es-kew
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Could have some fun with that:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/words-that-end-in-que#w15
I wondered what fique, the last word in that list was. (It's a plant fiber.)
So that prompted me to wonder what the nanny filter would do with fuque.
Ok... now I know.
Say, how's the flat earth rocket doing?
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Well, we're still unsure if the Earth is flat or not. =D
https://gizmodo.com/flat-earth-rocketeer-once-again-fails-to-launch-himself-1822712646
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IimQK_txr4M
I want one of those cushy jobs guarding the Antarctic wall at the edge of the Earf.
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Somebody here posted a video a couple (or more?) years ago of a father/son project doing that with an iPhone. Super cool project and video, and as I recall, it got high enough that you could see curvature.
I guess any time you have a short focal length lens, things off the optical axis look curved, don't they? "Barrel distortion," I think they call it.
ETA: Yep:
(https://cdn.photographylife.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Barrel-Distortion.png)
Depending on where in the image plane you place the horizon, you could make a case that the earth is bowl-shaped.
That would explain why you can't get near the edges, right?
Terry
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As the Southern Triumvirate will confirm, when I make restaurant reservations, I do it with the last name of Donner. Because NOBODY thinks you're serious when you use the name "Rambo".
;/ ;/ ;/ ;/ :P :P :P :P :P
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"you're" / "you are"
And yore first name is "Pass," right? As in "Donner, Pass?"
Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm just a jerk. Waddaya gonna do?
Terry
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"you're" / "you are"
And yore first name is "Pass," right? As in "Donner, Pass?"
Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm just a jerk. Waddaya gonna do?
Terry
He gets to be in the Donner party.
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He gets to be in the Donner party.
I don't see how that's a party...
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As the Southern Triumvirate will confirm, when I make restaurant reservations, I do it with the last name of Donner. Because NOBODY thinks your serious when you use the name "Rambo".
;/ ;/ ;/ ;/ :P :P :P :P :P
I had a guy walk by my house a few weeks ago when I was in the garage. His last name was Rambo and he was running for state legislature.
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"you're" / "you are"
And yore first name is "Pass," right? As in "Donner, Pass?"
Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm just a jerk. Waddaya gonna do?
Terry
I blame voice to text on my phone.
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I blame voice to text on my phone.
Meh. No biggie. I've just been feeling puckish, pickish and prickish the last couple of days. Impatient on minor faults. Must be something I et. You could have used "you are" with your "subordinate" to make it clear.
Yeah, I'm a jerk. Whaddaya gonna do?
Terry
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I guess any time you have a short focal length lens, things off the optical axis look curved, don't they? "Barrel distortion," I think they call it.
ETA: Yep:
(https://cdn.photographylife.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Barrel-Distortion.png)
Depending on where in the image plane you place the horizon, you could make a case that the earth is bowl-shaped.
That would explain why you can't get near the edges, right?
Terry
https://m.imgur.com/QMbxbHi
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Can we just shoot this guy out of a cannon and be done with it?
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Update:
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/mad-mike-hughes-flat-earther-who-built-his-own-rocket-comes-back-down-with-a-bump/ar-BBKFvaJ?ocid=spartanntp
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"It's got a bunch of story lines — the garage-built thing. I'm an older guy. It's out in the middle of nowhere, plus the Flat Earth. The problem is it brings out all the nuts also, people questioning everything. It's the downside of all this."
Now why would anyone question his mission or his theories?
Mr Hughes maintained that his mission is not to prove that the earth is flat.
"Do I believe the Earth is shaped like a Frisbee? I believe it is," he said. "Do I know for sure? No. That's why I want to go up in space."
This flight reached 1,875 feet. I'm pretty sure he could have easily beaten that with a Piper Cub, an airlight, or a lawn chair tied to a bunch of helium balloons. He has a way to go to reach "space."
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I thought the photo at the link was somewhat hilarious, since there's around an 800' hill behind him. :laugh:
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The cynic in me is expecting him to go all Kerbal Space Program
Stuck in a slowly decaying orbit for years while we try to get a rescue vehicle up to him, but at every attempt, the system automatically assigns all vacant seats to other Kerbals right before launch so there's never a spot for him?
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He reached an estimated speed of around 350 mph before pulling his parachute.
Math doesn't work. If he reached 350 MPH at any point, and if the propulsion stopped instantly right then, it would have taken 2.97 minutes for his vertical velocity to bleed off to zero. In that time, he would have climbed more than 15,000 additional feet beyond whatever altitude he reached before the power cut off.
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Math doesn't work. If he reached 350 MPH at any point, ...[snip]
Maybe that 350 mph was reached on the way back down? :rofl:
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Sounds like he had a rough landing. Which amuses me. Stupid is as stupid does..
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Maybe that 350 mph was reached on the way back down? :rofl:
d=1/2at^2
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Math doesn't work. If he reached 350 MPH at any point, and if the propulsion stopped instantly right then, it would have taken 2.97 minutes for his vertical velocity to bleed off to zero. In that time, he would have climbed more than 15,000 additional feet beyond whatever altitude he reached before the power cut off.
3 minutes of coasting/deceleration? That seems like too long.
To gain an additional 13,150 feet at 350mph would take about 25 seconds. 350mph = 1,848,000 feet/hr = 30,800 ft/min = 513 ft/sec.
13,150 feet / 513fps = 25.63 seconds.
I didn't take into account deceleration, because I don't know how, but I don't think the time will change from 25 seconds to 180 seconds. Maybe I'm wrong, but that long of deceleration/coasting time feels off to me.
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3 minutes of coasting/deceleration? That seems like too long.
To gain an additional 13,150 feet at 350mph would take about 25 seconds. 350mph = 1,848,000 feet/hr = 30,800 ft/min = 513 ft/sec.
13,150 feet / 513fps = 25.63 seconds.
I didn't take into account deceleration, because I don't know how, but I don't think the time will change from 25 seconds to 180 seconds. Maybe I'm wrong, but that long of deceleration/coasting time feels off to me.
Yep -- my math was off, too.
Acceleration due to gravity is 32 feet-per-second-per second. Deceleration is nothing but negative acceleration. Acceleration due to gravity is constant (albeit slightly affected by drag). If we ignore drag, we can look at it as how long it would take to go from 0 MPH to 350 MPH. The formula for velocity is V = at. Rearranging that, we get the formula for time: t = V/a
350 MPH is, as you calculated, 513 feet-per-second. Time required to go from 0 to 513 fps (or the opposite) at an acceleration of 32 feet-per-second-per-second is 513 = 32t.
t = 513/32 = 16.03 seconds.
Assuming constant acceleration (which gravity is), the formula for distance is d = 1/2(at^2) We now know the rate of acceleration and the time, so distance is:
d = 1/2(32 x 16.03^2) = 1/2(32 x 256.96) = 16 x 256.96 = 4,111 feet.
BUT ... the article said he reached a height/altitude of 1,875 feet, but he reached a velocity of 350 MPH. Granted, he didn't go straight vertical, but he landed only 1,500 feet from the launch pad. That's less than a third of a mile, so he went pretty much straight up. So either he didn't reach 350 MPH, or else he went a lot higher than 1,875 feet.
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I would support a "Go Fund Me" so he could build an even bigger
bomb rocket to get him to his desired altitude
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I would support a "Go Fund Me" so he could build an even bigger bomb rocket to get him to his desired altitude
That's actually a suspicion elsewhere, that he's doing the flat earth thing to get funding to feed his rocket habit.
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That's actually a suspicion elsewhere, that he's doing the flat earth thing to get funding to feed his rocket habit.
If so it's pretty genius. Although a pretty long way to go about it as wasn't this guy active long before Go Fund Me even existed?
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<mumble, mumble>
That's actually a suspicion elsewhere, that he's doing the flat earth thing to get funding to feed his rocket habit.
My impression, too. I'm surprised he didn't have a "Lucas" ad on it, as well.
(https://s100.iracing.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/JJRD-McGee_LucasOilcar-small.jpg)
I thought the math was odd, but let it go. It just didn't look right. No sense "disproving" what is fundamentally nonsense anyhow.
"Yeah, but wherever you go on the earth's oceans, the GPS altitude is the same. So the earth must be flat."
:facepalm:
I wonder where the boiler was and how that operated to get the steam pressure up.
I find it odd that nowadays, with everybody carrying a digital camera, nobody has released vids of the launch sequence including building up steam pressure.
That launch pic looked suspiciously like a run of the mill black powder-ish toy rocket from any amateur rocket meet, not a steam powered one. My suspicion is that any video would have shown a lingering exhaust BP smoke cloud, unlike a steam one, which would rapidly thin out.
https://youtu.be/LWxp8oXGlMA
A+ for advertising/propaganda effort, D- for "science."
01 April is coming up. Hughes for Governor !
<mumble, mumble>
Pic credits in properties
</mumble, mumble>
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https://youtu.be/QRZ90syG4Zs
Video of the most recent launch.
That might help with the math, as it looks like he deployed the parachute while still on the ascending portion of the flight, which would mess with the deccel and altitude numbers.
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You guys are applying round earth mathematics and physics to a flat-earth problem. Of course you're going to get it wrong.
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I find it funny that he could have gotten higher than he did by driving a car to a higher elevation. I guess riding a riding a rocket is cooler.
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I find it funny that he could have gotten higher than he did by driving a car to a higher elevation. I guess riding a riding a rocket is cooler.
He has been saying all along that this is just the preliminary test to get prepared for the big launch when he will prove that the Earth is flat. That is his story and he is sticking to it.
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He has been saying all along that this is just the preliminary test to get prepared for the big launch when he will prove that the Earth is flat. That is his story and he is sticking to it.
Nobody is going to believe a thing you say. Pilots flying around at 30K feet are in on both the "chemtrail" and the "Earth is round" conspiracies.
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He has been saying all along that this is just the preliminary test to get prepared for the big launch when he will prove that the Earth is flat. That is his story and he is sticking to it.
He needs to get a boat and try to sail off the end of the earth. I am sure there is some reason he can't do that.
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Nobody is going to believe a thing you say. Pilots flying around at 30K feet are in on both the "chemtrail" and the "Earth is round" conspiracies.
The Earth is real and chemtrails are round.
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He needs to get a boat and try to sail off the end of the earth. I am sure there is some reason he can't do that.
The edge is guarded. Can't get close enough.
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He needs to get a boat and try to sail off the end of the earth. I am sure there is some reason he can't do that.
I thought we all knew by now that the edge of the earth is ringed by re-education centers for the daring, free-thinking few who challenge orthodoxy.
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https://youtu.be/QRZ90syG4Zs
Video of the most recent launch.
That might help with the math, as it looks like he deployed the parachute while still on the ascending portion of the flight, which would mess with the deccel and altitude numbers.
I wonder why he popped the chute on the way up. It does look like that's what happened -- but I think if he was traveling anywhere near 350 MPH when the first chute deployed, the chute would have been ripped to shreds. And I think he popped the second chute too late for it to have had much effect.
And it didn't look like he landed anywhere close to 1500 feet from the launch pad.
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I wonder why he popped the chute on the way up. It does look like that's what happened -- but I think if he was traveling anywhere near 350 MPH when the first chute deployed, the chute would have been ripped to shreds. And I think he popped the second chute too late for it to have had much effect.
And it didn't look like he landed anywhere close to 1500 feet from the launch pad.
If you assume a spherical earth, your figures will just be flat wrong.
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It does look like that's what happened -- but I think if he was traveling anywhere near 350 MPH when the first chute deployed, the chute would have been ripped to shreds.
Top Fuel dragsters and higher classes at the salt flats do it all the time.
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Top Fuel dragsters and higher classes at the salt flats do it all the time.
Not with military surplus -1B's they don't. Which is what I'm pretty sure those are.
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I'm curious as to how he sat in the rocket. The rocket launched nose first and landed nose first. Either the launch or the landing was gonna hurt.
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Drag cars do it to drop that weight off right before the line. The big boys do everything to get an extra .001 off the run.
When running for class champ we would have just enough oil in the dry sump and lube in the rear end to make it a quarter mile.
jim
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https://youtu.be/AXT4pgW_UGk
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What if it turns out the Earth isn't flat but Phillips or worse, Allen?
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What if it turns out the Earth isn't flat but Phillips or worse, Allen?
Posi-Drive.
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Or worse, Whitworth...
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Torx for the win ...
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Unbelievers! Earth is not a screw, that it should move! Tis riveted!
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The Earth is real and chemtrails are round.
I knew it!! [tinfoil]
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Torx for the win ...
External Torx.
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Security torx
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What if it turns out the Earth isn't flat but Phillips or worse, Allen?
Who's Allen?
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Who's Allen?
W. G. Allen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_(brand)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgvR3y5JCXg
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We have an update to this story. Mike Hughes has launched his last rocket:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-51602655
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All sympathy to friends, family and fellow scientists. His impact will not be forgotten.
"It is difficult to reason a person out of a position he did not reason himself into."
Terry
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While the Earth might not be flat, it is mostly hard. He died living his passion - I reckon we should all be so lucky.
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https://spectee.com/detail/35394 (0:47)
See 0:28.
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Well at least he died doing what he loved: Ignoring the laws of physics.
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The earth may not be flat but he is.
Too soon?
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^ "Too soon?"
Oh, that concern entered my head, too, but I figured the ridicule had been going on since 2017 and the outcome was as pedicted by virtually all of us, so, meh, what the hell.
RIP old boy, but.
Kinda wierd that the chute had deployed on the way up on past attempts.
You'd think he would have addressed that problem by now.
Were there any "cockpit voice recorder" things recorded or transmitted?
I feel real sorry for those who had to blotter him up from the desert sands. Probably not pros at that. Ick. [barf]
Any estimates of his <ahem> terminal velocity? Should be roughly calculable from the video, no?
Terry, 230RN
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Dude forgot to check his staging...
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRSHzenjiNA
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As a FB friend said, Darwin Award winner for 2020 has already been decided. No way can this be bested...
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Sad thing is, if he got high enough, he died disappointed.
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The parachute that deployed on launch looked too small to be a main, and too large to be a drogue. He was quoted in a news article after an earlier flight that he had come down for a hard landing and got his bell rung.
All that makes me wonder if he just never put as much work into his recovery system as he did other systems of the rocket. Also, did he ever make any unmanned test flights to wring out any bugs? Good, solid parachute recovery systems can be engineered for something of that scale if you're willing to put the time and effort into it. And being a life-safety item, you'd better get it right. He didn't.
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The parachute that deployed on launch looked too small to be a main, and too large to be a drogue. He was quoted in a news article after an earlier flight that he had come down for a hard landing and got his bell rung.
All that makes me wonder if he just never put as much work into his recovery system as he did other systems of the rocket. Also, did he ever make any unmanned test flights to wring out any bugs? Good, solid parachute recovery systems can be engineered for something of that scale if you're willing to put the time and effort into it. And being a life-safety item, you'd better get it right. He didn't.
I thought I read a story that said the parachute enclosure took some damage on liftoff when it rubbed against the launchpad structure. Maybe he had multiple chutes but only one deployed?
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_fC4xXmVr8
This showed up in my youtube feeds.
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^
Sorry, but I wish that guy would structure his videos better. Clicked out at about 6 - 7 minutes on that one.
Extensive editing needed.
Got his poles mixed up at one point, too. See, I was paying attention.
<click>
Terry, 230RN
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^
Sorry, but I wish that guy would structure his videos better. Clicked out at about 6 - 7 minutes on that one.
Extensive editing needed.
Got his poles mixed up at one point, too. See, I was paying attention.
<click>
Terry, 230RN
Fair point. I don't watch a lot of his videos, but it jumped out to me after seeing this thread.
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Hughes' rocket was possibly a hydrogen peroxide-catalyst-powered steam rocket engine.
Concentrated H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) decomposes violently into steam and nascent oxygen on contact with certain catalysts such as KMnO4 (potassium permanganate).
This reaction was used to drive the steam turbine which ran the alcohol and LOx pumps on Germany's V-2 rocket.
The hydrogen peroxide antiseptic you can buy over the counter is only about 3%, but putting it on a wound produces the same reaction, as shown by the bubbles of oxygen generated. (The oxygen is highly reactive "nascent" oxygen, which is O before it links up with another O to form O2. Nascent oxygen is pretty destructive of germs.)
I am reporting this as an abstract of several sources. I cannot vouch for the validity of these sources.
Another possibility is that it was a true steam rocket, where superheated water is released through a nozzle and flashes into steam.
Terry, 230RN
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My understanding is that Hughes rocket was a thermal steam rocket. i.e. it used the expansion of water being converted to steam and pushed out a nozzle as it's reaction force. Whereas the V2 is a more conventional fuel and oxidizer being combusted in a chamber engine, using the peroxide generated steam just to drive mechanical [turbo] pumps.
So the two rockets used the same reaction in vastly different ways, with vastly different thrust. On the bright side, Hughes didn't have to design a combustion chamber and nozzle that could withstand several thousand degrees.
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^ Exactly right, as I have already described.
I haven't researched it recently, but I believe at least one German Wunderwaffen was a small (antiaircraft?) rocket powered directly by that H2O2 decomposition, as was the Hughes rocket
This, as opposed to the rocket engines powered by hypergolic fuels.
If I recall correctly, the V-2's engine didn't have to withstand thousands of degrees in that sense. While the Verein fur Raumshiffarht (VfR, "Society for Space Travel") was originally experimenting with liquid fuel engines in the 1930s, somebody discovered that injecting a little bit of fuel (alcohol and water) in perforated rings high up in the combustion chamber would allow it to travel along the inside surface of the engine, keeping the actual metal relatively cool, especially at the nozzle throat, which was what usually burned through.
Again, IIRC, this was the main reason they used alcohol since it would mix with water (apart from the fact that gasoline was being used by the Luftwaffe.)
Willy Ley's "Rockets, Missiles, and Space Travel" was my original and authoritative source for these matters. That book disappeared when we moved to Colorado. He also commented in one of his works that most of the exhaust flame of the V-2 was due to this extra fuel burning when it exited the engine.
Werner von Braun was a prominent member of the VfR.
Terry, 230RN
edited to insert "allow it to"
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So did we figure out the shape of the earth yet?
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So did we figure out the shape of the earth yet?
Rosie O'Donnell shaped.
And mass for that matter
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Hey, dogmush continued it. I thought it was done at Reply #111.
The Earth's flat on this side, anyway:
(https://throughtheluminarylens.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/planet-earth-from-space-photo-source-technologybloggers-org_thumb.jpg?w=1500&h=838)
Don't know what it's like on the other side.
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Rosie O'Donnell shaped.
And mass for that matter
Afterthought, =D
"And mass for that matter."
Any sufficiently large celestial body must pull itself into a spherical shape, depending on the strength of the material and its density. This is generally considered to be around 113 million km3 for rocky bodies, IIRC.
The earth is certainly larger than that and therefore must be spherical.
This is not to say that Rosie O'Donnell's body is in any way celestial, or anywhere near 113 million km3. Or rocky.
Terry runs and hides since these posts are not "polite," being based on negative aspects of a real person's physical characteristics.
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https://twitter.com/PrussiaThird/status/1234444389063122944?s=20
Finally a better explanation of the disappearance of the dinosaurs.
I can't get Twitter or Chrome to let me copy the gif link directly.
This simulation of galaxies colliding was cool also.
https://twitter.com/evankirstel/status/1234256722761572352
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YT short that popped up in my feed
According to this it was all a con job to con flat earthers out of money.
Don't know which would be crazier, him being a flat earther building a rocket to prove the world is flat or him thinking he could build a manned rocket to space in his back yard. Maybe he watched Salvage 1 and thought hmm, I could do that.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/hwa2h9T8Iug?feature=share
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Afterthought, =D
"And mass for that matter."
Any sufficiently large celestial body must pull itself into a spherical shape, depending on the strength of the material and its density. This is generally considered to be around 113 million km3 for rocky bodies, IIRC.
The earth is certainly larger than that and therefore must be spherical.
This is not to say that Rosie O'Donnell's body is in any way celestial, or anywhere near 113 million km3. Or rocky.
Terry runs and hides since these posts are not "polite," being based on negative aspects of a real person's physical characteristics.
If she was a nice likable person I would agree to your final point. But she isn't a nice likable person is she?
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"Terry runs and hides since these posts are not 'polite,' being based on negative aspects of a real person's physical characteristics."
And as I said somewhere in this thread, the flat earth is provable since anywhere you go in the world, things still fall downward.
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The amount of flat earth noise in the right/alt right world has really been ramping up the last few years.
That and "space is fake and gay" show up in all the strangest places.
It detracts from my right wing conspiracy consumption enjoyment.
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The amount of flat earth noise in the right/alt right world has really been ramping up the last few years.
It detracts from my right wing conspiracy consumption enjoyment.
Honestly I think it's more of a case of people just trolling and also people exaggerating it so that they can make a YT video showing how much smarter they are than those dumb right wingers..
It appears our rocket man was trolling them for money
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Honestly I think it's more of a case of people just trolling and also people exaggerating it so that they can make a YT video showing how much smarter they are than those dumb right wingers
There is definitely a trolling aspect to it, I agree.
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Honestly I think it's more of a case of people just trolling and also people exaggerating it so that they can make a YT video showing how much smarter they are than those dumb right wingers..
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Ditto. I guess you woke up earlier than me this AM. I was going to say deliberate counterpropaganda and purposeful language distortion... for which they are getting famous.
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Ditto. I guess you woke up earlier than me this AM. I was going to say deliberate counterprop.
Youtube is full of them.
Been up for the past 3 hours
Rigel (the knucklehead cat of the bunch) don't let me sleep much past 6:30 or so which is actually fine with me because I hate sleeping late.
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Propaganda is what it is. There's a strong astroturfing machine dedicated to making the right look ridiculous by either promulgating absurd conspiracy theories, or dredging up genuine elements of the fringe and popularizing them. For example, during the vaccine controversy, the right didn't get any chance to put forth any reasonable good faith concerns about the virus, because all you could hear was bullhorns shouting autism, 5G, microchip implantation, and deliberate mass genocide theories.
It's a brilliant strategy because it drowns out legitimate opposition and also anyone on the fence or unsure will decide not to associate with the anti-vax movement even if they otherwise might have.
As always the right gets played like a fiddle this way and haven't figured out how to turn the tables or even figured out they're being played... often they just jump to defending the crazies.
Similar things are happening now by dredging up and harping on the worst elements of anti-abortion laws, with the same exact goals and results.
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Honestly I think it's more of a case of people just trolling and also people exaggerating it so that they can make a YT video showing how much smarter they are than those dumb right wingers..
It appears our rocket man was trolling them for money
There is quite a bit of this sentiment in the comment sections of various conservative blogs. While not a majority by any means, lots of folks are doing the flat earth. fake moon landing, 9/11 was an inside job and the towers were imploded stuff. From my perspective they are not trolling, they are from the lunatic fringe of the conservative right. Most of the lunatics are also blatant racists, which is rather sickening. As time passes it's becoming more difficult to read these blogs and their comment sections.
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There is quite a bit of this sentiment in the comment sections of various conservative blogs. While not a majority by any means, lots of folks are doing the flat earth. fake moon landing, 9/11 was an inside job and the towers were imploded stuff. From my perspective they are not trolling, they are from the lunatic fringe of the conservative right. Most of the lunatics are also blatant racists, which is rather sickening. As time passes it's becoming more difficult to read these blogs and their comment sections.
A lot of this is very reactionary. Consider the racism piece. There is a strong reaction to the flooding of the country with immigrants since 1965, particularly poor non white immigrants. Then there is the demolition of the cities through demographics. Many go straight to full on irrational racism of the other, bypassing what I consider the legitimate arguments of destroying the culture and mores of a country through massive immigration and "multiculturalism" ie state imposed monoculture of the empire.
The ongoing total collapse of social trust and rampant cynicism has large swaths of people questioning everything that is espoused officially. With good cause I think. Lies are the coin of the realm. When official sources tell obvious lies continually, even when they tell the truth about something it's questioned.
At this point the genie is out of the bottle and there is no going back IMO.
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This sums it up, it's all some type of weird humiliation ritual being imposed on us.
Liars to the left of me, crazies to the right.