Asus eeePC wireless problem

[mtnbkr]

My MIL got one of these little laptops for Christmas.  I'm trying to get it connected to their Motorola wireless router and am not having much luck.  With security completely disabled, it connects fine, but any amount of security (WEP, WPA-PSK, etc) causes it to not connect.  It sees the network but won't authenticate.  Yes, I have the right keys.  I disabled the MAC access control, enabled SSID broadcasting, assigned the IP info manually, etc.  No luck.  With DHCP enabled, the laptop claims there are no available leases and no DHCPOFFER.  With the IP set statically, it simply doesn't connect.

I've run all the updates. 

Any ideas?  Could the laptop just not like this router?  It works fine with my two laptops and my FIL's laptop.

Chris

[Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas]

Are you using a program other than windows to connect to the network? Only Windows works for me.

[mtnbkr]

The eeePC comes with Linux. 

I don't have experience with 802.11 and Linux since I mainly use Linux for servers, but a laptop sold with Linux and wireless should function.  It does connect if I disable all security.

Chris

[BrokenPaw]

How are you entering the wireless key?

Generally you have the option of entering your network key as a human-readable keyphrase, or directly as a string of hexadecimal digits.  For WEP (and, as far as I recall, for WPA/2) if you enter a keyphrase, it's  hashed to create a numerical key.

I have heard the rumour that different manufacturers can use different algorithms for the hashing, so the same keyphrase on a NIC and an AP from different manufacturers may not play well together.  For this reason, I always always use only hex-literal network keys.

As a stab in the dark, take a look on one of the laptops that will connect, and see if you can find the hex representation of your network key.  Feed that to the eee, and see if that works.

-BP

[mtnbkr]

How are you entering the wireless key?

Generally you have the option of entering your network key as a human-readable keyphrase, or directly as a string of hexadecimal digits.  For WEP (and, as far as I recall, for WPA/2) if you enter a keyphrase, it's  hashed to create a numerical key.

I have heard the rumour that different manufacturers can use different algorithms for the hashing, so the same keyphrase on a NIC and an AP from different manufacturers may not play well together.  For this reason, I always always use only hex-literal network keys.

As a stab in the dark, take a look on one of the laptops that will connect, and see if you can find the hex representation of your network key.  Feed that to the eee, and see if that works.

-BP

I've fed the key both ways. 

I just found a list of compatible peripherals at the back of the manual.  If my in-laws are willing to try another router, we may give that a try.

Chris

[Ben]

I've got the eee, and the only time I had this problem I used BrokenPaw's method and it worked. Otherwise I've actually been quite impressed with how the eee finds and connects to networks -- much more reliable than any of my windoze systems.

I HAVE had almost exactly your problem (on a friend's computer) and the only thing that ended up fixing it was switching to a different PC card -- it then found the secure network right away. If you have access to a USB network device, you might want to give that a try. Otherwise I asked for help here on my problem so you might want to check that thread out -- there were a lot of good suggestions (though I don't know if the thread exists in our current database).

[mtnbkr]

I tried one of the routers from their "approved" list and had the same results.  If I set the system to use DHCP, it claims it can't get a DHCP lease.  If I use static info, it fails to connect.  I've tried WEP, WPA-PSK (AES and TKIP).  The only way I've gotten a connection is to bypass any security and even that is spotty.  The router is across the room from the laptop and works fine with any other laptop (including the one I'm typing this from).

I've run all the updates I can find and have tried various command line methods to make it connect. 

I would call Asus tech support but they're closed until Monday and we'll be back home by then.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

no ideas?

I've reset the system to factory default and tried static ip info again (seems to help some people).

Damn tech support is closed till Monday (after we're back home).  So much for 24/7 support as described on the sticker predominately displayed on the case. 

Chris

[RocketMan]

Mtnbkr, are you using any non-alphanumeric characters in your key?  It is a normal thing to do to increase the security of the key.
However, I ran into a problem with an HP wireless printer not long ago that refused to connect to a customer's network using encryption of any form.  It behaved much like your eeePC, the symptoms were very similar.
It turned out that some of the special characters I had chosen as part of the key were not usable by the HP printer's wireless firmware.  When I began to suspect this was the problem, I made a test key with just a few letters and numbers, and no special characters.  Once I did this the printer connected right away with WPA2 TKIP security.
With a little trial and error I determined some special characters that it would accept and was able to come up with a fairly random key that would allow the printer to connect securely.
Try a simple key without special characters, see what happens.

[Vodka7]

Why not just leave wireless security off?

I had similar issues a few years back setting up wireless for my mom and her boyfriend, and ended up just turning security off before I had to leave.  As much as I like to be paranoid, the truth is that they live out in the middle of nowhere and their closest neighbors don't even own a PC.  Everything they do that needs to be protected (eBay, email, banking, etc) is already encrypted with SSL.

[zahc]

I used to have an eeepc and found the wireless hardware to be rather flaky. I did get it working and it did work, but at certain points it was just....flaky.

[Manedwolf]

Why not just leave wireless security off?

I had similar issues a few years back setting up wireless for my mom and her boyfriend, and ended up just turning security off before I had to leave.  As much as I like to be paranoid, the truth is that they live out in the middle of nowhere and their closest neighbors don't even own a PC.  Everything they do that needs to be protected (eBay, email, banking, etc) is already encrypted with SSL.

Do you know what wardrivers are? Also, someone miles away with a cantenna can tag onto it. It's not just that they can use your network (and get you in trouble if they download something very illegal), but they might even be able to break into your files.

That all said, my ever-functional WRT54G is set for WPA2, TKIP, and I have had perfect results with that. Laptops, a PSP, a Wii, and a wireless camera that seems to be running Linux all find it just fine.

Maybe update the wireless router firmware?

[Vodka7]

Do you know what wardrivers are? Also, someone miles away with a cantenna can tag onto it. It's not just that they can use your network (and get you in trouble if they download something very illegal), but they might even be able to break into your files.

That all said, my ever-functional WRT54G is set for WPA2, TKIP, and I have had perfect results with that. Laptops, a PSP, a Wii, and a wireless camera that seems to be running Linux all find it just fine.

Maybe update the wireless router firmware?

Yes, I know what a wardriver is, and you're greatly exaggerating the range of a cantenna under even the best of circumstances.  And just because an attack is possible doesn't mean it's anywhere near remotely likely.

But, since you like to be paranoid, you should know that TKIP is no longer secure, for a good two months or so now.  Switch to AES.

Or, realize the likelihood of being attacked with this new vulnerability is so low that it's not worth the trouble.

[Steak]

Easy fix. Throw it in the river, buy a Mac. No more issues.

[Manedwolf]

Easy fix. Throw it in the river, buy a Mac. No more issues.

It's smaller than the Air.

Sounds like they do need to work on customer service, though, or they'll sink their own product. It's sold at Target as a consumer item. That means they need to be on top of issues, or they're going to be dropped and only sold via catalog to hardcore experimenters again.

[RocketMan]

Easy fix. Throw it in the river, buy a Mac. No more issues.

Yeah.  :rolleyes:

[Ben]

Easy fix. Throw it in the river, buy a Mac. No more issues.

Registered in Feb of 2007 and made your first post in Dec, 2008? It took you almost two years to come up with this lame line?

This is what leads to arguments and gets threads locked. Think twice, post once.

[mtnbkr]

Mtnbkr, are you using any non-alphanumeric characters in your key?  

No non-alphanumeric characters.  Just an 8 character random string using numbers and letters.

Why not just leave wireless security off?

The inlaws live in a relatively populated area and FIL works from home at times.  I don't want anyone using their connection.  There are a lot of wireless networks visible from their house and only one is open, another open connection would get attention and likely get used.  I tried everything from open to WPA-AES.  Only open worked and it was flaky then.

Maybe update the wireless router firmware?

Did that and tried a new router (one that's on Asus' list of approved devices).  I also updated that router.

It's sold at Target as a consumer item. That means they need to be on top of issues, or they're going to be dropped and only sold via catalog to hardcore experimenters again.

They got it at Target.  It's going back today and will be replaced with a Windows XP loaded netbook from another company.  I was especially annoyed that Asus' tech support (24/7!) was closed until Monday.  Couldn't they find some Hindus in India to man the phones until then? 

It's a shame.  Other than the wireless networking issue, it's a nice device.  It's snappy, easy to use, comes with a nice compliment of apps for the average user, and is super portable.  If the wireless worked as it should, I'd totally feel comfortable handing it to a non-technical user such as my MIL. 

I like Linux and use it on servers and desktops, but this netbook needs work to make the wireless a bit more userfriendly.  There is no reason at all I should have to bring up a terminal window on a netbook to make the wireless work.  Oh, and the gui-based update wouldn't run, I had to log into the terminal and run apt-get to update the system.

Chris

[BrokenPaw]

I like Linux and use it on servers and desktops, but this netbook needs work to make the wireless a bit more userfriendly.  There is no reason at all I should have to bring up a terminal window on a netbook to make the wireless work.  Oh, and the gui-based update wouldn't run, I had to log into the terminal and run apt-get to update the system.

Sorry you had this experience, Chris.  It seems that Asus quality falls off at the lower end of their product line; their gaming-series laptops are superb (I'm using one now).  I guess to make the price point they wanted for the eee, they had to cut too many corners.

-BP

[Manedwolf]

They got it at Target.  It's going back today and will be replaced with a Windows XP loaded netbook from another company.  I was especially annoyed that Asus' tech support (24/7!) was closed until Monday.  Couldn't they find some Hindus in India to man the phones until then? 

It's a shame.  Other than the wireless networking issue, it's a nice device.  It's snappy, easy to use, comes with a nice compliment of apps for the average user, and is super portable.  If the wireless worked as it should, I'd totally feel comfortable handing it to a non-technical user such as my MIL. 

I like Linux and use it on servers and desktops, but this netbook needs work to make the wireless a bit more userfriendly.  There is no reason at all I should have to bring up a terminal window on a netbook to make the wireless work.  Oh, and the gui-based update wouldn't run, I had to log into the terminal and run apt-get to update the system.

Chris

That is so not going to fly with the people who buy one and want it to immediately connect at Panera and get their email and watch YouTube. It should be what I call a "Fisher-Price Toy" interface, big happy buttons showing you what wireless networks are in range, signal strength, and connection. Update should be the same. Not like they didn't have over a year of Wii and iPod Touch wireless setup to reverse-engineer. It's going to go back to the stores en masse.

That is a shame. It's a sleek little microbook, but Asus has a history of putting out decent products and then completely falling down on customer support. I recall that happening with their superior PocketPC devices when those were big. They could have blown Compaq out of the water in that time, but their customer service was what blew. Big time.

Oh well. Object lesson for businesses.

[MillCreek]

I am not an expert on this, but I wonder to what extent this is a LInux problem.  I have not heard of similar problems with various netbooks using XP.  My MSI Wind running XP connects with no problems to any wireless connection I have found. 

[Ben]

It should be what I call a "Fisher-Price Toy" interface, big happy buttons showing you what wireless networks are in range, signal strength, and connection.

Maybe they've changed since I got mine. That's how mine came setup, and I had to modify to get a regular Linux "advanced" interface as my default.

[CNYCacher]

I am not an expert on this, but I wonder to what extent this is a LInux problem. 

To the extent that people are superstitious about Linux.

Try changing the Mode box from auto to "infrastructure"

[mtnbkr]

I am not an expert on this, but I wonder to what extent this is a LInux problem.  I have not heard of similar problems with various netbooks using XP.  My MSI Wind running XP connects with no problems to any wireless connection I have found. 

That I don't know for certain.  I've never had a problem with Win2k, XP, or Vista and wireless, but prior to this, my only experience with Linux and wireless was with an old laptop (2003 vintage) and an 802.11b wireless PC card.  I didn't have any success then either, but I didn't devote much time to it and assumed it was the odd combo of hardware.  I assumed (yeah, I know) a prepackaged system with Linux preloaded would work better.

It should be what I call a "Fisher-Price Toy" interface, big happy buttons showing you what wireless networks are in range, signal strength, and connection.

It does.  I could see all sorts of networks but couldn't connect to our encrypted one and could only sporadically connect to ours without encryption.

Chris

[Manedwolf]

It does.  I could see all sorts of networks but couldn't connect to our encrypted one and could only sporadically connect to ours without encryption.

Chris

Okay, I should qualify, a simple GUI over a backend that WORKS reliably and doesn't need tinkering under the hood. :)

I just sort of shake my head at that sort of thing. It's not like they've not had reliable wireless for linux for a long time to benchmark for the product! And encryption? The Wii has been out as a consumer product for several years, and it has no problem connecting to encrypted networks. Hell, even the old PSP has no problem with WPA-2. A "serious" device in this day and age shouldn't, either. It only takes one fatal flaw coupled with a lack of any attempt to fix it (bad customer service) to sink a product and even a brand...and it sounds like you ran into it.

I'd not be surprised if Asus retreats back to the Asian market except for motherboards, wondering what went wrong.

(related historic trivia bit)

As a motivational reminder exhibit, I have a 1983 Viewtron Sceptre with a card explaining what it is. It's a little set-top box with a wireless keyboard that was very good. And...it was basically the basic functions of web, GUI and all, in 1983. Online shopping, banking, news services, true email with an inbox, airline reservations, even online graphical ads targeted to the user and online auctions. In 1983. But they blew it with poor customer service, excessive charges, and a lot of other issues that had nothing to do with the hardware or the technology, which was a decade ahead of its time.



The best product can be derailed by poor implementation, but can be salvaged with quick fixes to make it right. It can instead be destroyed completely by poor customer service following that initial flaw.