The Cuban medical system

[MillCreek]

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2016/11/cuba-health/508859/

Noting the comments on the Cuban medical system in the Castro thread, this article seems timely.

[zxcvbob]

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2016/11/cuba-health/508859/

Noting the comments on the Cuban medical system in the Castro thread, this article seems timely.

I've not read the article yet (will later) but I think Cuba has a remarkably good medical system for such a destitute shithole of a country.  That's a pretty big qualifier.  There's still probably some lessons we could learn from them on things like efficiency.

[roo_ster]

I've not read the article yet (will later) but I think Cuba has a remarkably good medical system for such a destitute shithole of a country.  That's a pretty big qualifier.  There's still probably some lessons we could learn from them on things like efficiency.

Well, I'd suspect Cuban death panels dispense with euphemism, along with costly patients.

[Jamisjockey]

Well, I'd suspect Cuban death panels dispense with euphemism, along with costly patients.

If more empathetic countries such as England already do, I can't imagine how efficiently you're cast off in the Cuban system...

[TommyGunn]

The system requires around twice as many primary-care doctors per capita as we have in the U.S., made possible because the country also invested in medical education, creating in 1998 what U.N. Secretary General Ban Ki-moon called “the world’s most advanced medical school.” Cuba has become known for training not just domestic doctors, but those from around the world—and sending its doctors to help other, wealthier countries when needed. During the recent Ebola crisis in Sierra Leone, more than 100 Cuban doctors and nurses were at the front lines.

From elsewhere I've heard that Cuba actually has a shortage of doctors, as many have left.   I've also heard that healthcare for the ruling class is pretty good while healthcare for the peons is bad.
I wonder what the real truth is .... though it being a dictatorship, I won't be holding my breath to find out.

The article said govt. provided healthcare was in the Cuban Constitution.   That sounds good.   The former USSR had a Constitution as well, and it too sounded good.   It just wasn't adhered to, and thus we had the gulags, purges .....so forth.  

[HankB]

. . . The article said govt. provided healthcare was in the Cuban Constitution.   That sounds good.   The former USSR had a Constitution as well, and it too sounded good.   It just wasn't adhered to, and thus we had the gulags, purges .....so forth.  

I remember reading that Soviet citizens could be arrested and locked up for "unwarranted exercise of constitutional rights" . . .

[MechAg94]

It is a communist country.  Everything is rationed (for those outside the ruling class).  

I skimmed through that article and I was wondering if someone would come around with the "..rest of the story" to fill in what was left unsaid.  Also, I am not sure I trust cost of care and average lifespan numbers from a country like Cuba without independent verification. 

[makattak]

It is a communist country.  Everything is rationed (for those outside the ruling class). 

I skimmed through that article and I was wondering if someone would come around with the "..rest of the story" to fill in what was left unsaid.  Also, I am not sure I trust cost of care and average lifespan numbers from a country like Cuba without independent verification. 

Whatever you say about the people of Cuba, at least the non-elites are saved from the horrors of obesity that the poor people in this country face.

[MechAg94]

Whatever you say about the people of Cuba, at least the non-elites are saved from the horrors of obesity that the poor people in this country face.

I think you just hit on the next liberal crusade.  We have to raise minimum wage and tax fast food, twinkies, and ho-hos to fight obesity.   

[Perd Hapley]

I think you just hit on the next liberal crusade.  We have to raise minimum wage and tax fast food, twinkies, and ho-hos to fight obesity.  

Oh, they've been ginning this up already. Taxing or banning Big Gulps. Michelle Obama school lunches. Gallons of ink and pixels spilled over "food deserts." Pushing a "living wage." They are so there.

[Fly320s]

The article said govt. provided healthcare was in the Cuban Constitution.   That sounds good.   

I am betting that you are being facetious, but just in case you aren't.

That is a stupid, idiotic, moronic, and abso-freaking-lutely horrible idea.

How does one enforce the right to healthcare?  Is the government forcing people to become doctors and nurses?  Well, this is Cuba, so probably yes.

[Hawkmoon]

I am betting that you are being facetious, but just in case you aren't.

That is a stupid, idiotic, moronic, and abso-freaking-lutely horrible idea.

How does one enforce the right to healthcare?  Is the government forcing people to become doctors and nurses?  Well, this is Cuba, so probably yes.

"You! Can you read?"

"Si, señor."

"What does this say?"

"Eet says 'aspirin.' "

"Congratulations -- you are a doctor. Report to the clinic at 7:00 o'clock tomorrow morning."

[De Selby]

The problem with discussing it is that Cuba has been a propaganda whipping boy for so long that you can't have a fact based discussion about it.

Discussing Cuban medicine in America must be something like discussing US foreign policy at a North Korean university.  Inconvenient facts that show the enemy to be decent in some regards are not allowed.

Considering the economic sanctions that country has faced, its economy and delivery of health, housing, and education is miraculous.  The elites clearly aren't milking their positions to anything like the degree it happens elsewhere in Latin America.

[De Selby]

Whatever you say about the people of Cuba, at least the non-elites are saved from the horrors of obesity that the poor people in this country face.

They do have good nutrition through the government food program.  Malnourishment is lower than in many American inner cities, even among the poorest Cubans.


It's actually somewhat a model of working communism.  The government has been providing food, shelter, medicine and education publicly for 50 years or so and it's nowhere near collapse.  In fact it has resisted the best efforts of the most powerful country on earth during that time.

Cuba is an example of what poor and less developed countries could be like if they actually prioritised basic necessities over flash goods.  Sure, maybe even a doctor is too poor to afford a Rolex, but the whole country eats and lives well together.  There's low crime, high literacy, and good health and they've clearly chosen those outcomes as a people over cash wealth.

[TommyGunn]

I am betting that you are being facetious, but just in case you aren't.

That is a stupid, idiotic, moronic, and abso-freaking-lutely horrible idea.

How does one enforce the right to healthcare?  Is the government forcing people to become doctors and nurses?  Well, this is Cuba, so probably yes.

I am absolutely  against govt enforced healthcare like Cuba  and Russia.    Sometimes things can be made to look really nice on paper but are inefficient to even horrible in practice.    Socialism  "sounds good" when you read Marx....but tell me again how many died in Soviet purges?

[MechAg94]

The problem with discussing it is that Cuba has been a propaganda whipping boy for so long that you can't have a fact based discussion about it.

Discussing Cuban medicine in America must be something like discussing US foreign policy at a North Korean university.  Inconvenient facts that show the enemy to be decent in some regards are not allowed.

Considering the economic sanctions that country has faced, its economy and delivery of health, housing, and education is miraculous.  The elites clearly aren't milking their positions to anything like the degree it happens elsewhere in Latin America.

You seem to ignore the fact that communist regimes like Cuba have played the propaganda game more than anyone else over the years.  Whatever you think about American propaganda, we are amateurs.  

I also think it is funny that you bring up anti-Cuban propaganda when the OP link is a puff piece on Cuban health care.

[De Selby]

You seem to ignore the fact that communist regimes like Cuba have played the propaganda game more than anyone else over the years.  Whatever you think about American propaganda, we are amateurs.  

I also think it is funny that you bring up anti-Cuban propaganda when the OP link is a puff piece on Cuban health care.

On what basis did you conclude it's a puff piece?  Or that every available stay on Cuba is fake?

In fact it'd be great to see a link to any documentation on those claims.  Certainly the WHO, numberous private health entities, and numerous private researchers think it's real.

[RoadKingLarry]

So, it's ok to be ruled by a bloodthirsty, murdering dictator as long as you have good Healthcare.
Got it.

[dogmush]

There's low crime, high literacy, and good health and they've clearly chosen those outcomes as a people over cash wealth.

And that's easy to do when you shoot anyone that chooses differently

[De Selby]

And that's easy to do when you shoot anyone that chooses differently

Again, hype much?  Is there any evidence of this?

[dogmush]

Again, hype much?  Is there any evidence of this?

Maybe they are just playing "revolutionary and dissident" and will go have a cool mojito afterwards.

[De Selby]

Maybe they are just playing "revolutionary and dissident" and will go have a cool mojito afterwards.

Haha, man you can't be serious.  Do you know anything about that photo, like its date, names of people in it, etc?  Was the dead guy even an alleged dissident? 

This is as silly as me posting photos of Abu Ghraib and saying "some freedom there - they shock your balls in america if you disagree."

This really just proves the point.  The Kool Aid has been poured so many times on this in your school lunches that a rational, fact based evaluation of the faults and successes of the regime in Cuba is just impossible.  Posting photos from a war in the 50's suffices as evidence of how the regime works.

[De Selby]

So, it's ok to be ruled by a bloodthirsty, murdering dictator as long as you have good Healthcare.
Got it.

Excluding police from the Batista government (most of whom actually were torturers and war criminals), how many people have been executed in Cuba?

[Hawkmoon]

Cuba is an example of what poor and less developed countries could be like if they actually prioritised basic necessities over flash goods.  Sure, maybe even a doctor is too poor to afford a Rolex, but the whole country eats and lives well together.  There's low crime, high literacy, and good health and they've clearly chosen those outcomes as a people over cash wealth.

Yep, Cuba is just a modern utopia. That's why there are more Cubans in Miami than there are in Cuba, and why Cubans are willing to risk being shot or drowning to get out of the place.

[De Selby]

Yep, Cuba is just a modern utopia. That's why there are more Cubans in Miami than there are in Cuba, and why Cubans are willing to risk being shot or drowning to get out of the place.

And this is just as silly.  Who ever argued Cuba is as well off as the US?  Who in the region doesn't try to come to the US?