Las Vegas mass murder was...

[Perd Hapley]

...ISIS?

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/victoria-taft/2022/10/04/5-years-after-las-vegas-concert-shooting-an-fbi-whistleblower-reveals-probable-motive-n1634216

In the interview, Guandolo said, “When you look at what actually transpired and put it together from a counter-espionage attack and counter-espionage look, the probability that was an ISIS attack is well over 90%.”

[bedlamite]

I don't remember the details, but there was one "conspiracy theory" that involved a Saudi national being taken away to the airport that night.

[230RN]

It's getting pretty hard to dismiss anything as a mere "conspiracy theory" any more.  Its usefulness as a Lefty catchword is declining.

Makes me wonder what they'll dream up next to trivialize what they don't like.

[WLJ]

Did ISIS ever take credit? If they were involved I have no doubt they would have been crowing about it from the rooftops

[Hawkmoon]

Did ISIS ever take credit? If they were involved I have no doubt they would have been crowing about it from the rooftops

The FBI so-called whistleblower said ISIS claimed credit for the attack five times. I don't remember even one such claim.

[gunsmith]

on the night it happened either isis or al-queda took credit , AFAIK the hotel where the attack was staged from is Saudi owned and two the two top floors were Saudi only.
The laptop hard drive was "lost", then it never existed.  Paddocks house in Reno, NV was burglarized, what was taken was not reported. I saw a video of that night, definitely at least two shooters using two different rifles at the same time only one firing semi auto .  I talked to two survivors ( who did not know each other ) both claimed absolutely more that one shooter .

Shortly after the event, there was "the purge in the kingdom" prominent high ranking members of Saudi ruling class were killed or jailed ( I think it is related )  after Trump visited Vegas he went to Saudi Arabia  ( I think it is related )
   
 

[gunsmith]

I never figured out who this guy was, I wonder if he is still alive

[Perd Hapley]

Gunsmith, doesn't every mass shooting have witnesses swearing there were multiple shooters? All those statements have to be compared with other evidence. People remember things that didn't happen.

[230RN]

^
Or they are hearing echoes or bullet cracks.

[Bogie]

As it happened, someone posted a livestream, with sound.
 
The cyclic rate I heard was about like an M-60 or an AK with big drums. It _could_ have been a SAW but seemed slower... It was too regular to be bump stocks or crank guns. It wasn't a fast cyclic - One of the 5.56 AK-74 variants? I dunno... Was surprised that the released photos didn't show large amounts of scattered brass?
 
Also, windows on those buildings are -thick- and would take some effort to remove, even with shooting them. I'd go for a breaching charge (shaped/focused det cord?) fired from another room...
 
It was also a lousy location. The angle was too high. The casualty rate would have been a lot higher if shooters had been lower. I figure someone wanted Charlie Whitman headlines.
 
Tied up too neatly. And you can't find a lot of other info beyond the initial press releases.
 
If someone REALLY wanted mass casualties, they'd lob rounds into a large football stadium from a distance...

[MechAg94]

I helped out at one of our sites outside Vegas earlier this year.  Everyone there had a theory or knew of a bunch of theories.  I would say the official narrative was low on the list of what people believed.  Most people knew someone who was hurt or killed either directly or indirectly.  Most people thought the lack of camera footage either locally or from a distance was suspicious.  It was a big discussion topic at times.

One of the things I heard was blacked out helicopters hovering over the building.  Someone claimed they saw blacked out helicopters flying toward or away from the event. 

[DittoHead]

One of the things I heard was blacked out helicopters hovering over the building.  Someone claimed they saw blacked out helicopters flying toward or away from the event.

It doesn't get much more classic conspiracy theory than that!

[MechAg94]

I think I remember someone mentioned there are cameras that look at the skyline of Las Vegas and none of those have footage for that time frame.  Not sure if I remember that right.

[Pb]

Okay, I read the ISIS did it theory... but I didn't see any evidence presented, other they supposedly took credit.

Given that the murderer was apparently secular, the theory appears to make no sense. 

[Tuco]

Given that the alleged murderer was apparently secular, the theory appears to make no sense. 

Fixed that for you!
 

[bedlamite]

As it happened, someone posted a livestream, with sound.
 
The cyclic rate I heard was about like an M-60 or an AK with big drums. It _could_ have been a SAW but seemed slower... It was too regular to be bump stocks or crank guns. It wasn't a fast cyclic - One of the 5.56 AK-74 variants? I dunno... Was surprised that the released photos didn't show large amounts of scattered brass?
 
Also, windows on those buildings are -thick- and would take some effort to remove, even with shooting them. I'd go for a breaching charge (shaped/focused det cord?) fired from another room...
 
It was also a lousy location. The angle was too high. The casualty rate would have been a lot higher if shooters had been lower. I figure someone wanted Charlie Whitman headlines.
 
Tied up too neatly. And you can't find a lot of other info beyond the initial press releases.
 
If someone REALLY wanted mass casualties, they'd lob rounds into a large football stadium from a distance...

I wish I could find it, but there was an audio engineer that did an analysis of every recording he could find, along with a few recordings of machine guns and bump stock fire at a range. There were two distinct machine guns being fired, and you could hear the echo of both.

[MechAg94]

IMO, law enforcement was evasive and hiding all the evidence from the start.  I thought we would see all the pictures and video get released after a while, but that never really happened.  There were some reports issued about it that I never got around to reading. 

[dogmush]

I wish I could find it, but there was an audio engineer that did an analysis of every recording he could find, along with a few recordings of machine guns and bump stock fire at a range. There were two distinct machine guns being fired, and you could hear the echo of both.

I'd be interested in that video.  I have fired a fair bit of machine guns and several bump stock equipped AR's, and am not convinced you could tell the difference by sound alone.  I'd be interested in the engineer's opinions on why they think they could.

[cordex]

I wish I could find it, but there was an audio engineer that did an analysis of every recording he could find, along with a few recordings of machine guns and bump stock fire at a range. There were two distinct machine guns being fired, and you could hear the echo of both.

I recall watching a video like that but it came to the exact opposite conclusion - that there were echoes coming from other buildings that made multiple consecutive strings of fire sound like multiple simultaneous strings of fire.

[230RN]

Or echoes and direct noise from the supersonic cracks, which I mentioned.  Most people aren't aware of how loud those can be.

Discovered that the first time I manned the target pits   I wondered why everybody else was wearing hearing protection until the first round went through my target.  Sounded like a .45 ACP going off.  Stuffed earplugs in my ears right swiftly.

CRACK!--One Mississippi--boom.

[MechAg94]

I have fired a bump stock before.  I wouldn't think it would be the same, but I have no experience with full auto to compare to.  It was tough to maintain a steady firing rate while keeping the rifle anywhere close to the target.  However, I have seen at least one video showing someone do it pretty good.

[dogmush]

I have fired a bump stock before.  I wouldn't think it would be the same, but I have no experience with full auto to compare to.  It was tough to maintain a steady firing rate while keeping the rifle anywhere close to the target.  However, I have seen at least one video showing someone do it pretty good.

It's not the same, but machine guns are usually fired in bursts, as are bump stocks.  bump stocks take more skill than machine guns that's for sure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQ2xFpbv920

vs.

https://youtu.be/Ap01PFshVoM?t=93

[BobR]

His brother was on a motorcycle site I frequented back then. He talked a lot, I am not sure who was more crazy, him or his brother. Anyhow, after he did an interview on cam he kind of vanished. I also wonder where the girlfriend ended up. At we know where the incompetent Sherriff ended up, he is running for Governor.

As an aside, my son's company was in charge of something there and he was on site a few days earlier. He looked around the area, looked at the buildings and mentioned it would be a great place to set an ambush. He did not go the the concert even though he had a free pass.

bob

[gunsmith]

I saw a video of the shooting, there was absolutely two shooters, one was a semi and one either bump or select fire .
I heard two distinct rifles , one sounded like an AK.
One of the people I know was there ( her picture was in the media helping wounded people  ) is an NRA ccw and rifle pistol instructor and used to work for one of the local indoor ranges.
 I believe her.

 I was tracking it minute by minute here in Reno , isis or al quedea claimed responsibility early on - imo there is a lot that they do not want ppl to know for some reason ( Saudi money imo )

[Pb]

I believe her.

What did she say that you believe?