Author Topic: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?  (Read 16821 times)

myrockfight

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What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« on: November 03, 2009, 12:59:18 AM »
Hey guys. I type this with some hesitation. It has been nagging me for quite some time. I know people in the military, who are currently serving, and veterans who have served honorably, going back to WWII, including many family members. In one way, that incenses me to bring this to light, but also pains me to bring to light a issue with a former military member.

So, I thought I would request some, hopefully educated, discourse on the subject. I have gotten to know a young man over the past several months. We'll call him "Joe". Joe had gotten a medical discharge from the Army for an injury (which is questionable itself). He receives benefits from the .gov, including his GI Bill. He also works part time for the govt. now on the business side of things. But it is more of an internship than anything else.

He is claiming PTSD. The problem with that is he has never, ever, seen combat. EVER. He was stationed in Germany the whole time he was in until his med discharge. I am positive of this without any doubt.

My question is, "What do you think should be done to rectify the problem?" And how?

I have a hard time swallowing the fact that someone is taking advantage of resources and diluting real problems that honorable soldiers WHO SERVED IN COMBAT have. I am not friends with him for the aforementioned reason and how he treats other people. However, I am not thrilled about "snitching" on someone whether I like him or not. But the respect I have for those who are and who have served, with real problems, is driving me to find a way to do something about this.


Can you guys shed some light on this subject and advise? I would greatly appreciate it.

Balog

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2009, 01:12:34 AM »
If the VA is paying him money, he may have a valid claim. Some things other than combat can cause PTSD.

That being said, if he's actually faking you need to turn him into the feds asap. People exploiting the system are stealing from guys and gals who deserve far more than they get anyway.
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RocketMan

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2009, 07:41:36 AM »
The VA does have a history of being scammed for PTSD benefits.  In the past, they have not been very good at weeding out false claims.  They have even paid benefits to non-veterans, people who have never served in the military, as a result of some of the scams.
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vaskidmark

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2009, 08:02:09 AM »
Most (not all, by any means) folks with PTSD will not even discuss the possibility for years, even while they are involved in treatment for same.  That "Joe" is claiming PTSD does raise several red flags, including the possibility of a variant of "survivor's guilt".  That you are certain that he spent all of his military time in a non-combat area makes that possibility even more possible - although my mention of it should not be taken in any way as an actual diagnosis.

It may also be his [unhealthy] way of trying to compensate for feelings of "worthlessness" for not having been assigned to a combat area.  Many REMFs in combat zones are disturbed in some way(s) by not having been at the point of the spear and feel that their service in support roles was not deserving of the recognition many are giving to servicemen.

The question I have for you is what you want to accomplish by exposing "Joe" - other than that he is possibly a liar.  You will need direct info on why he is receiving VA benefits in order to challenge the legitimacy of the award, and you may have a very difficult time, if possible at all, in getting that info from anyone but "Joe" himself.  But if you want to press the issue, go ahead and risk libel/slander repercussions as well as the general approbation of your friends and family unless you are completely right.

On the other hand, you might want to sit down with "Joe" and explain why you are having trouble believing all of his claims because of the inconsistencies of his story and the rash of false claims being exposed around the country.  Or you could find out who he says he is seeing about the PTSD and contact them with your concerns based on a real desire to help "Joe" deal with his mental health, as indicated by his to you unbelievable story about his military service and disability.

On the third hand, you could sit back, having as little to do with "Joe" as you decide, and watch to see if he implodes on his own.

My question to you is: why do you believe that PTSD can only be caused by exposure to combat?  I've known people who experience(d) PTSD just from being asked to justify their beliefs.

stay safe.

skidmark
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myrockfight

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2009, 10:01:19 AM »
Most (not all, by any means) folks with PTSD will not even discuss the possibility for years, even while they are involved in treatment for same.  That "Joe" is claiming PTSD does raise several red flags, including the possibility of a variant of "survivor's guilt".  That you are certain that he spent all of his military time in a non-combat area makes that possibility even more possible - although my mention of it should not be taken in any way as an actual diagnosis.It may also be his [unhealthy] way of trying to compensate for feelings of "worthlessness" for not having been assigned to a combat area.  Many REMFs in combat zones are disturbed in some way(s) by not having been at the point of the spear and feel that their service in support roles was not deserving of the recognition many are giving to servicemen.

This is the reason I am asking these questions before going off half-cocked without a clue as to how PTSD works, etc. I figured you guys would have some insight. And like I said, "I am very hesitant," to do anything for lack of fully understanding the situation.



The question I have for you is what you want to accomplish by exposing "Joe" - other than that he is possibly a liar.  You will need direct info on why he is receiving VA benefits in order to challenge the legitimacy of the award, and you may have a very difficult time, if possible at all, in getting that info from anyone but "Joe" himself.  But if you want to press the issue, go ahead and risk libel/slander repercussions as well as the general approbation of your friends and family unless you are completely right.

The only reason I have for bringing the issue to light is that there are other service men and women out there with "legitimate" (as per my previously lacking definition) PTSD. There is nothing in it for me personally other than risking the aforementioned repercussions.


On the other hand, you might want to sit down with "Joe" and explain why you are having trouble believing all of his claims because of the inconsistencies of his story and the rash of false claims being exposed around the country.  Or you could find out who he says he is seeing about the PTSD and contact them with your concerns based on a real desire to help "Joe" deal with his mental health, as indicated by his to you unbelievable story about his military service and disability.

On the third hand, you could sit back, having as little to do with "Joe" as you decide, and watch to see if he implodes on his own.


The latter option was what I have decided to do up to this point, and in all likelihood, will be what I do. I just wanted to get other opinions concerning the issue and be more at ease with that course of action.

My question to you is: why do you believe that PTSD can only be caused by exposure to combat?  I've known people who experience(d) PTSD just from being asked to justify their beliefs.

Well in this case, I read a document in which "Joe" was asked to describe the cause of PTSD. He never answered the question in the page and a half answer. He only listed what his symptoms were repeatedly. That, coupled with his lack of character and his propensity to lie, made me very suspicious. He has definitely been lying about his injury that got him discharged. Before I had my accident, we were working out together at the gym a few days a week and he said he was exaggerating his claims and if the knew he was working out his benefits would be cut.


Honestly, I don't know everything there is to know about PTSD, by any means. Nor do I pretend to. But I was hoping you guys would shed some light on the subject before/if I actually took any action. That is why I ask. I know that a man's reputation is at stake and I do not take that lightly. I'm very careful to treat others with the respect that they deserve. I hope I have made it clear that this is not something I am approaching with trepidation and apprehension.

Regards


coppertales

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2009, 10:50:50 AM »
Just ask to see his VA ID card.  If it says "service connected" in the upper right hand corner, he may be right.....but, the card does not show what the disability is though.....chris3

Grandpa Shooter

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2009, 11:00:09 AM »
You may or may not have been around at the time I was revealing that I was having a very difficult time dealing with my stepson going into the Army and being sent to Afghanistan.  I am a disabled combat veteran with PTSD.  As has been mentioned, many Vets are unwilling to discuss their particular case, as well as what their personal stressors are.  In order for him to be claiming PTSD, he has to convince the VA that there was a particular circumstance in which he experienced something so hurtful to him either physically or emotionally that he is "stuck" at that moment in time and is experiencing difficulty functioning in interpersonal, work, or familial settings.  There is a list available which shows what the symptoms are at the different levels of PTSD.  Simply having experienced something stressful does not automatically blossom as PTSD.

Recently under the new head of the VA, the rules were changed so that an individual who has served in a combat zone, no longer has to provide a detailed "Stressor letter" but still has to be able to prove that they meet the criteria of actually having PTSD.  It would serve you well to go to the VA website and look it up.  If you simply search for PTSD, it will give you weeks of reading for your spare time.  I can say personally that PTSD is like an insidious disease which works to undermine a person's ability to function in an effective way in "normal" society (whatever the hell that is these days).  As a result, many young men and women are having a very tough time transitioning back into society.  Couple that with the results of traumatic brain injury, repeat rotations into and out of combat zones, extended time away from family and loved ones, and the lack of adequate service from the VA, and you have almost a lethal cocktail of influencing curcumstances.

You may indeed be right about "Joe", but unless you have walked in his shoes, I am not certain how you would ever prove your suspicions.  He may be faking a physical limitation, or not.  He may not have PTSD.  Then again he may be unwilling to discuss his case with you.  I personally know of a man who was officially stationed in Okinawa.  His family all believe that is where he was during Desert Storm. I know he was not there all the time.  He went on missions and returned to there.  He has problems to this day and is unable to prove his case because "officially" he never left Okinawa.  Think about that please before you get too upset with "Joe".

Gewehr98

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2009, 12:48:22 PM »
As stated before in this thread, being stationed in a combat zone is only one of several avenues for PTSD diagnosis as far as the VA is concerned. 

Don't be so hasty to judge the individual for what may very well be a valid claim.  ;)
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myrockfight

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2009, 01:21:16 PM »
Thanks for all the input guys. I appreciate it.

Grandpa, I'm sorry to hear that. I don't recall reading any of those posts. I hope all of your needs are being met and you are feeling as good as you possibly can given the circumstances.

Yeah guys. I think I'm just going to let it go. If I get the opportunity to talk to him I will. But that probably won't happen because he moved and is no longer an acquaintence of any type. I rarely see him anymore anyway. I have voiced my concerns, but there are too many unknowns. I'll just trust the VA knows what they are doing and can weed out the false claims.


vaskidmark

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2009, 02:10:48 PM »
Thanks for being concerned 1) that the taxpayers are not getting ripped off and 2) that veterans' reputations are not tarnished by "wannabees" and other fakers/fakairs.

Several of us here struggle with PTSD.  Being an Aspie (among other diagnoses) I am probably the least impaired by PTSD, but only because my other conditions get in the way of that being the case. :O =D  My history/experience of being a therapist and working with several different different traumatized and traumatizing populations also figures into my own approaches to PTSD and folks with/claiming to have PTSD as well as what causes PTSD.

Never trust the VA, no matter who tells you different.  But "Joe" and his particulars seem to have dropped off your plate by virtue of several factors.  Let it stay that way.

And once again, thanks for your concern for the folks who truely are carrying their own burdens.

stay safe.

skidmark
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

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They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

Grandpa Shooter

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2009, 04:27:14 PM »
Thanks for being concerned 1) that the taxpayers are not getting ripped off and 2) that veterans' reputations are not tarnished by "wannabees" and other fakers/fakairs.

Several of us here struggle with PTSD.  Being an Aspie (among other diagnoses) I am probably the least impaired by PTSD, but only because my other conditions get in the way of that being the case. :O =D  My history/experience of being a therapist and working with several different different traumatized and traumatizing populations also figures into my own approaches to PTSD and folks with/claiming to have PTSD as well as what causes PTSD.

Never trust the VA, no matter who tells you different.  But "Joe" and his particulars seem to have dropped off your plate by virtue of several factors.  Let it stay that way.

And once again, thanks for your concern for the folks who truely are carrying their own burdens.

stay safe.

skidmark"


Hey skid, Do I detect just a tad of frustration with the VA?







Antibubba

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2009, 05:58:32 PM »
Many sexual abuse survivors are diagnosed with PTSD.  It is not uncommon.
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Balog

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2009, 06:04:33 PM »
Many sexual abuse survivors are diagnosed with PTSD.  It is not uncommon.

Kinda what I was thinking. And male victims of rape are generally even less willing to talk about it than female ones are.
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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2009, 06:19:01 PM »
I've heard from friends I trust, folks int he military, that scamming the system based on phony PTSD symptoms is becoming common.

Obviously I don't know one way or the other whether "Joe" is doing this, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was.

Balog

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2009, 06:22:39 PM »
If you know for a fact he's scamming about his physical issues, it's likely he's also scamming the PTSD. That being said, a lot of PTSD cases are unlikely to want to discuss it.
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If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

vaskidmark

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2009, 09:12:29 PM »
A "tad" of frustration?  No.

The VA is absolutely the best medical care our government can offer to veterans.

Of course, as a government program it has its issues and problems.  It is probably better now that it was back when they wanted to have me receive services from them.  But that's like saying that finally chewing your arm off is better than having it caught in the trap.  YMMV.

stay safe.

skidmark
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

Hey you kids!! Get off my lawn!!!

They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

thebaldguy

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Re: What to do with fake PTSD claimer?
« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2009, 11:19:41 PM »
Many things beside combat can cause PTSD; a bad car accident or something similar are some examples.

I say let it go. Keep your distance and let it go.