Author Topic: The latest TSA idiocy  (Read 4862 times)

ilbob

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,546
    • Bob's blog
The latest TSA idiocy
« on: June 18, 2008, 08:41:24 AM »
I don't recall seeing this here, but ran across it elsewhere.

http://www.tsa.gov/press/happenings/enhance_id_requirements.shtm

Basically, the new TSA policy is that terrorists who claim to have lost their ID will be allowed to board, while people who refuse to provide ID as a form of peaceful protest will not be allowed to board.

bob

Disclaimers: I am not a lawyer, cop, soldier, gunsmith, politician, plumber, electrician, or a professional practitioner of many of the other things I comment on in this forum.

The Annoyed Man

  • New Member
  • Posts: 1
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2008, 08:43:54 AM »
I don't recall seeing this here, but ran across it elsewhere.

http://www.tsa.gov/press/happenings/enhance_id_requirements.shtm

Basically, the new TSA policy is that terrorists who claim to have lost their ID will be allowed to board, while people who refuse to provide ID as a form of peaceful protest will not be allowed to board.


I thought the TSA was an ongoing study of stupidity?

cassandra and sara's daddy

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,781
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2008, 09:01:35 AM »
but the folks that are making the political stastement are getting what they want.... whats the rub?
i flew twice with no id  just takes longer
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

coppertales

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 947
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2008, 11:52:37 AM »
I read this week where the TSA all got issued badges................chris3

BridgeRunner

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 4,845
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2008, 12:01:04 PM »
I read this week where the TSA all got issued badges................chris3

w00t! Nothing like a hunk of metal authoritey!

I love my car....

ilbob

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,546
    • Bob's blog
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2008, 02:28:37 PM »
I read this week where the TSA all got issued badges................chris3
I saw that too. Seems that the TSA weenies have been complaining that they get no respect. No doubt issuing them badges and blue uniforms will improve that situation.
bob

Disclaimers: I am not a lawyer, cop, soldier, gunsmith, politician, plumber, electrician, or a professional practitioner of many of the other things I comment on in this forum.

erictank

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,410
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2008, 03:38:58 PM »
but the folks that are making the political stastement are getting what they want.... whats the rub?
i flew twice with no id  just takes longer

That's the point - next week, you won't be allowed to.  Period.  Oh, if you lie to the screeners convincingly enough that you've "forgotten your ID at home" and assist them in "verifying your identity" without your ID, they'll still SSSScreen you and grudgingly let you in (or so they claim, at least), but if you stand on principle?  Tell them, "This is the United States of America, where people don't need to show government agents ID in order to travel,"?  You won't be flying, according to them.  Period. 

To make this "Papiere bitte" crap even worse?  It will not, CANNOT do anything to enhance actual security.  Despite claims that this will assist in keeping people who are on the "no-fly" list (a list of people too innocent to arrest but too dangerous to be allowed to get on a plane - including children, Medal-Of-Honor recipients, and at least one US Senator, but not terrorists, since we don't want to tip them off that they're under investigation!), there is NEVER any comparison of your ID to the "no-fly" list.  The screener MAY check to make sure that the name on your ID matches the name on your boarding pass; if he's REALLY diligent, he might even check your face against the pic on the ID.  He will not, CAN NOT, check your ID against the "no-fly" list.  He does not have the ability to do so, and running each passenger against a million-name list would introduce even worse delays into an already-unacceptable situation - while still doing nothing to make flyers safer.  Arguably, TSA's insistence on things like this, the War On Bottled Water, and the Shoe Carnival are making flyers *LESS* safe - since they deflect the screeners' attention from checking for items which could actually conceivably be used to cause harm to the passengers or aircraft.

Plenty of ongoing discussion of this (and all sorts of other interesting issues) over on Flyertalk's Travel Safety and Security forum.  Worth a look.  Be sure to also check out TSA's "Evolution Of Security" blog, where TSA types announce, spin, and attempt to defend their agency's laughably-absurd "security" regulations.

BridgeRunner

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 4,845
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2008, 03:41:33 PM »
Quote
Arguably, TSA's insistence on things like this, the War On Bottled Water, and the Shoe Carnival are making flyers *LESS* safe

Fixed it for ya.  undecided

cassandra and sara's daddy

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,781
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2008, 03:46:04 PM »
"He will not, CAN NOT, check your ID against the "no-fly" list"  i'm on the list and my name gets flagged by the name on my ticket.

"but if you stand on principle?  Tell them, "This is the United States of America, where people don't need to show government agents ID in order to travel,"?  You won't be flying, according to them.  Period."

can you name 5 heroes of the rev  
olution who have taken that stand? in real life not just on the net
is there someone out there who isn't aware of what the requirements are for flying?they are suprised by the id check? whats all the noise about?you don't like it you take amtrak or the bus  or drive pain in the tail  the wailing mystifies me

i travel and
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

erictank

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,410
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2008, 04:03:12 PM »
"He will not, CAN NOT, check your ID against the "no-fly" list"  i'm on the list and my name gets flagged by the name on my ticket.

"but if you stand on principle?  Tell them, "This is the United States of America, where people don't need to show government agents ID in order to travel,"?  You won't be flying, according to them.  Period."

can you name 5 heroes of the rev  
olution who have taken that stand? in real life not just on the net

Well, since the new reg takes effect next week, it's a little early to name names.  However, TSA is stating that those standing on principle WILL NOT BE FLYING.  Seriously, it's on their blog site (www.tsa.gov/blog), under the "Why is ID important for security" section.  Read that, and check out the comments if you've got a half-hour or so (if you're a reasonably-fast reader).

is there someone out there who isn't aware of what the requirements are for flying?they are suprised by the id check?

No, we tend to regard it as Nazi crap - seriously, it's the living embodiment of "Papers, please!" - which has no place in a free nation.  Note that in Gilmore vs Gonzales, one of the reasons that they found against Gilmore was that one COULD fly without showing ID, by submitting to additional SSSScreening.  Next week, that will not be true anymore.  No approved, government-issued ID (that is, no papers), no entry into the so-called "secure area" - so no flight for you, kamerade.  Unless you lie to the nice screener about WHY you do not have approved papers...

you don't like it you take amtrak or the bus  or drive pain in the tail  the wailing mystifies me

TSA is also attempting to expand its purview to include Amtrak and Greyhound, so the argument that one has other means of travel (which is BS on its face - these are common carriers we're talking about) is rapidly falling flat.  Further, and far more importantly, many people out there just believe that in a free nation, there's no reason why the government OUGHT to be able to monitor our travel, or restrict it, like they are trying to do. 

yesitsloaded

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 690
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2008, 05:04:00 PM »
Why do you have business in that sector?

That is not a good reason!

Take off your clothes!

You smell like freedom, come with us!

I'll give it four months until the airlines in this country start to tank worse than they already have.
Mainly because our aviation transportation system wasn't build for anything other than cheap fuel as well as a population that doesn't want to be harassed when they can drive for cheaper. I can drive to Chicago right now for less than I can fly there and lose less than 24 hours of time doing so.
I can haz nukular banstiks ? Say no to furries, yes to people.

cassandra and sara's daddy

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,781
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2008, 05:12:15 PM »
i flew across country in may with wife and 2 kids  security took 5 mins tops at dulles except for my usual extra checks another 10 mins . one benifit is not having everyone and their grandma at the gates in the way. much easier to move once past  security   minor pain in the ass even getting through with kids
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

yesitsloaded

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 690
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2008, 05:12:55 PM »
For those that want my math on that it is roughly 750 miles by road. My car gets around 30 on the highway. 750/30=25. 25gallons@$4.30 a gallon=$107.5 The cheapest one way nonstop flight I could find on Orbitz is $241. So even factoring in a night in a motel(not that it would happen on a 12 hour drive anyway) and a full service oil change I can still drive cheaper than I can fly. Plus I can even carry my gun in my car most of the way there, choose who I sit by, and not have to be searched and bothered. Not to mention if someone tries to violently seize control of my car they are the one with a snowball's chance in hell as opposed to the other way around if it was on a plane.
I can haz nukular banstiks ? Say no to furries, yes to people.

LadySmith

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3,166
  • Veni, Vidi, Jactavi Calceos
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2008, 12:46:53 AM »
I dont fly at all&

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/WalterEWilliams/2008/06/18/airport_tyranny?page=full
Quote
Americans have been far too compliant and that has given the TSA carte blanche to treat travelers any way they wish. I'm staying away. TSA has its rules and Williams has his, and one of mine is to avoid tyrants and idiots.

&and for the same reason.
Rogue AI searching for amusement and/or Ellie Mae imitator searching for critters.
"What doesn't kill me makes me stronger...and it also makes me a cat-lover" - The Viking
According to Ben, I'm an inconvenient anomaly (and proud of it!).

Nitrogen

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,755
  • Who could it be?
    • @c0t0d0s2 / Twitter.
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2008, 03:36:40 AM »
The following link is NOT worksafe, but completely worth it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7AWw7t5zj0
יזכר לא עד פעם
Remember. Never Again.
What does it mean to be an American?  Have you forgotten? | http://youtu.be/0w03tJ3IkrM

MicroBalrog

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14,505
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2008, 04:52:35 AM »
Remember, nobody is being oppressed.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Manedwolf

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14,516
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2008, 05:03:19 AM »
I still prefer El-Al's means of screening. Not shoes, not water bottles. Interviews of passengers, along with plainclothes people watching for signs in body language.

They try to keep the bad PEOPLE off the plane, not silly little harmless items.

Tallpine

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,172
  • Grumpy Old Grandpa
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2008, 08:18:39 AM »
For those that want my math on that it is roughly 750 miles by road. My car gets around 30 on the highway. 750/30=25. 25gallons@$4.30 a gallon=$107.5 The cheapest one way nonstop flight I could find on Orbitz is $241. So even factoring in a night in a motel(not that it would happen on a 12 hour drive anyway) and a full service oil change I can still drive cheaper than I can fly. Plus I can even carry my gun in my car most of the way there, choose who I sit by, and not have to be searched and bothered. Not to mention if someone tries to violently seize control of my car they are the one with a snowball's chance in hell as opposed to the other way around if it was on a plane.

I plan to drive to Seattle "next time" for the exact same reasons and circumstances.  Plus I can get $0.505 per mile reimbursement which not counting wear and tear on the car means I actually make money - or at least defray the license and insurance costs of now having a newer hi-mpg car. rolleyes

As far as time difference goes: From here it is over an hour to the airport and you are "supposed" to be there 2hrs before the flight departs.  So there is 3hrs and 50 miles (100 miles round trip) in the wrong direction.  Then there is almost always a layover in Portland.  The bottom line is that it is only about twice a long to drive as to fly, and driving I can go on my own schedule.
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

BridgeRunner

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 4,845
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2008, 08:20:40 AM »
  The bottom line is that it is only about twice a long to drive as to fly, and driving I can go on my own schedule.

Plus, tunes.  smiley

Scout26

  • I'm a leaf on the wind.
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 25,997
  • I spent a week in that town one night....
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2008, 08:27:51 AM »
I read this week where the TSA all got issued badges................chris3
I saw that too. Seems that the TSA weenies have been complaining that they get no respect. No doubt issuing them badges and blue uniforms will improve that situation.

They'll be upgraded to the black Hugo Boss unforms with the snazzy red armbands real soon.  police angry
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
Bless the women and children who firm our hands.
Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
for the motherland.

Tallpine

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,172
  • Grumpy Old Grandpa
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2008, 09:00:28 AM »
  The bottom line is that it is only about twice a long to drive as to fly, and driving I can go on my own schedule.

Plus, tunes.  smiley

Irish music.  Bruadain Ceilteach    smiley

And maybe take along some Ian Tyson, too Wink
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

ilbob

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,546
    • Bob's blog
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2008, 09:34:01 AM »
I read this week where the TSA all got issued badges................chris3
I saw that too. Seems that the TSA weenies have been complaining that they get no respect. No doubt issuing them badges and blue uniforms will improve that situation.

They'll be upgraded to the black Hugo Boss unforms with the snazzy red armbands real soon.  police angry

if the blue uniforms and silly badges don't work, perhaps this will.




or maybe this one.


bob

Disclaimers: I am not a lawyer, cop, soldier, gunsmith, politician, plumber, electrician, or a professional practitioner of many of the other things I comment on in this forum.

The Annoyed Man

  • New Member
  • Posts: 1
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2008, 12:29:02 PM »
They are also planning new, more authoritative badges and uniforms because they don't feel that people respect their authority enough.

Ha!

http://willtoexist.com/tsa-wants-your-respect_1192/

erictank

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,410
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2008, 12:54:06 PM »
I read this week where the TSA all got issued badges................chris3
I saw that too. Seems that the TSA weenies have been complaining that they get no respect. No doubt issuing them badges and blue uniforms will improve that situation.

They'll be upgraded to the black Hugo Boss unforms with the snazzy red armbands real soon.  police angry

if the blue uniforms and silly badges don't work, perhaps this will.




or maybe this one.




Hey-HEY!!!  No need to get nasty there, that's MY uniform! 

 grin

ETA: The SECOND picture, that is, not the first one.  Thought I'd better specify that...

Manedwolf

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14,516
Re: The latest TSA idiocy
« Reply #24 on: June 19, 2008, 01:15:54 PM »
They are also planning new, more authoritative badges and uniforms because they don't feel that people respect their authority enough.

Ha!

http://willtoexist.com/tsa-wants-your-respect_1192/

So they can look like the guy with the handcuffs and a cheap police uniform standing around the exit of big-box stores.